TriPlanar tonearm outward skating issue

Staying out of this mud-wrestling match, but I want to point you to an annotated photo I made to work someone through a wire dressing problem with his Tri-Planar.

The owner had purchased his tonearm used and the previous owner had obviously mishandled the tonearm.

Here’s the photo: http://galibierdesign.com/images/galibier_forum/triplanar_wire_routing_annotated.jpg

Ralph is absolutely correct (quoted comment, below), and the above photo shows what a correctly dressed cable should look like.

I would contact Triplanar; but I’ve talked to Triplanar about this and he says that this problem can occur if the interconnect cable is pulled too hard. It causes the cable to not have enough slack going through the gimbals.

Its also easy to fix- just extract some of the wires from the cable where the clamp is mounted at the base of the arm so as to give the wires a bit more slack.

... Thom @ Galibier Design

Nice photo Thom! A picture is worth a thousand words.

Salectric - thanks, that’s certainly been my experience in supporting customers remotely. It has most definitely upped my photo editing game ;-) The time is overdue for me to up my video editing game as well.

Which is what I wrote also, in my post that followed on to Ralph’s first post. I’ve had it happen to me, and the fix was very simple once I was able to discern that the wires were hanging up the pivot. I’m in good company.

Lewm - I confess to only scanning this thread before posting - especially after watching the conversation go a bit "off the rails" ;-)

... Thom @ Galibier Design

Hi Raul,

Like yourself, I’ve encountered products which make unforgivable design decisions but it’s UNFAIR to put the Tri-Planar into this category.

I have yet to handle a tonearm which didn’t have at least one or two design quirks. There is no foolproof/bulletproof tonearm in existence. If there were, I suspect it would be so over-engineered as to have sonic compromises.

Also, let’s not allow the IAE ("Internet Amplification Effect") damage the reputation of a well-conceived tonearm.

The only time I’ve seen any sort of problem with Tri-Planar wire routing was that SINGLE OBVIOUS CASE of ABUSE by the previous owner. I was stunned when I saw the photos it’s second owner sent me.

The first owner clearly tampered with the wire and did so very incompetently. I dug up two photos the customer sent me (links are below).

Can you honestly tell me that this kind of damage does not constitute abuse?

My point is, that people do the darnedest things, and a manufacturer can’t control everything. The sort of individual who can handle a record and cue it up would never damage the cable routing.

Take note of how the wires are untwisted (in comparison with the earlier photo I posted). It may not be clear from these views, but the wires were interfering with the cutout in the arm tube. They in NO way resemble the standard cable routing.

http://galibierdesign.com/images/galibier_forum/triplanar_wire_routing_damaged-01.jpg

http://galibierdesign.com/images/galibier_forum/triplanar_wire_routing_damaged-02.jpg

Cheers,
Thom @ Galibier Design

Raul,

I think it's time for you to let this topic go, and to accept (as Ralph and I have written) that there is no perfect tonearm.  More importantly, the best tonearm for one person may not be suitable for another person. 

We interact with machines in a very personal way.  Every individual hears differently, so a design decision (design decisions are compromises in many cases) may be sonically acceptable to one person, but not to another.

I don't want to pollute this thread with too many of my own rants, but if anyone is interested, I posted on the topic of "the best tonearm" to my blog (https://galibierdesign.com/best-tonearm-01/ ).

I enjoyed our time we spent together when you were traveling across the country with your Essential preamp.  We will always have our philosophical differences, but in person, you are a 1st class gentleman.

Balancing things out, I never thought I'd bond with Lewm in person, but I had the opportunity to spend time with him and we've gotten along famously.  Sometimes the person doesn't translate from the written word (nothing new here).

I'd like to see this gentleman carry over to your online personae, as the individuals who find you abrasive and pedantic are doing so for a reason.

You have a wealth of knowledge to offer this community, but your "virtuous sonic warrior" approach ("my way or the highway") offends many individuals. 

Of course, free advice is worth exactly what you pay for it ;-)  Finally, a disclaimer:  my Spanish is much worse than your English.

Cheers,
Thom @ Galiber Design

You said it better than I could have, Lou.  Personally, I think Herb's solution to the wire biasing problem is an elegant one.

Thom @ Galibier Design

Hi Raul,

It would be an interesting experiment. You’d d also need to take bearing friction into account however.

Without taking bearing friction into account, the experiment is flawed. An arm wire that attempts to influence tonearm motion could be defeated by tight bearings.

You’d also need to develop a reliable, accurate, and repeatable means of measuring these small forces.

In other words, doing it correctly is at the back of my list, in terms of things I have on my plate at the moment. I have a new turntable to finish prototyping and an amplifier to put into production ;-)

What if we found otherwise "good" tonearms induced a bit of anti-skating (VPI)? Is that a bad thing if the forces are small?

This all goes back to designer’s decisions, and we may not all agree with their priorities, but this makes for variety and choice - especially if the decisions are competently engineered and implemented.

Reading between the lines, your point about minimizing skating or anti-skating forces is a good one, as we’ve learned that excessive tracking, skating, and anti-skating forces can compromise dynamics.

So yes, I like your experiment in theory. I just don’t have the time to do this in a rigorous fashion that would give me meaningful results.

In the meantime, I recommend rigorous attention to setup detail while auditioning. The tonearm that tracks the best, has great energy transmission and dynamic presentation is a great tonearm, and I don’t have to second guess the designer’s choices.

Cheers,
Thom @ Galibier Design