Tube Amp soundstage

@dtapo

now you just need to go down the rabbit hole of SET tube amps and take that tube soundstage, depth, nuance, texture to the next level ;-)

So when a tube amp adds even a few percent of even order harmonics our brains easily blend it into one seamless whole.

Solid state and digital however are not at all like this. The distortions they produce are far lower in magnitude

MC’s assertion that SS amps aren’t mindful to 2nd harmonics is complete rubbish. It’s simply a matter of how the circuit is designed. For decades Nelson Pass has placed a large focus on balancing the right blend of 2nd and 3rd harmonics into his designs, or providing amps with different harmonic flavors to the market. He’s stated in interviews that about 1/3 of listeners prefer 2nd harmonics, 1/3 prefer 3rd, and the rest prefer a blend or have no preference. MC loves to be categorical in the "truths" he pushes but often he is simply asserting a bias.

Okay, explain to me then how any amp, solid state or otherwise, can be "mindful"?

Of course an inanimate object can’t be mindful but the designer of one can be which is my point and you know that regardless of how cute you try to be with your word selection.

You can build your own SS 2nd harmonic generator if you like. Nelson Pass "mindfully" designed it.

http://www.firstwatt.com/pdf/art_h2_v1.pdf

My bias?

And you’re right...it may not have been due to your bias...rather your lack of understanding of SS designs.

MC - you were asserting that tube amps sound better than SS due to their even/2nd harmonics and that SS amps are "not at all like this".  Your words, not mine.  While I agree that tube designs naturally lend themselves to producing 2nd harmonics, so do SS amps if designed that way.  This is not a matter of tube amps categorically producing more even harmonics over SS - it's all about design and implementation.

I'm sure you will enjoy wringing your hands to respond in your usual condescending obtuse way to me so I'm done responding to this thread.  I've made my point.  

Classic MC closing, 

"Holy crap. See how easy that was?  Next question."

Ralph’s post is perfect to demonstrate how the design and implementation are applied to get the desired outcome from an amp. Designers of both tubes and transistors make choices and tradeoffs to achieve their goals. Tubes have a relatively high output impedance and are not easily capable of driving a loudspeaker directly – where the opposite is true for transistors. This is why most tube power amplifiers have large output transformers and transistor amplifiers do not. The transformer addresses the tube output issue but certainly has sonic drawbacks. This is why a number of Ralph’s designs "fix" this problem by creating output transformerless amplifiers. It’s all about the implementation.

MC says "Designers never came up in my post at all. Now you’re pretending it did. Crazy."

Look...the inconvenient truth is that when talking about tubes vs SS You CANNOT separate the equipment from the design if you want to discuss the harmonics that are produced. Period!

Any device, tube or transistor, will display the same basic character with respect to odd or even harmonic distortions depending on how it is used. In a single ended design there is one amplifying device covering the entire musical signal while in a push pull or complimentary design there are two: one for one half of the signal and the other the remaining half. The simple fact that second order harmonics are louder than third order harmonics in most any device dominates the single ended approach while push pull and complimentary designs cancel these distortions by the very nature of their operation. What this means is that any device, tube or transistor, will display the same basic character with respect to odd or even harmonic distortions depending on how it is used.

MC makes these erroneous claims about even harmonics being attributable to the tubes themselves...and SS gear (w/o any design considerations) produces more odd harmonics. This is just plain wrong regardless of how MC chooses to spin it. It’s not about a tube vs a transistor - it’s all about implementation...yes, the friggin’ design!

From a practical standpoint most SS designs are not single-ended and lend themselves to producing odd harmonics so MC falls into the trap of believing it must be due to the gear using SS components instead of valves. Wrong. So very wrong. This isn’t word play MC, this isn’t a game, this isn’t dastardly use of a Cusinart...this is just you not understanding something.