Tellefsen,
The Viva 845 is an excellent sounding amp, being tubed I would think The input impedance is rather high(50k or higher) and should work with the Dude.
I used the Dude linestage in my system recently and it worked well with my 300b SET amplifier.I`d be very hesitant to let the Viva go.
Charles |
Tellefsen,
Well if that`s the case it comes down to Viva amp or the Dude. Since you own this wonderful amp I`d search for another preamp. I`ll admit a bias toward superb SET amplifiers compared to SS amps.
Good Luck, |
Grannyring,
Good points, impedance matching matters.The Dude with my 300b SET was exceptional(once we replaced the 6sn7 tube in the power supply) very dynamic,lively and large scale with good tone. I feel the Viva with the proper speaker pairing would have excellent scale,impact and ease. It did with my 300b Frankenstein(right speaker match), I know it could with the 845 tybe based Viva.
I heard the Viva Verona paired with the Trenner-Friedl(97db efficient)speaker at CES 2010, it was outstanding in all sonic parameters, yes huge life like scale and utter ease and flow.
My point, proper amp-speaker match is crucial, not just how many watts an amplifier may have.
Best Regards,
Charles |
Hi,
Pete, I returned the Dude exactly the way it was. While in my home jeff and I replaced your 6sn7(power supply) with a Slyvania version( even better we both thought) but then placed yours back in prior to repacking.Pete thanks again for the very generous loan.
Bill, we listened to the Dude over a period of 2 days,I think it was pretty warmed up by then.
The Dude is 'very fine'(it really did sing with the Fankensteins) as I said in my comparison post last week, it really responds to different tubes(we tried some Tungsols in the signal path also).I hope you have an opprotunity to hear the Coincident Statement Linestage one day in your system.
Best Regards, |
Bill, would the TRL tube amps drive your Sound Labs?
If you`re ever visiting near Detroit please let me know.
I live about 25 minutes outside the city limits. |
One thing I know,the Viva SET amps are`nt 'polite',tame or dead sounding(with the correct speakers). They are vivid,very dynamic and full of energy and presence.
Put any amplifier with the wrong speaker and the results won`t be satisfactory.
The TRL tube amps could be really fine, but push-pull and SET are two different sounds. Telefsen seems to love his Viva,I doubt these two amps sound similar.
It`s hard to make decisions without an audition and direct comparions. |
Hi Agear,
I understand Jwm`s point, that Viva amp can sound very clear,open and transparent without overt coloration. No amplifier type can lay claim to more accuracy than another. Transistors, tubes(PP or SET) Class D etc.all have various degrees of some coloration.
For me it`s impossible to talk about an amp`s performance without factoring in the given speaker with it(can`t seperate the two). The TRL 'could' sound overly warm with one speaker yet near perfect with another, system context is everything. |
I`m glad you`re keeping the Viva and hope that it and the Dude can become compatible audio mates.
Good Luck, |
Tellefsen,
That "purity" and "thereness" you mention is very hard for most other types(non SET) of amplifiers to achieve, at lease when compared to the better built SETs.
The trade off is relatively lower power output, but is overcome with the right speaker choice.
The Viva with the Trenner-Friedl RA Box speaker I heard at CES 2010 was ultra dynamic,impactful,energetic and the most close to 'live' like sound at that show. I was there 3 full days and heard many different rooms/systems.
Bass control has much to do with speaker selection for a given amplifier. If I did`nt have my sublime Frankenstein mono amps, the Viva Verona would sure be on my to buy list. You have a very fine amplifier.
Take Care, |
As usual it all comes down to what works best for you. People go from tubes to SS amps and viceversa. Taste and systems change and evolve and sometimes can become circular.What ever type componemt makes you happy, go for it. |
Hi Agear,
I don`t believe any point is being missed at all. The fact of the matter is ultimately each person will choose what thy think is best(within their means).Glory,you and many others find complete satisfaction with SS amplifiers, perfectly understood.
Some other listeners like me have heard many SS amps but simply realize that certain tube amps just have unique qualities that in our opinion elude SS amps(others would dispute this of course) it really is personal.
I`ve heard the elite class of SS amps for example Dartzeel,Vitus,Solution,MBL,Tidal,Technical Brain etc. If I had to choose a SS amp the Dartzeel would likely be it. Yet none of these ultra SS amps do what my SET amp does at the same level(sense of uncanny presence,realism and tone). But hey that`s just one man`s impression,that`s all. There are many who would select any of those SS amps rather than mine, but again not me. I`d never tell someone my ears are better so my choice is right and yours is wrong, makes no sense.
Agear you could hear my system and perhaps not like it much, understood completely. My only point is a simple fact, we all hear differetly and and react emotionally to what our ear-brain axis processes, Thus class D amp for that guy,Otl,SET, or Class A or AB SS for that guy over there, like I said what ever pleases you most.
Best Regards, |
Hi,
Agear now it seem as though you`re missing the 'point', In my quote above I was quite clear to say 'most' and not 'all'. You have spent 3 months evaluating amps in your system and have drawn certain conclusions. I`ve spent many years listening to various types of amps and have also formed conclusions based on observations, just like you or anyone else.
There`s no resorting to "sonic relativism" as you put it, in terms of 'coping out', but merely to state the obvious,there is no absolute when it comes to audio.
Your observations and subsequent decisions they lead to are no better or worse than mine, they`re simply yours.
There`s no need(or point) is debating SET vs SS atributes as it will depend on who`s doing the listening-judging(how else can it be?).
I understand that show conditions are`nt ideal, yet somehow many rooms/components manage to sound good and sometimes even great! They are setup by those who know their components best. Of course I have`nt heard many of these amps in my system and never will(just impractical).
Tellefsen I`m sure took what I wrote as one person`s opinion, the same as all the other contributors to this fun thread he started.
The best SS amp i`ve had in my system was Symphonic Line(German) it was very very good. My Frankenstein MKII 300b SET is a superior amplifier for ny needs and desires. You and others could/would feel differently, what is the big deal.
Agear if you find SS amps ideal for your needs then that`s the direction to go.You can do all the extensive A/B testing you want but at the end of the day they`re just 'your' results. I really don`t understand the need to prove one amp catagory is equal to or better than another. Come on man , it is and will always be subjective thus relative when all is said and done.
Regards, |
|
Agear,
I understand your point,and the problem is there`s no definitive or precise vocabulary ground rules in high end audio. We all use adjectives in an attempt to convey what we hear and of course different words and terms have various interpretations by others.
For example my use of 'purity' and'thereness' was my attempt to express the sheer presence(vivid and palpable) factor and lack of mechanical-electronic character my SET provides. It`s the highest level I`ve ever had in my system, the performers and sense of venue is that apparent.
I know among SET amps there`s a hierarchy for sure, some are just better than others, but the higher quality SETs are superb in this regard(noticed even at audio shows)
If someone says they get the same level of these characteristics from their SS amp I have to except that they do, it`s just I have`nt 'yet' had that experence with SS personally. I simply won`t argue about the listening impressions of someone else(pointless). We hear what we hear.
The vast marjority of my music is jazz, large and small scale.I find no limitation with other genre of music with my SET system.
Regards, |
Agear,
Tellefsen may or may not be getting the most from his Viva,all I know is it`s capable of outstanding dynamics,presence and projection with the 'right' speaker.
Agree completely about AC power conditioning,I use a BPT BP-3.5 Signature Plus(balanced transformer 20amps) and it makes a 'substantial' improvement in sound quality(no down side either).
System synergy/compatability takes planing and time to get things right.
In my case the linestage,amp,speakers(made to match with SETs) and power cords from the same talented designer simplified this process a lot.
As a result a SET based system works fabulously for me(maybe not for others). I wish you the best with your current amplifier evaluations. |
Jennifer Lopez? hey I`m with you, sorry Dude. |
I think any appraoch at some level has"sonic disadvantages" as nothing is ever the 'perfect' solution. My linestage uses an interstage transformer(rather than signal path coupling capacitors) same as Jwm`s VAC Signature MK II and I can attest to the profound transparent sound of both of them. But as always there`s more than one way to skin a cat. |
I believe Jwm meant intrestage transformer coupled not 'direct coupled'. |
