Velodyne DD15 - worth repairing the plate amp?

No. I sent out the amp for repair to NJ. 

I have not connected the DD to a computer (waiting for amp to be returned from repair). Will then look into the software, potential update and how to use the software, microphone, etc. 

So how do I use the provided measuring (velodyne) microphone if not via computer?

Thanks, I need to read the manual (already downlaoded a while ago). So the DD-15 HAS computer connection. Do I have a remote (need to check) for the DD-15? If so, hope I did not misplace it somehow.

Replacing the plate amp (or using external amp as I currently do) means NOT having the 'SERVO' control feature the Velodyne was/is famous for. I would assume that this is part of the high regard and performance those Velodyne are known for in comparison to 'lesser' subs. Plus from a budget standpoint: what do you get for say $500 budget? A plate (or external amp) vs a repaired Velodyne with Servo Control/room accoustic. 

Has anyone compared 'just amp' vs 'Velodyne control/amp' ? Maybe the DD15 has a setting 'straight/direct', basically just using the amp and bypassing the Velodyne servo feature?

mijostyn interesting but irrelevant in this context. Push pull has been around long before the term balanced force has been coined. 

Goood to know. Looking forward (hopefully soon) to get plate amp back from EBC and do a comparison switch: Audessy with external class H amp vs built in Velodyne optimization and amp. 

What settings on the receiver do I need to choose when running Audessy for 5.1 (on the 5 and not the 0.1)?

jasonbourne71 what to get 'more recent' that is better for under $800 (repaired value of DD-15)?

erik_squires: only ship the very light (Class D) plate amp, 5 lb or so. 

musicaddict "take over the DD-15" based on quality INCLUDING price? Even the 12" SB-2000 (used they start around $750 or same 'value' as I assign to my repaird DD-15). 

other commenors: value/budget for decision making: $800 ($500 repair + $300 residual value). 13" SB-3000 start at $900 used. The 13.5" SV4000 starts $1,500

Also: ideally needs to move some air if I want to use in main system (VERY large volume room (3 story room, open to hallway, dining, foyer, hallway, kitchen), like my current Dayton UM18-22 18". Not sure if tiny 12" or 13" (SB-2000, SB-3000) have enough stroke, or they would be relegated to the normal room 2nd system. 

jafant "If you are using this Sub(DD 15)  in a H/T set-up, yes repair it. Otherwise move on to a REL for a Stereo system set-up." What is a REL? 

I am currently using my 18" DAyton UM18-22 in sealed box with Lt1300 external plate amp in super large room (with B&W Nautilus 804 as fronts) for stereo, SACD and H/T. The Velodyne would either supplement (? not sure if possible and/or feasable to run 2 different subs) or be used in 2nd system (normal room size) for stereo and SACD.

oddiofyl I have quote from EBC; they would be the one I sent the amp to for repair if going that route.

Just not sure how good the DD-15 compared to others/modern in used condition and value range. 

asvjerry see 2nd option above, but no feedback control (and no auto on/off, and no crossover control beyond what receiver allows). 

Another plate with sufficient power: probably better to repair the existing for about $400 (shipping, taxes incl). Luckily, those class D are light. 

Converting to passive is super easy. Currently have the plate amp out, found one discolored area that likely is the culprit (incoming power module).

jafant If a "REL" is another sub, what REL can I get for $800 that competes well with the DD-15 (in big room setup and/or normal room setup)?

mofojo Yup:

Option 1: Repair (invest $500), total value $800-$900

Option 2: that is my 2nd option. Actually have two Class D on hand. Connect directly to sub out of receiver. But then do NOT have the Velodyne 'feedback control', and not sure how much that contributes. "invest" $300. 

Option 3: sell DD-15 with defective amp as is (including Velodyne measuring microphone and rest of original acessories kit), going rate $300-400 or so. Replace with 'modern' sub $800 budget. 

asvjerry repair of original is probably cheaper than replacement plate amp of similar power.

Running as passive is super easy. I have plate amp out and found discolored area on incoming power board, likely culprit. 

I am running my Dayton UM18-22 with external plate amp in housing I made. 

External Class D power amp option is missing crossover frequency adjustment aside from what receiver offers, and no 'auto on/off'. 

dweller I have the plate amp out. Fuses good. Power on other side. Some discoloration on input power module (assumed culprit). No loose wires, speaker connected and works. Since fuses are good and no pop or any other noise when turning on, assume output stage of power supply (or auto on feature or similar) damaged. = no simple (enough for me) fix. Could take another closer look and probe for secondary power.... or put in box and ship to EBC.

fpomposo I have a hard time envisioning a competitive sub for say the budget to repair/retain the DD-15 ($800). I don't like the complexity (no adj crossover frequency aside from what receiver offers (often only 50Hz; I run B&W Nautilus 804 as 'small' front speakers, so 50Hz is ok but certainly not 80Hz that some receivers have as lowest) and inconvenience (no auto on/off) of running the DD-15 passive with standalone Class D (but have 2 on hand). 

Unfortuantely, I have never had the chance to listen to the DD-15 in current large room setup or even compare to my 18" Dayton drive by LT1300 amp. I probably should close up the Velodyno and run/test with Class D connected to receiver sub out, see how it does. If that is already any good, then I assume together with repaired plate amp and Velonyne control would be even better, and certainly worth the $400 or so repair. 

How does used SVS SB-2000 compare to (repaired) Velodyne DD-15?

motown-l there is only one decent sub pate amp out there that is suitable to drive a large sub: Dayton Audio SPA1000 (1000W with DSP?. This is $600 (shipped/tax). I am not sure how much the ’smart’ electronics of the DD-15 amp contribute (and the microphone/measuring setup that came with) which I would loose going to a simple amp. Even the (too weak IMO) SPA500 costs $400 (lowest on ebay, same as DD-15 repair), but don’t know how it compares with Velodyne amp and if it has ’software’, feedback control, etc. It has DSP.

whart Those Class D plate amps with 'electronic' (can't think of the term) power supplies (without the huge/heavy transformers and coolers) are very light and cheap to ship. My LT1300 plate amp is 40 lbs, this one is maybe 5 lbs. 

mijostyn Yes, the single mass accel/decel of the driver's mass 'moves' the sub. But the push/push also causes movement (flexing the outside walls of the enclosure) in the same way. So also imperfect.

Not relevant, because this post is not about the best subwoofer design principle, but if the $400 repair of a DD-15 is a better investment and creates a better result compared to a similar budget ($800 total investement) other solutions. And how well a vintage 2008 DD-15 compares to sub $1000 new technology subs. 

crustycoot Have quote from EBC NJ, but long wait (currently as short as 6 weeks, but ’warning’ is "up to 12 weeks". Their cost $320 (incl return shipping,excl tax and outbound shipping), $360 total. Amp Man $350 plus tax plus outbound shipping ($400 total).

Looks like the 2 small caps on the incoming power board leaked out. Not sure if other components got damaged by it, or if only the 2 caps need to be replaced, or maybe the entire small board. 

https://drive.google.com/file/d/18LVto77k__xPTrGlQ4Q3esq5PzzkAk5a/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1I1TsCafd4P1z3w5DEDdw_B3MWv48PMd3/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1ZKaSQHnQC_jouzuFT03W9LzfpeVrpU_S/view?usp=sharing, https://drive.google.com/file/d/1cR_o3tYEfWqLq3c8pqSGbQOu3eIMXhYL/view?usp=sharing

rwwear is it possible (photos above) that the 2 small leaked caps in the incoming small power board are the issue? $370 for NEW (??) amp would certainly be the way to go; will contact them how much shipping within Germany is (and then see if I can arrange overseas with my suppliers/contacts). 

Thanks rwwear. Paul from EBC (thank you for replying !!!) commented regarding the suspicious caps

"they are not leaked. it is a glue the manufacture used to hold them in place. it degraded over the time and became cranchy but should not be an issue.does it have video menu when you connect it to a tv/monitor?". 

Next, I will make a plate to fill the plate amp hole, get one of my class D amps and hook up to sub out of receiver and connect the Velodyne to the amp. See how it sounds.

Will also try if I can (as Paul suggests) to hook up to a TV/monitor. 

My Eureka moment actually came when I selected 'small' for my front speakers (even so they are BIG floor standing speakers) and send everything below 50 to the sub. Not sure WHY it sound SO MUCH better, likely because the receiver does not have to deal with all the heavy lifting for the low octaves. Now I even run my Nautilus 804 as 'small',  the 18" in sealed enclosure driven by LT1300 (ICE design) sub amp does the heavy lifting. 

So not just software, but associated "plus" hardware = not applicable for DD15.

So if fixed, get the new "plus" software for the 'non plus' DD?

Package the plate amp up and shipping to EBC (NJ) today. Made a seal plate (not finished) and will run the sub with Behringer EP2000 direct from sub out of receiver until the Velodyne amp comes back. 

I think you misunderstood: The Behringer (1000W or so into 8 ohm, 2000 into 4 ohm) external amp is driving the 15" Velodyne, signal to Behringer is the sub out from the receiver (and using the receivers low pass). Pretty sure the Behring can provide enough steam to drive the DD15 in its sealed enclosure.

Wondering if someone ever measured the DD15 WITHOUT the software/control hardware (just 'as is'). Looks like a 3 cu*ft enclosure, so figure roll off should start fairly high (at least 30 Hz?).

WayTooMuchStuff: Will run it as passive with external amp until EBC sends the amp back. Put the back plate on, need to seal up (silicone) the speaker cable pass through hole. Then get the Class D amp and plug it in, see what happens. 

rwwear: this is what I actually have 'sitting on the shelf', reserved for my 'resurrection project Infinity Quantum 2'. Goal is to tri amp (feed the 2 coils of the Watkins woofer with class D, low/mid class A/B, high/EMIT with tube or class A) using active crossover, for which I bought (never unpacked!) the MiniDSP 2x4HD. No idea how it works, or how to use it as a low path for the Velodyne. 

Now an unrelated question: my main system (audio, TV) is in an extremely larger volume room (2 1/2 stories high, open on 2 sides to other 2 1/2 story foyer, and one story dining room and kitchen (guessing 1800 sqft plus big volume). I use Dayton UM 18-22 in sealed enclosure driven by LT1300 (taken from Elemental Design A7-450 sub). 

When the Velodyne amp comes back, is it possible to ADD it to the main system and pair it with the Dayton UM 18-22?

Or is it not a good idea to pair a 'controlled' (Velodyne, sealed) sub with an 'uncontrolled' sealed. 

Or worse, pairing two different (any) subs?

Yes, EBC (Matt) already received the amp. 
I made a back plate (with speaker cable pass through) to seal up the enclosure (RTV silicone around the speaker cable, used existing screws). RTV should be hard now, so will test tonight if enclosure 'holds air' (enough). Also brought one of by Class D amps up, so (assuming rain day tomorrow) will hook it up and test. Plan to run Audicy with the receiver and sub connected for initial setup, then dial in sub volume a bit more (but cannot change crossover frequency). 

So, did a quick temp hookup. QSC CX702 (one channel) fed from sub out (cross over at 50 Hz) to passive Velodyne DD-15. 

Very tight. 

Surprised: The QSC (class H) driving 1 channel only has clipping light coming on at higher (not crazy, but loud) listening levels. 

Does someone know what impedance the Velodyne driver has? 4 Ohm?

Assume the driver is not 2 ohm, I will try bridged mode (and make some better cable connections, very sketchy right now for the quick trial setup). 

If so, I am using all of the QSC's 825 Watt! 

8 Ohms:
425 W per Channel (Full Range, 0.03% THD)
4 Ohms:
700 W per Channel (Full Range, 0.05% THD)
8 Ohms:
475 W per Channel (1 kHz, 1% THD)
4 Ohms:
825 W per Channel (1 kHz, 1% THD)
2 Ohms:
1200 W per Channel (1 kHz, 1% THD)
16 Ohms:
850 W Bridged (Full Range, 0.1% THD)
8 Ohms:
1500 W Bridged (Full Range, 0.1% THD)
4 Ohms / 8 Ohms:
2400 W Bridged (1 kHz, 1% THD)

Yes, i need to measure the woofer. 12 ohm sound VERY strange though.

4.0 ohm measured. 

Running the Qsc in bridge now, works well. 

Not as earth shaking as my Dayton UM18-22 in 4 cuft sealed (driven by external plate amp from Elemental Design A7-450). But that is an 18" and a larger cabinet. Very 'tight' bass. Still need to do more listening, exploring (and get cable situation/connectors resolved; trying to maintain the existing large/small femal space, but don't have matching male ones; and need to make proper (big, now that I have seen 800-1000w peak (based on 'clipping' light on amp) going into the sub, that is quite some ampere flowing!). I expect the DEEP section to further improve with the Velodyne control software/hardware once the amp is back. 

rwwear: what does it do? similar to what audyssey does (measure room sound, make correction in time and equalizing frequencies, automatically)? 

How good is my Audyssey built into my receiver setting up the sub in my room?

When using the built in plate amp, should I set up with Velodyne hardware/software (and how to disable Audissey/Receiver for the sub only) or switch off Velodyne and run full Audyssey? Or both. I need/want to run Audyssey for the other channels (I do listen to SACD and Stereo). Receiver on my office system (where DD15 currently is used) is my little Onkyo TX-SR353, which uses AccuEQ:

Onkyo TX-SR353 comes with AccuEQ room correction system and includes the calibration microphone.

• AccuEQ: First, AccuEQ detects the presence of speakers and evaluates the impedance of each. Next, it pinpoints their distance relative to the main listening position using the mic and sets suitable sound-pressure levels. Then it selects the optimal crossover frequency so that deeper bass rolls smoothly off to the subwoofer. Finally, AccuEQ performs frequency response equalization based on room-acoustic and speaker data collected via microphone. The sound-field is now tailored around the listening position, resulting in a more immersive and realistic in-film experience.

I need to read up on how Velodyne's software/hardware works. Does it have an equalizer? How does it measure the movement of the speaker cone or how does the feedback control work? Or what crossover frequency the Velodyne uses (fixed? or adjustable based on measurement with their mic of in room accustics)?

Currently driving it with an external class H brute, 'no controlled'. Does the job. Surprised how much amps it sucks in. Switched the class D to mono bridge mode to stay out of the first red clipping light flickering at high volume. Amp is QSC 702. Assuming the Velodyne is 4 ohm, the clipping light (assuming 1% THD) should come on at way over 1000 W (see specs below). So the Velodyne really wants to be FED: 

I often half insert the screws back in, push/pull them to the side (to jam) and apply lifting force to seperate the seal tape from the wood.

If nothing works: put 2 wood screws (in new holes, small pre drill but not all the way through) in. 

Maybe someone has a side by side comparision of the modern SVS SB-2000 and the Velodyne DD15?

HSU was also mentioned. and maybe the sealed SVS SB-3000 is a better comparison to the DD15.

If ported is tolerated, then the PB-3000 and HSU VTF-3 may fall into the ($1,000, used) category. HSU 15 looks seriously (way too) big, approaching the size of my 4.0 ft3 sealed 18" on the main system. 

Who has (no or in the past) tested (incl published tests) the DD15 against - old or new - subs in the (new or used) price range? 

What are strong pionts? What are weaknesses?