I actually auditioned the Pass Labs 600.5 before I bought my McIntosh MC601 and I wasn't to happy with them. |
I think you will be very happy with the Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum / Vandersteen 2ce SigII combination. |
Update: I replaced my two MC2100 with a pair of McIntosh MC601 monoblock (600w) first 200 hours was tap at 8ohm then switched to 4ohms. I could not hear any difference maybe due to McIntosh being an autoformer. Does this sound about right? |
Update: I replaced my two McIntosh MC2100 (220 watts mono) to a pair of brand new McIntosh MC601 monoblock (600 watts). First two hundred hours my 2CE Sig II was at 8 ohms tap then now, moved it to 4 ohms tap. I have not notice much difference yet except the volume level went a little lower.
I'll keep listening and see if I can hear any diff. by using the 4 ohm tap. |
I just moved my Vandersteen 2CE Sig II from 8ohm tap to 4ohm tap of my McIntosh MC2100, the bass got tighter and sounded better. I'm going to leave it at 4ohm since the Vadersteen manuals says, 7ohm nominal and 4ohm minimum. |
I am contemplating changing the taps on Cronus Magnum over to 4ohm. Currently running at 8, but want to see how it sounds. I'm certain the Vandy's can handle it and it shouldn't be a problem on the Rogue. Anybody else done this? How's the sound? What should I listen for?
Thanks. |
The plumbob is a good place to start from. |
John I've done the plumbob string per Vandersteen manual but, the laser and bubble level is more accurate. |
A plumbob,string, and the well written Vandy owners manual is also a good place to start for tiltback.
JohnnyR |
Mike, toe in is really something that's subjective. It depends on how you want the soundstage presented. Obviously, the more toe in you have, the tighter and more narrow the stage. The best way to start is to get the speakers exactly matched as far as distance from your seat and leave them facing straight ahead, no toe in. Then just make little changes in angle, maybe half an inch at a time and really listen for the focus of the stage. Use something where you can hear individual instruments and see how the placement of those seem to change as you change the toe in. It is very important to make sure that your speaks are perfectly matched though. be diligent with your measurements. This can take a while and I've never found a hard and fast way of doing it. It took me two months of mucking around with even a pair of Polk RTi-7s that I had and finally found what I thought worked. It's really just up to how you want it to sound and taking the time to listen to the changes that you're making. Best of luck! |
Curtis, I have the Vandersteen 2CE Signature II. My speakers are 6 feet apart, I have the tilt dialed in as per Audioconnections instruction but, the toes is the only thing I have to do. Thanks. |
Miketuason, you must excuse me as I'm listening to Naked by the Talking Heads, so I may go out there...
Toe in is a bitch. I have no idea what your speaks are and how they're placed.
This process is about matching the toe-in of a PAIR of speakers. Requirements: Tape measure. laser pointer/ level. Toe in one speaker (for this, we'll start with the right speaker). Place the laser on the front of the speaker (face), aimed at the other (left) speaker. Measure where the laser lands on the side of the left cab. Move the laser to the front of the other (left) speaker. Match the measurement from before. This won't help you find toe for your listening position, but will match your speaks.
You'll need to play with the toe as to what sounds best for your listening position, but this technique will match your system.
Best of luck Miketuason. |
Curtis, I understand now how to adjust the tilt, thanks. Now how do you adjust the toe-in, is it pretty much the same thing, leave the laser light on the center-top of the speaker then slowly turn them in until the light lands on the center of you listening chair or where your head would be? |
Great trick JohnnyR. I've done something similar, but never quite that precise. I'll give it a try and let you know.
Thanks! |
Curtisbaby
His turntable will be back in action soon.
We are installing a new head shell and cartridge.
((As far as the laser tilt back goes, what's your process?))
Simple bubble level, adjust front spikes for proper side to side. Get 2 post it notes on the wall behind your listening chair.
Place the laser on top of each Vandersteen speaker aiming toward post it notes, draw a circle with a sharpie pen where the laser lands, adjust each back spike so that each speaker has exact tilt on target.
Then listen at normal height, then slouch lower in chair, and then listen sitting on a pillow.
One of the 3 positions will be
very obvious.
Last part adjust both speakers to you normal seating position.
Cheers JohnnyR |
Sounds like a great system that is only lacking vinyl! Those happen to be almost the exact dimensions of my room, but because of the layout I have to go on the long wall with my system. As far as the laser tiltback goes, what's your process? I've got both a laser Leica disto that I use for placement and toe and a laser/ bubble level for side tilt. I was just going to use a plumb bob to measure tilt back. Is there a better way? Unless you don't want to give away secrets... Ha!
Thanks Johnny |
Today we installed a Pr of Vandersteen 2CE Sig 2s a Rogue
Cronus Mag w/ KT 120s fed by a Mac Book Pro Rega Dac
El basic Kimber Tonik double Bi wire Sand in bases side tilt checked and laser tiltbacked on both speakers in a 13.5 by 23 by 8 room we got height six ft above the speakers,superb extension and the amp crused nicly.
JohnnyR |
Audiocon, Oh yeah. I've got about half a bag of dry mason's sand left from an isolation table that I built all ready to go. Thanks. |
Make sure you also fill the lower metal bases with dry sand
available at toy r us. |
Thanks for all the great info guys. You really know your Vandy's. I'm freaking ecstatic. Their sitting in the box at home as I'm flying to Capetown for two weeks to finish a work project. Have to make sure I spend enough time with the wife when I get home before getting down to business. I'll let you know what I think when everything's got 20 or 30 hrs on it. Thanks again. I'm positive I made the right choice now. |
Listen to John @ Audio Connection. The laser tilt back and side bubble level treatment that he did on my 3ASigs was 'Major". Thank you Captain. |
Hi Mike
I wouldnt sweat it....
while there is a nice improvment,it looks like you have
yours operating in top order.
Most folks that have good placement, proper set up,
such as laser tilt back and side to side buble level will be too busy enjoying the music. |
Having used a pair of 1Bs for years (sold after refurbishing...too popular with the cats) I can say they KICK ASS. Used 'em with various amps and they were (and certainly are) amazing for the money. The "small baffle" idea for both the tweeter and woofer, along with the "time aligned" arrangement is simply perfect...along with the transmission loading of the woofer. My only quibble is you can't easily take the covers off and look at stuff. I've known a few people with various Model 2s, including a well regarded jazz sax dude/tube freak, and they all love 'em. Classics...legends...icons... |
Did it make a big different from the previous mids and tweeters? I should have waited for the new Sig II before I bought mine, oh well! |
Miketuason thanks for your post
((Patented "reflection-free" mid range drivers, although this is probably only used in model 3A and up....))
The New Vandersteen 2CE Sig II now features the
Patented "reflection-free" mid range drivers,and tweeter
from the Five as.
JohnnyR |
Some facts about Vandersteen Speakers
Vandersteen was one of the first in the industry to start using FFT (Fast Fourier Transform) Computer Analyzer, originally developed for aerospace industry
Cost cutting in cabinets while making audible performance top priority
Careful selection of materials for all drivers, critical damping in all areas in drivers and cabinets
Patented "reflection-free" midrange drivers, although this is probably only used in model 3A and up....
All crossovers are hand soldered and tested to make sure there's less than 0.1dB deviation to the reference
Drivers are matched to within 0.1dB tolerance
Crossovers are hand tweaked and speakers measured in anechoic chamber to make sure they perform as well as the reference
Baffles are as small as possible to reduce/eliminate diffraction => improves imaging
FFT is employed to find optimal size, shape and thickness of different parts of the enclosure
+++ probably much more that I don't know about..... |
I've heard the same thing Anonymoustao. Very excited to set them up soon! Got the dry sand waiting to fill the stands! |
"you can place a pair of steen,s in a room and easily get good sound....
With a little TLC and reading the well written owners manual you get the magic the speaker is capable of. As with any great speaker, placement, vertical alignement side to side level precise for both speakers, etc
JohnnyR |
Thanks for the feedback. I've really enjoyed the Cronus Magnum with the Martin Logans in the room I've got setup. Mt10425, sorry to hear about your luck with them.
Adam18, sounds like it worked for you. I'm getting the 2ce's for a good enough deal that I think I can afford to listen for a while and if I don't like it, They're not that hard to sell.
Thanks again, guys. |
My wife and I listened at length to a Rogue Magnum and 1Cs at a friend's audio salon (and home). The combination provided nothing more than background music. We went looking to upgrade from my Sophia Baby and REALLY wanted to like a Rogue amp. The Magnam and Dynaudio bookshelves was a better match, but again, nothing to write home about. I'm no longer interested in Rogue amps. I also am confused by the gushing of Vandersteen. I've also heard Vandys with MacIntosh amps. Good sounding, but... |
The Rogue Cronus Magnum and Vandersteen 2ce Sig II's are two of the best buys in audio. I've owned that particular combination, with the KT90s, and it was excellent. You should get a lot of fatigue-free listening enjoyment out of them, and both companies provide excellent customer service. |
My combination of the Rogue Cronus (non-Magnum) and Vandersteen 1C's was sublime ..... a beautiful musical presentation which I enjoyed for many years. I have since upgraded my speakers to the Revel F-12's which has added even more to my enjoyment of my music. Rogue Audio and Vandersteen match really well together .... the Cronus Magnum and Vandy 2Ce Sig II's should be very nice playmates. Good Luck and Happy Listening ! |
