Using tube amp with electrostatic speakers.


Moons ago I started similar discussions and thought I had been given enough good advice not to approach the subject again. Here goes anyway. I've used Martin Logan electrostats for well over 30 years with quite a few different amps but have recently switched to a tube amp and dynamic speakers with which I am very satisfied.  It consists of the Cary Rocket 88R amp and Serie Reference 3 speakers. 

My brother was visiting last week and was so impressed with the sound that he decided that he might want to try a tube amp also (probably the same one as mine).  However, he is using a pair of SL3's that I gave him years ago and I'm concerned primarily about the current requirements of the Martin Logans as well as other concerns that I'm not thinking of.  I don't want him spending money on something that may not bring him improved sound so would appreciate more advice to pass on to him.  He currently uses a Rogue Audio SS amp with his SL3 speakers and, to me, it sounds very good. 
jimbreit
I power my ML Electromotion ESLs with a Primaluna Dialogue Premium power amp (not the HP model) with KT-150 tubes (24 watts triode mode and 48w ultralinear) and it sounds great and I prefer triode mode. I also use the same amp to drive a pair of Spendor S2/3s (8ohm) and they sound great too. I don't care much about the tech specs, i just try the different ohm taps on the amp and whatever sounds best with the rest of my system is what I use. Sound is full, robust, detailed, natural, and I often get goosebumps. For me it is all about the music, but I like learning about the equipment, to a certain extent!! Lol. Interesting discussion, thank you!

One data point.

I use Martin Logan CLS (original) in one system and although I have auditioned tube amps with them, I have found that solid state amps with good power supplies work by far the best.  Mine are run with a stereo Classe DR3 VHC (a whopping 45 watts).

Not saying that the magic tube amp isn't out there, just that I haven't found it.
When I read all of the responses saying that tube amps will have problems driving Martin Logan speakers, I just had to make my first post on Audiogon.

I have 2 Audio Research VT100 Mk IIs bi-amping a pair of Martin Logan SL3s. These speakers have never sounded better. The sound is organic and natural sounding. If the recording has a lot of spacial information and depth, it is revealed in the presentation. If the recording is flat, that too is revealed. Cymbals sound the way they should. Vocals, including female, just sound right.

Before bi-amping the SL3s, I had one VT100 amp. The sound was similar but there was less depth and the stage wasn’t as wide. Also, large orchestral works just didn’t have the presence that they should have. This was the reason for a second amp. NOTE: I do not listen at high volume levels. The stereo is in a loft so the left and right speaker are not presented with the same wall configuration which just messes up the stage width and depth at high volumes. Plus, I want to be able to listen to my stereo for many years. ;)

BTW, my pre-amp is also tube based.

Recently, I wanted to get away from two amps and tubes. I read a lot about Pass Labs amps and purchased an X350.5. I liked some of what it did but ultimately the sound was just unnatural with overblown bass, etched highs and an odd midrange. Every time, I switch back to my VT100s, I found that I enjoyed the music more. I returned the Pass Labs amp.

I am now looking for a more powerful tube based amp so I can go to a single amp.

My experience for what it's worth.


Long time ML user since 1979. I've owned SL3's, Aries i's, ReQuests, CLS,  Monolith III's, and now Theos. 

I've been on Audiogon since 1997. There's always been a myth that ML's are "harder to drive." I drove SL3's with a lowly 35 watt Prima Luna. I drove CLS to satisfying levels with an 8 watt SET amp! Currently I'm using a Dennis Had Inspire firebottle KT88 SET to power Theos. 

Each individual has different audio needs. We each listen differently. I listen to jazz, in a smaller room now. But even when I had a larger room I drove ML's to very satisfying levels with Manley 450 mono's. In fact, I've never had a more satisfying audio experience than pushing a pair of CLS' with those Manley's. 

I'm big on tube amps for ML's....and I sewed my audio teeth on Pass, Threshold, Plinius, and too many other amps to mention.

It's not a one size fits all audio world. What works for me won't necessarily work for you. And that's as it should be. 

If I had a friend with a pair of SL3's I'd be wondering more about how much longer are those panels going to last, as that speaker went out of service in 2002?
McIntosh equipment and ML’s are both sold by the same retailers, is that the reason for the question? My friend was a huge, enthusiastic McIntosh dealer until they went with Magnolia/Best Buy. Due to his kindness I have tried various McIntosh amps on various electrostatics. I know that the McIntosh amps are not a good match for (full-range) electrostatics beginning with QUADs. The OP should find out if they offer another solid state amp with lots of current to drive the electrostatics. You might stay away from Levinson amps too.

Yes, the Classe’ 45 watt VHC amp should drive electrostatics well. Bravo with sticking with a great amp! Reich is a brilliant designer.

Unfortunately the Martin Logan’s "curvilinear" membrane is a fundamentally flawed design. That, among other reasons, is why they have to offer a 5 year warranty.