Two surprising things I found that improved my imaging and staging...


... First off I have a odd room for my two channel listening and have been getting beat up trying to find proper placement. I have been reading a lot here and on the inter web and decided to use the room setup calculator on the Cardas site. ( http://www.cardas.com/room_setup_calculators.php )

#1 was how close to each other the speakers are now. I wouldn’t have placed them that close together.

#2 was that the best imaging and staging is with zero toe in.

Having a hard time wrapping my head around these changes but it’s the best my system has sounded since I finished the putting it together. lol

captbeaver

Showing 4 responses by sns

Each room and system is unique, requires unique speaker placement to some extent. I put tape on floor to mark locations for past speakers.


And don't have any equipment on high racks between speakers. Not having anything other than room treatments between speakers is perhaps the most important thing in getting 3d imaging. You can have equipment low to ground, anything higher than 20" or so starts affecting my sound stage.
Sound waves reflect and diffuse off front wall as well as side walls, floor, ceiling and back wall. The phantom center image is an artifact of these interactions. Sound waves reflecting off relatively flat and hard surfaces such as equipment front fascias results in unnatural effects. Proper diffusion is created by varied depth surfaces that neither reflect or absorb excessively.

I can only say try lowering the  equipment rack and try some proper diffusion treatments on front wall, you should hear greater center image dimensionality.  The detrimental effects of a high equipment rack will lessen if rack is further back from plane of speakers, really need to clear out space between speaker plane to at least a few feet back.
@Mahgister, your many posts and this latest in particular have finally compelled me to  respond directly to you.
And so, you have a total system that costs less than $500, you have computer screen and equipment directly between your speakers. Based on one of your recent posts you actually picture the performers in your room, all this with present system.

You have over 6,000 posts, some insightful and meaningful. And so, I respect that you have some knowledge of audio based on previous posts. And based on those previous posts and ones on this thread I understand your hearing high resolution, natural timbre, well balanced tonality, three dimensional imaging, life size sound stage, deep reaching bass, extended highs from your system. All this from system that costs less than $500 and no ac treatments or room treatments?
Either your perceptual powers pertaining to sound quality are singularly the highest I've observed in over thirty years of audio conversation, or you're simply delusional. It has taken me total expenditures reaching many multiples of $10k in any single system over quite a number of systems over twenty some years to reach the same level of sound quality!
I can only say this, and I'm not being facitious, I'm rather envious of you. Perhaps, my obsession and others, with reaching for highest sound quality has all been a waste of time. Just as with the phantom center image, it's all delusion anyway. If I had the perceptive powers you have I needn't have spent all this money and obsessed over every single detail in this needless pursuit.

Still, the important thing is to have personal enjoyment with whatever system your left with at the end of this journey. Obviously, you have and I have had two entirely different journeys, mine winding and difficult, yours seems rather easy in comparison. Both of us seem to be enjoying our systems.
I do have some criticisms of your posts. What is the basis for your viewpoints? Do you have experience with a wide variety of equipment at various price points, with AC treatments, room treatments, tweaks in general? And I don't mean hearing about other's comments on these things, I mean actual ownership and use of these items within your system. And then, have you offered reviews of the wide variety of equipment you've actually experienced within your system?
Again, I'll offer that you have made what seem to be knowledgeable and insightful comments over time. Are these your own based on experience or are you simply regurgitating other's comments? Regardless, you need to give up the objective stance, always insert your experience and/or in my opinion into the narrative. I look forward to your response.
@gp4jesus using ht for stereo and setting that up is beyond my pay grade.

In stereo systems, first reflection points at side walls and ceiling should be first place for room treatments. I'd suggest diffusion is best for all first reflection points, absorption will deaden the sound. Diffusion also works well for center of front wall.

Toe in and width between speakers work in concert, the further you space the speakers the more toe in is usually required. Get the ratio right and you'll attain the widest sound stage and still retain strong center image. As previously mentioned there are no hard and fast rules for speaker placement in any particular room and system. Multiple owners of any particular speaker will likely end up with speakers in different positions relative to side walls, front walls, toe in and spacing. The best advice I can give is to experiment, you may be amazed to find previously unthought of positioning may be optimum. Also, not too many rooms are perfectly symmetrical, mine being one that isn't, this requires different positioning for each speaker.