Upgrade path from Wilson WattPuppy 7s? - seeking advice


I have a McIntosh system with a 275 tube amp, plus some PS Audio equipment. I play many different kinds of music - from Joe Bonamassa to Johannes Brahms.

I like the analytical quality of the WP 7's. They do seem to lack some midrange and do reproduce rock as well as some other speakers. So I previewed the following at Paragon Sound in Ann Arbor, and the price is a consideration. Here are my thoughts but am seeking advice:

(1) B&W 802 D3 - Better with rock, a bit mellow and not as analytical as the WP 7's. Better midrange than my current speakers.
(2) Wilson Alexia 1 - A bit pricey even with a hefty discount. Of interest, I found some of the higher resolution music files to be reproduced with too much complexity. The ability to discriminate transients, a feature of the WP speakers, seem to be diminished in the more elaborate sound provided by these speakers.

Any other suggestions? I do not want to spend a great deal of money, but have the ability if necessary.

Thanks in advance for any advice - Gerry
128x128Ag insider logo xs@2xgerryah930

Showing 9 responses by gpgr4blu

Try Wilson Sashas 1 or 2. Both provide a warmer (not in a bad way) and more realistic and refined midrange than the WP 7s together with better and more linear bass. The Sasha 2s have the newer soft dome tweeter which some prefer to the titanium tweeter in the Sasha 1. Prices on the used market for the Sasha 1 are criminally low.
Ignore Audiotroy. He loves to invade Wilson (and other)  threads to tout Paradigms with the same long winded opinion of one whose pocketbook depends on the success of Paradigm Personas. But you sort of invited him in by asking for any other suggestions.
I have heard Paradigm Personas on 3 different occasions (including Audiotroy's setup at the NY Audio show last year). They are good for the money although a bit on the hard and bright side (he says transparent--wrong) for me. I'll take WP 7s, Sashas, Alexias and Yvettes and countless other more musically coherent speaker brands over the Paradigms.  
Audiotroy always talks about the alleged $ that Paradigm put into the Persona's development. Under that rationale, we should all be listening to Bose, Sony and B&W and not brands like Wilson, Magico, Rockport, Nola and countless other reputable brands with strong science and great individual ears behind the brand.
 When you purchase loudspeakers, you purchase the ear and talent of the creator. By all means, listen to all of the speakers you can, but don't listen to opinions of biased, hyperbolic dealers.  
Troy:
You produce more words than an online dictionary. As for your claim to have sold more WP than anyone associated with the brand, I can't wait to hear where and when. Was it when you were a lowly salesperson for Sound By Singer who me and many of my friends avoided because you always and still do talk too much to the point where we just wanted you to leave so we could make up our own minds about what was "the best ever" and what was just average. (Usually what you said was the best ever wasn't even close)  By the way, why did Andy lose the Wilson account?--
  Yes Yes We know you are blown away by Beryllium drivers (you once told me Ushers were better than Wilsons at 1/2 the price)--so I guess you really do love Beryllium--and people who go to Audio Doctor and buy them may as well. Good for you and them. But let's let the market for high end audio be our guide. We'll see where audiophiles who can afford speakers up to 60k and go out listening put there $. The Personas, despite their marketing and alleged superior technology will maintain a small share of that market. Wilson, Focal, Magico, B&W and others in the Persona range and above will continue to outsell Personas--and that's not because most audiophiles are either foolish or uninformed.
As we've discussed many times, I currently own Wilson but I am by no means a "fanboy" (Is that high school or college slang?) I've owned Focal, B&W,JBL,Quad, Reference 3As and others.  I have no skin in the Wilson game other than I think they make extraordinarily good loudspeakers in their respective price ranges as do more than a handful of other manufacturers.
And I really don't care if others agree with me. But when you and Troy go on your long Persona promotional tours here on Audiogon, you get me going--especially when you compare them to Sashas, Alexias (or as you once did-- Marten's 100k+ speakers) in which case IMHO they fall far short in musicality, coherence and dynamic expression.
 Funny--no one else on this or any other forum I'm on bothers me the way you and your sidekick do. Maybe if you two stop with the rank salesmanship. Then again, that would be impossible--like the Scorpion in "The Crying Game" --you can't help it--it's in your nature.
Audiotroy:
I actually do have more experience than you in listening carefully to hundreds of amplification and speaker components for many years--more than you have been in the industry. I have built amplifiers and speakers. I have been invited to review for prominent audio magazines.
You sell stuff. Some things, you are not permitted to sell so you go to the next best thing and try to promote it as the best. But, unlike you, I have no skin in the game for any brand. I buy what I like whenever I like. I am not wedded to Wilson and I never said  or believed that you hated them. But I am so tired of your salesmanship and your comparison years ago between Usher and Wilson (you did tell me you thought Ushers were better at less cost) and today where you claim Personas are better than Alexias. It would seem that you have a Wilson issue as you compared the only two speakers you ever tried to sell me in person to Wilsons without me ever bringing up the name and without you knowing that I owned them. You are doing the same here on Audiogon.
 You are simply not as good as you say. I'll speak to Andy and Elliot and see if they agree that you were a great salesman for them.
 I give you credit for your observations re BelCanto and Shunyata with HRS base and some of the brands you currently carry including T&A and the Personas which I have said many times are good for the money but not the world beaters you claim them to be. If you some day learn to stop overselling, you might actually become believable. But you can't and won't.
Troy
You finally convinced me. You have the most knowledge. You are not a shill blowhard. You have the best ear, the best taste and are a reliable source of audio information. You are a great salesman. Personas are scientifically and indisputably great speakers and all self respecting audiophiles who have speakers under $100,000 are about to throw them out and run to your little Jersey City hovel to purchase Personas (unless they prefer Golden Ear speakers which are almost as good for a fraction of the price). I can’t believe you found 2 great reviews for the Personas from reviewers who I do respect (and I mean that) but who have provided many excellent reviews to many speakers including Anthony Cordesman’s review of Alexias which was so strong that he used them as one of his references for a time (but not the Personas after he reviewed them).
When my friends and I have encountered you live, you never shut up about how great you and your products are. And then you talked some more. And that is why no one I know (7 NY Audiophiles in my listening group and other friends including a two well known manufacturers of gear) will purchase anything from you or place their products with Audio Doctor.
By the way--congrats, you once again produced more words than even the famous Bo---only he has something to say compared to your ceaseless blather.
P.S. I will not forget to ask Andy Singer and Elliot Fishkin about you to see if they have a recollection of you as a superstar salesperson. I suspect that Andy was not lying to me back in the day when I asked him to make sure you were not my salesperson because you were too hyperbolic and you never shut up. He said he understood and that the complaint was not uncommon. We'll see.
Troy:
gee. The fact that you cannot stop talking or producing words in print--often way off point--- was your problem as a salesperson (which made you intolerable to me and others). My only point to you has ever and will always be to stop hard selling. I am not a defender of Wilson, Magnepan, B&W, Focal, Reference 3a, Marten, Quad or any other speaker brand that I’ve heard, owned or liked. I completely understand why anyone would prefer one speaker brand over another. This hobby is extremely subjective. 
  I just cannot tolerate your constant hard salesmanship usually with outrageous, over the top unbelievable comparisons. You've done it for countless components you sell--it now just happens to be Personas. Your style is offensive to more than a few Goners who have extensive experience in audio and don't need any salesman to tell them that they have the most and best experience and have reached the indisputable conclusion that they sell the best speaker ever made at a great price if only someone would come to have a listen. I will continue to remind you that I welcome Atmasphere, Kevin Deal, Jonathan Carr, fellas from DCS, BelCanto and countless other manufacturers and dealers who add great knowledge to our site without EVER selling their gear here.You continue to be the only one. But this site does not prevent salesmanship. You are allowed to speak endlessly.  Keep it up. If the moderator doesn’t stop you, I will call you out whenever you produce thousands of words to waste everyone’s time including mine with rank salesmanship. 
PS-You sell some fine gear. The manufacturers you represent are not the problem--you are.
 You are too busy talking and selling to understand my issue with you.It's not that you think Personas are great speakers for the $. You are justly entitled to that opinion. It is that you constantly sell, sell and oversell. Hyperbolic blather.
Troy---I hope I helped the OP by drawing his attention to your comments in context. 
I did until you hijacked the thread. Gee I can see your angry. The truth hurts.