Turn down the Volume!

@ozzy62 , Me also. 

@ozzy62 , I agree in part but the largest variable in effect is impossible to qualify by description and that is the room. Even if you are totally familiar with the equipment used if you have not heard it in that installation you can have no idea what it sounds like. But yes, if the person is using a Bose table radio things do not sound so hot. 

Thanx @onlyqualityhifi. That might be true for studio monitoring situations. I am no expert in that. But, in home situations that is certainly wrong and it does not matter which source I am using. It is certain that modern recordings are much more consistent than older ones. It is also certain that I listen to much less of the room than is usual. To my ear various recordings sound best at wildly different volume settings especially when jumping genres. If you try to set one volume level, calibrated for each source, some recordings are going to sound dull and others too bright. There are too many variables that play into this for one volume to work, from the mics used to the settings of the recording engineer. Then you are off to the mixing engineer and finally production of the source material, records, CDs and so forth. All involve setting levels.  The quality of the home system including the room also play into this. Systems that tend towards sibilance can be uncomfortable to listen too at higher volumes. 

An interesting aside. In the past I always thought sibilance was just a fact of life and you always had to live with some of it. The instinct is always to turn the volume down. This is not true. Over the years as my system improved sibilance became progressively less of a problem until now when I rarely have an issue with it. My volume levels have also steadily increased. It is not because or presbycusis either although I have a small amount. I certainly hear it in some systems and not others. 

@onlyqualityhifi , I would like to know what RRV means!

@onlyqualityhifi , What do you mean by RR Volume?

All recordings do not sound best at the same volume. Playing a string quartet at the same volume as a live rock concert would be a little silly and quite painful.

@onlyqualityhifi , thank you for responding. It always helps to have backup. People in the business never want to upset people as they might lose business. They won't lie, they just won't tell you the truth. This comment does not apply to the snake oil venders. 

As I have state in the past, every recording has a "right" volume. I have always thought that this had to do with the volume it was mixed at as our frequency response changes with volume. Do you think this is correct? 

The first time I heard a seriously well set up system my jaw must have dropped three feet, frisson every minute. It took me 30 years to better that system and I still have a few problems to solve.

Another note. It is not just the equipment but also how the equipment is use and the room it is placed in. 

@phusis , that is a very valid question which has a very politically difficult answer. Many people already think I am an arrogant SOB and from their perspective I am and nothing is going to convince them otherwise. So, in short,  Mr Turnbull's system is not even remotely close to accurate. This is not saying that it is not pleasing to listen to. I have spent decades listening to my own pleasingly inaccurate systems. The people who are listening are surprised a small system like that can sound so good, the Bose Effect. When presented with a current SOTA system you get comments like "G-d, it sounds like you are there!" "I have never heard anything like this before." I never knew a system like this existed" and so forth. You get the impression of a true sense of wonder. Does a system have to be really SOTA to generate this sort of reaction? No, but it is a good indicator. 

It all comes down to experience. Most audiophiles have not worked in the business and are busy with their own jobs and life. They have minimal exposure and very few systems are capable of the kind of performance I am talking about which again does not mean other systems are not pleasing to listen to. I worked in an ultra high end store and in my own experience I have only heard three systems that reached this level of performance. 

@phusis, thank you for the psychoanalysis. 

What about the rest? Every little detail is important, some more than others. It is attention to details that moves a system towards state of the art performance, even the minor ones. I stated exactly what accurate is and it is a target to shoot at, a reference point. Although our audio memory stinks those of us who frequent live events on a regular basis and are paying attention usually have a good idea what accurate is even though we can not define it. We know when we hear it. 

Specific about what? People's preferences? What "enjoyable" is varies from person to person and depends on that individual's experience and expectations. Wild presumption? No, fact of life and I could care less who agrees with me. Your paragraph makes no sense by the way. You might want to rephrase it. Let me do it for you. In my own little pathetic world I am an arrogant, HiFi snob and proud of it. I love every inch of the the ride and am more than happy to share and assist others as well a accept advice from those whose opinions I respect. Although accuracy in sound reproduction is a vague topic and difficult to describe, it does exist. The interesting observation I have made over the years is most people, even those who are not HiFi addicts know when they hear it.

@amosm  If you don't want to hear your car rattle, turn up the radio. This is called masking. The same holds true of your highway noise. Play vinyl which has a higher background noise level and turn up the volume till you don't notice the highway.\

Your only other option is to move. I 

I know of no house that is absolutely quiet. Mine certainly is not but, it never bothers me until I am taking measurements then I turn everything in the house off.

@phusis , an actual live acoustical reference certainly is the goal, at least as far as I am concerned. The problem for all of us is that a live acoustical reference is a moving target and ones that are not electrified into oblivion are hard to find. One of my favorite references is the conservatory string quartet. If I were to record one I would want the reproduction to sound exactly like that, room and all. Jazz in the right venue offers another opportunity for a realistic reference. It is easy for any great system to outperform most rock and pop concerts as they are in most instances distorted mono. I suppose I am looking for a rock concert with the imaging of a live string quartet, but with the bass, power and dynamics of rock. This is the audiophile me talking not the music lover me. The music lover me will gladly listen to a 78 of Enrico Caruso. I am not quite sure which lover John is speaking for. The general public is routinely astounded when they hear a big system. As he explains, many of them never knew systems like these existed. When you tell them the price they think you are crazy, probably true. Do they enjoy it? Sure, like any amusement park ride. They are certainly not making or even thinking about an analysis of the performance for accuracy. There is a scale of accuracy. Some systems (includes the room) are more accurate than others. Accurate and enjoyable are two separate issues. John is talking about enjoyable which more or less comes down to taste. Accurate is that string quartet sounding exactly as it did at the live performance. There are millions of almost accurates , but only one accurate.  Some of us prefer a more surrealistic version of reality. I will alter the sound somewhat to suit my own taste, to replicate my memory of the live performance at reasonable levels. It always is a matter of memory and we all hear music differently. I have yet to see anyone AB a live performance with a recording of it. We have no trouble remembering what we heard, but we have a real hard time remembering what we heard sounded like. There are so many confounding factors which is why there are so many opinions regarding the quality of music systems. John thinks if it sounds good, if it is "enjoyable" then it is valid. This approach is fine for most people. IMHO this is an avoidance tactic and certainly a lot less stressful than that search for the one accurate. This has nothing to do with validity. Any old which way you can enjoy music is valid. If you are looking for accurate you are in for a rough ride.

To all a Happy 4th!

@dain , It is not that complicated. If the mixing engineer is mastering at a higher volume he is going to keep the bass and treble a little lower to get a balanced sound. When you listen to it at a low level it sounds dull and bass-less. But, if you turn it up to the volume the mastering engineer was mixing at, it sound fine. Again, all this is based on the Fletcher-Munson effect. Every recording has a "right" volume level based on the type of music and the way it was mastered. The way around this is called dynamic loudness compensation. TacT Audio is the only company to have done this. In the old days just used tone controls. Now, some of us have digital EQ. Me, I just turn up the volume till it sounds right:-)

@dain You are right when you mention different systems have different loudness levels at any given dB reading. The Loudness Wars are all about dynamic compression. Soft passages sound almost as loud as the loud ones. It is pretty strange when a single violin sounds as loud as the entire orchestra. People seem to think this sounds better in their cars. 

We perceive other issues as "volume" like distortion and sibilance, both want to make us turn it down.

If you do not know about Fletcher-Munson curves read up on it. You can make a system sound louder by modifying it's frequency response to match that of our hearing at any given level, the old Loudness switch. 

Next is the volume the recording was mastered at. Recordings mastered at high volumes will sound dull and bass-less  at low volumes. Recordings mastered at low levels will sound bright and bassy at loud levels, see Fletcher Munson.

Finally, there is the overall quality of the system. Powerful, low distortion systems ( I include the room as part of the system) with reasonably flat response curves never seem to be playing as loud as they actually are. 95 dB can be very comfortable and satisfying for no longer than an hour or two or you risk damaging your hearing. Volumes above 100 dB should be avoided. But, in order to handle peaks well a system should be able to push out 105 dB without noticeable distress.

@bkeske has it right. Every recording has a "right" volume level again depending on how it was mixed and the type or genre of the music.