Turntables currently considered top of the range. Do you know what they are ?

@mulveling yeah, I've been thinking that if I go through with that Master Innovation upgrade I should really include the Minus-K in my budget. If the windfall I expect affords me the Master it will afford the Minus-K as well. :)

@inna are you saying you want to know about the best turntables that are still under $50K? I'll assume that and reply with:

• Clearaudio Master Innovation ($34K)
• 2 x Clearaudio Universal 12" tonearms ($6.7K each)
• Clearaudio Innovation record weight ($750)
• Clearaudio Outer Limit Ring ($1500)

This is just about $50K. I put this here, because I have this, except mine is the regular Innovation turntable and I have the Statement record weight, at $30K for everything, but I am thinking about adding the field upgrade kit to the Master Innovation for another ~$20K

@bigtwin I think that article is misinformed. The Clearaudio Statement v2 turntable is more like $250K now. I don't know if that's with or without the $35K Statement TT1 tonearm.

@biftwin I don’t think I will. That just ends up being troll bait, in my experience. But for purposes of my response to this thread, I have (in addition to turntable noted above):

Lyra Altas Lambda SL
Lyra Atlas Lambda Mono
Boulder 1108 phono-stage
Naim 252/Supercap DR preamp
Naim 300DR power amp
Naim NDX2/XPS DR network streamer
Dynaudio Confidence C2 Platinum speakers
REL S/510 subs (stereo pair)

@overthemoon Linn is near Glasgow, Scotland; however, Rega is not in Scotland. They are headquartered in Essex, England, which is in the southeast closer to London.

@lewm 

 

Was just thinking it’s ironic that the LP12 is denigrated for the high cost of upgrades but Clearaudio gets away with it because for $20,000, you also get a name change.

The name change isn't the point and you know better if I'm not mistaken. Have you heard a Master Innovation? I have. It's a pretty amazing deck.

@yoyoyaya @lewm

That’s mostly correct. The Master field upgrade for the regular Innovation results in a full Master Innovation. There is no difference whatsoever between an upgraded Innovation and the retail Master Innovation. The cost of the upgrade is pretty much the difference between them. The Innovation (with no tonearm) is ~$15K + ~$19K for the Master upgrade. The Master Innovation is ~$34K (no tonearm). I am referring to prices for the piano black finish since that is what I have. The regular Panzerholz finish is about $2k less (or $1k each for Innovation + upgrade).

I have heard the Master Innovation with the 9" Universal arm and Clearaudio Statement Goldfinger cartridge on a Boulder/Dynaudio system. It was really impressive.

@yoyoyaya I’m aware of the Unity, and have talked to Ken Bowers about it. I have two Universal 12" tonearms. The Unity – at $20K (less the trade allowance for Universal arms offered) – isn’t really on my radar, so it’s mostly pointless to compare it to what I have (and am happy with)...not that I have the opportunity to anyway.

@dover 

When I found that the Clearaudio Statement ( at US150,000 ) could not keep accurate speed I decided their TT's are not fit for purpose.

I suspect that's a one-off issue that should/could have been fixed. I've had two different Clearaudio turntables for the last 14 years and they maintain spot on accurate speed all the time.

Yeah, anyone getting spendy on turntables and ignoring isolation is more likely than not throwing good money after bad. Adding a first class isolation base to a turntable is like getting an upgraded turntable. It's more often than not a real game changer when approached adequately.

I really want to try a Minus-K.

@mulveling For the Master Innovation field upgrade the whole bearing assembly for the Innovation part is removed and replaced with a new beefed-up one included in the upgrade kit. The result is the same as the current retail unit. My Innovation Wood was purchased August 2023 so it’s a relatively newer one.

If you go to the Clearaudio website the Master Innovation product page has the manual for the field upgrade. You can see exactly how that upgrade all works.

What did you think of the difference between the Wood and the Master?

@mulveling Thanks for the detailed and very helpful response. I hope to do that upgrade later this year.

I really haven't had any issues with woofer flapping on my Innovation Wood with the Universal arms. I do have it sitting on a HRS R3X isolation platform, with the LF feet factory tuned specifically for the turntable. I have a pair of REL S/510 subs so I should notice if I had an issue. My Boulder phono-stage has a 10Hz low cut filter and I don't notice any difference with it engaged.

 

Wow it looks like you can buy most of those tables on Amazon. How can you go wrong! 

I clicked through for the Clearaudio Ovation. The link is for the belt. 

@inna no, its just a troll. Don't feed it.

A discussion around isolation solutions is also interesting for high end turntables. They are a must, IMO.

Right now I have a HRS R3X isolation base for my Clearaudio Innovation. If I upgrade my Innovation to the Master Innovation I will need new feet at a minimum, but have considered other options. One is to move up the line to the HRS S3 or even a M3X2. Another possibility is to get a HRS EXR 3-shelf rack, and put isolation bases on two of the shelves for my turntable and phono-stage. At that point I'd have room for a larger isolation base, so a Minus-K for the turntable is an option.

@tomic601 It seems Minus-K have already worked out the correct product for the Clearaudio Master Innovation. It’s the BM-8 and they show an example of one with a Master Innovation on it. It looks like the cost for one is $3,635.00. That’s about the same cost as the HRS M3X2 isolation base. They show that on this page: https://www.minusk.com/content/applications_vibration_isolation_systems/audio_reproduction_turntables_vibration_isolation_platforms.html

@mulveling My current thought – if I upgrade to Master Innovation – is to get a three-shelf HRS EXR rack for the phono-stage and TT, with a Minus-K under the TT. I'll repurpose the HRS R3x isolation base I have (with the right feet) for the phono-stage.