Vibration - What are the Main Sources?

@oldhvymec

So, "No it’s not complex" in your second sentence, and "Complex yes" in your last sentence. Who can argue with that?

Guess you’re prepared to explain electronic oscillation? Those dumb engineers using complex numbers - what a bunch of dummies. Or maybe you could simplify Cox and D’Antonio (Acoustic Absorbers and Diffusers) down to a few sentences? Or how about the modes of vibration in a square sheet, and what to do about it (without differential equations, of course)?

I’m in awe, Oldhvymec.

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Oh no it's to way to complex for me. As for the rest of the mumbo jumbo your blathering. Equate this.. Be quiet you might learn something..

My oscillator tells me your education has limited your ability to understand the simplest of things..

Life is very easy, folks like you just make it "difficult". Engineer that bucko! As far as dummies, yea I've worked with a few engineers that were really intelligent, they always listen to the ol mechanic IF they want to learn.

Now if we want to see what YOU'VE read, applied and is a tried and true method, WITHOUT the impressive mumbo jumbo verbiage "I'M an Engineer" chest thumpin'" crap. TRY that approach other than implying WE'RE to FU@KIN' stupid to understand. BUT you some how did..

Complex numbers.. LOL you just can't help yourself.. Most folks use their toes TOO, DUMMY. I know you won a local science fair in the 4th grade, it's been down hill ever since.

"I'm in AWE", good I do that to people, often from what I hear.

If there were any insults implied or otherwise that I may have missed, may I return them to the person they came from.. My plate is way to full of wonderful compliments, no room for jealousy ..

Please WASH your hand before leaving the Doctors office, you've gotten your first vaccination for "I'm smarter than you complex". Hopefully it takes..

I've used inner tubes on heavy bass bins on concrete. It really effected the way the TT worked.. Radio stations by the freeway trick.

Over air the tube get craft foam blocks put them in the corners under the subs box. THEN let some air out until it just rest on the craft blocks.

I isolate, multi springs in holders and some type of soft silicone platforms. Adding weight works. Wrapping a quiet brick vs a noisy one help too. 

For "Rack mount" spring load between components, that works very nice. It adds load but not to much weight..

There are some VERY effective low cost solution to vibration control, how they do look vs how they should look is a different story.. 

There is some easy effective more expensive alternatives to.
Great looking, easy to install, easy to adjust and very effective is appealing.

Regards

Vibration is not a simple topic. It is far too complex for this forum. IMO

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Well where should it be discussed? No it's not complex, no you don't need a degree, no it's not hard to learn. 

To complex for this forum.. To complex for some I'm sure. But so is plugging in two pieces of gear..  Complex to one is as natural as breathing to another..

To complex? WOW I've never hear that one. Complex yes but TO COMPLEX... :-)

Regards

MC provides good information as usual. But what is he talking about in the rest of his comments? Airing personal grievances, paranoia? It has nothing to do with the subject matter in this thread.

Anybody else confused and tired of reading it throughout the forum?

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You’re doing great MC. If I got a beef, your the first to know it, not the last.

What's the deal with the letter to the work place or board of whatever. WTF that ain't cool AT ALL!!

I’m not confused and I’m not tired of reading it on the forums. Consistency counts!!

SPRINGS work, period.. It Smears NOTHING.. Try it.. It’s very inexpensive. One up from there is to dampen the spring itself spray them with a flexible coating or insert a gummy puffer inside the spring. One up from there is to dampen the top and base on either end of the spring, (a pod). This is not NEW, it has been around a LONG LONG time.

Horse and buggy and blacksmith come to mind..

It’s just been refined to use (with great success) on stereo gear.. The information has been out there for a long time. The way they look cost money... They way they work cost some money. :-)

Regards

I got disappeared.

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Me too..

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If the tweeter and woofer did not move, you would have one quiet speaker!

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There is just mids and highs being used in my monitors, and they are small planars and ribbons in a 425 # HDF cabinet. There’s not much moving, especially the cabinet, the forward baffle has a convex taper from 12.5 to less than 6" wide.

It doesn’t even collect distortion very well.
I still isolate the cabinet from the floor and don’t use the bass section at all. Haven’t for years.. BASS belongs in another cabinet.. Subs are already in their own cabinet.

How do you mechanically time align bass drivers in the same cabinet as the mids and highs.. You can’t... At least I never could.. Sub frequencies forget it... they are WAY out of alignment with the main monitors, much less the whole vibration thing..

Regards

Nobody “takes” vibrations out of cabinets. Cabinets are designed to resist resonances, and by coupling them to a large mass (read, the floor) their propensity to resonate is further reduced.

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It's called spectrial decay. And coupling speakers to anything only drains the vibration to somewhere else.

Removing the bass drivers from the cabinet all together is the best solution. Small planars and ribbons are not known to be big contributors to vibration or collectors of distortion.. They disappear pretty easy..

BUT if you can't remove or don't want to remove the bass from the cabinet, HEAVY dense construction, sound coat and  dampening applied inside helps a lot. A narrow front baffle and complete decoupling from the floor, or as much as possible really helps. Spikes are the worst, Air is the best, everything else is a compromise. Even hanging a speaker is better. Actually works very well, spring hangers..

BUT 425 pounds speakers don't "Hang" well.. I had a pair at 1200 lbs each, you better decouple expensive ribbons.. from vibrating. You'll spend half your life repairing them or worse yet PAYING someone to repair them.. Strathearns and EMT sure didn't like vibration. They didn't even like being shipped anywhere.. Fragile!!

Regards

Let me say it a different way. The cabinets ability to get rid of vibration.

How fast 
and
How much.

You can control certain frequencies to the structure via sound coat and or dampening structurally. Drivers themselves can have dampening material added to the basket web. 

ALL these thing INCREASE decay rates on materials used. If I was measuring a room for decay rates that's different. After the fact is almost TOO late..

Your plot is "Cumulative", I'm referencing just materials and a way to increase decay rates and stop the (vibration) frequencies we are tracking from ever happening to begin with.. Different approach.. Destructive Harmonic and reduction is what mechanics do.. At least as a hydraulics and drive train guy.. The same approach to sound is not to far off. 

It's more of a "Stay out of trouble" vs "Get out of trouble" approach..

Box design 101 if you really want to know..

Before the approach was "Single box cram it in there" It cost money to have separate structures. You see it all the time now with DBA and Swarm. GREAT sound can't come from one structure. I say it can't come from one structure per side either. Even modular SAT units like Wilson and quite a few others rely on delay via DSP or their version of it.. Call it what you want.. 

Midbass columns and Monitors are separate.

How can you possibly align the the acoustic centers of a MB to work in the same cabinet as the Mids and Highs.. If anybody says they can get it to measure right, they are messing with the mic position.. simple as that..
I've seen people claiming to fix other peoples speakers for a long time. Some of the CRAP I've seen. 

Send ME, YOUR speakers to measure in my work shop and I'll fix them for you..  You got to be kidding me!!

Pretty ballsy if you ask me..

I say send me anyone's speakers and let me measure them in my shop.. LOL

Back yard is better.. BUT I promise I could find fault, or make adjustments some would prefer. Speaker building is FAR from being written in stone by one builders preference.. 

Especially production speakers vs 50 to 100 pairs ever made in mom and pop shops.. There is a few like that, cabinet shops.. 

Regards

190 lbs on points will move, that is way to light.. Add 200-250 to the top, then on springs...Mass load then spring load!! Getting close now..

Serious BASS in my shop. A speaker on spikes with any width to any side would be dancing across the floor.. Especially a wide front baffle. A round, ocular or convex tapered baffle design would work. A telephone pole would work..

I was tinkering yesterday on a pair of 24x24x60 bass boxed without drivers they are 220 or so..
125 lbs in drivers 350 or more.. Then load the 2" top shelf with 200 lbs or so. STILL on springs...

I was rethinking 21" HE subs with 2 18" passives. I want to try Daytons new 21" subs for the shop..
REAL BAD!! Get ready for Halloween... 

Regards