Larry,call Galen Carol Audio!You owe me a nice bottle of wine!!
Best! |
Larry,if you fail to post,I(we)will track you down,and do something really terrible!Like, break your cantilever!!
Best! |
Now I know why I continue to correspond on these forums.It is because of quality guys,like you.Thanks for the very interesting info!!!I'm in the process of updating/upgrading certain parts of my system.Guess I'll have to start looking into the Orpheus.And I thought I might be able to take a nice summer vacation!Maybe it will have to be spent in my back yard,and audio room.Well,I guess that's not so bad.
Best! |
BTW,could someone please relate the actual weight,of the Orpheus.As well as the output.The Temper-V weighs 7.5 gms,and has an output of .38----Perfect for my phonostage,and arm!
Of course,I would love to see a detailed comparison,between the Temper-V and Orpheus(you could throw in a "Universe or Colibri/XV-1s comparison" to get me through the weekend,as my system is completely down,due to updates/upgrades)but that may be asking a bit too much,so I'd be happy with the two parameters I just mentioned.
Thanks!! |
Larry,what is BB?
I guess the re-tip cost is set by the particular dealer,you use.Shop around for the best pricing.
Best! |
Larry,should you have the verisimilitude to provide us with a fine review of the Orpheus,you can forget about owing me any wine!Let's face it.That was only a "pipedream" anyway -:)
Besides,why would you owe me anything?I enjoy interesting audio banter,and this is why I post.Though I would be "smitten" with a compelling comparison(if you have heard enough other competing designs,in familiar set-ups)to the other "fine transducers" that abound.
Best! |
BTW,Larry--I have always LOVED the Ovation!!Had a friend who owned one,with an air bearing arm.
Best! |
Larry,OK you can be my "new best friend"!! -:)
Best! |
Larry,as my son is starting his medical internship at George Washington Hosp/Med center,this June,and I will be visiting from time to time,so don't be so quick with the invites.Some of us fanatics may take your offer up!
Also,I checked out the Klipsh thread,about your upgrade process.Quite interesting.BTW,what polish/wax do you use for the finish?
I remember when I was in college,and working each summer as a letter carrier in NYC,I would walk into the better audio stores of the day,and was floored by the sheer mass that the Klipshorns presented.Of course I could not consider them at the time.One day I had a route that allowed me to deliver mail to Lyric Hi Fi.I remember being very impressed by the wonderful "new to me" stuff being sold there.Mike Kay was SO nice to this, then "young" and enamored college kid, that I never forgot his kindness,and the time he spent introducing me to quality audio products.Even though he knew I could not possibly purchase anything.A class act!!
BTW,I notice on the Klipsh site that many folks list ownership of Cornwalls,Hersheys(?) and others.Do people own multiple Klipshorns.Like the multi cartridge crowd?Whew!!Also would the addition of a superb super tweeter,like the Townshend or Murata,be an improvement?I've heard these can further some horn designs.I did hear the Townshends on a pair of wonderful Sonus Faber Extremas(WAY underrated speaker,with these tweets,btw)and they were superb.Totally seamless!
As to the Orpheus,though I love the quick comments from you,it would best serve us all if you waited about two more weeks before making definitive statements regarding performance.I guarantee you will find subtle changes will occur,and you will most likely revoice the arm/table accordingly.You'll then have a better handle on "things sonic"!Man,you are a lucky guy.God only knows when my set-up will be back,up and running.I sent out stuff,for mods and service and am beginning to wonder if I did the right thing(I know I did,but am running out of patience).In the meantime I must admit to be getting about 120 mph on my serve,literally,so I'm putting the time to a good cause.Yet,I'd rather be listening to my new music acquisitions,as of now.
Best of luck! |
Gary,WHEW!!Thanks! -:)
Best! |
Hey TUBES 108,"Shaddup"!!I was just beginning to begin my state of "audio satisfaction",without feeling the need to start to really consider pondering something new.I have a very nice Temper-v.I LIKE THAT STATE OF MIND!Now you have put a dent in my summer vacation plans,as I'll have to begin to start an "Orpheus fund".
Thanks for nothing!! -:) |
Nsgarsh,The comments made here,about the Orpheus are really NOT like the ZYX UNIV crowds'"never ending story"!Here we have a new,and interesting design that would obviously peak interest.Of course the Transfiguration "W" or "V" are superb,yet it's human nature to "scope out" new stuff,from mfgrs we like.In reality I have no intention of replacing my "V" until I'm satisfied that I've gotten my money's worth,by making sure I have a good amount of hours on it(which I don't).Regardless of how good the newer model is.Which I am ultimately interested in,and have a friend already "sold" on it(by "sneaky me").He will get it in September.I'll know,then,how much better than the "V" it performs,as he has almost the same system as me(except some cabling and speakers).
What the "UNIV" crowd had done(not that there is anything wrong here)was to extend,for over a year, the impression that it had almost NO competition,in their opinion,and followed it up with the continual mention(free adv here)of the "importer/seller's" name.The importer got a good amount of free press.Also,if you look at the website for ZYX,you will see the "rediculous" false list price,followed by the discounted price(which should actually be the stated price,ONLY).
This all came to pass once Mike Lavigne was nice enough to write a lengthly comparison of the UNIV vs "the world"(sort of).I loved his lengthly impressions!
BTW-I have heard the UNIV,and it is SUPERB,but I never felt it was heads above the potential competition.Even not hearing everything,as it was simple common sense to assume there were too many other fine choices.ALL VIABLE CONTENDERS!!
So here,we have some good press for the Orpheus,and some typical high marks for it,by enthusiastic owners/listeners,but I do not get the impression that this is anything other than "something new".For now!!I doubt we'll hear much about it a month from now.The more than a year long UNIV enthusiasm,though seemingly well deserved, would have carried more weight,to me,if there was not the constant mention of the "seller's" name,and the "seller/importer" should change the stupid,fake list price to reflect the "real" selling price.BTW-please no venom,I'm just "talking the hobby".We could ALL benefit from more directness,by hobbyists who are not so protective of their favorite "guys",and those "guys" allowing some hobbyists' emotion to surface,without losing their composure!Please!!
Of course there are some who simply have to have the last word!I'd be pleasantly surprised if this didn't happen.
BTW #2--After hearing a load of fine stuff at the VTV show,I stumbled(on Saturday)into a "little unassuming" room that has really/seriously impacted my "almost adv driven" (I'm influenced too,from time to time,though I do try to fight it)mentality.Nsgarsh,you and I have fairly big set-ups.Check this out---
I had spent the entire first half of Saturday listening to some fine SET and more complex/powerful tube based systems,with some quite nice solid state stuff thrown in,for good measure.I like both solid state,or tubes.Based upon the success of the overall system's "presentation".There were quite a few fine sounding,and interesting set-ups on display.I had a chance to audition(A/B) the Myabi Ivory against the XV1-s,in the same system.With two identical arms(DaVinci).The preamp was the Japanese Audionote megabucker,with Tron tube amps(and a prototype "somethings")driving hybrid Horning "big boys".INTERESTING!!The Myabi sounding more Koetsu like(romantic),with the Dynavector sounding more neutral and dynamic.Yet it was a stretch to declare a winner.Simply a matter of system voicing,and taste.I liked the XV-1s,but that's just me.Yet the little Allaerts,fronting a nice sounding alternative system,that was on display,clearly led me to believe that Raul is not crazy when he states how good these are.Superb timbres!Hard to do!
Now to the "little room", and surprise I stumbled upon,after hearing all the big stuff(megahorns/mega dynamic driver stuff/mega dipoles,mega prices,and "my own" stuff ain't cheap, etc).I was about to leave the show,and was aware of this sign(on the room's door) saying "back after 3:00".The room was basically closed all day,as the show was ending at 3:45.So I was lucky enough to have a "short window" to hear something so simple/special/logical/and OLD,that I am still thinking about how I will approach "home listening and system set-up" in the future.Sorry for the supposed sensationalizing.Which it is not!!Well, maybe a little,but it deserves this.
In this tiny "unofficial" room,like a character from a good novelette,was one of the nicest,most direct,and interesting fellows I have ever met,in this hobby.I simply "knew, without really knowing" that he had to also know my friend Sid(a classic person,in his own right).He did!
As I looked around a couple of other "lucky" showgoers stumbled in,as well.THEY NEVER LEFT!Actually, almost every guy,to the man,had almost the exact same reaction!It was SCARY!I heard "this is the most toe tapping room here".Or "this is simply amazing".Or " what is the front end/ source playing this stuff".Or,"I didn't even know you could do this,with that device".Even "where is the subwoofer"?Alot more compliments,but the point is that I heard a TINY pair of monitors,which this guy(Charles King) had said were Rogers LS3/5a clones,sitting atop two little inexpensive mini stools(sourced from somewhere like IKEA,hooked up with "el-cheapo" cabling(all other rooms had expensive stuff),and being driven with a twelve watt Dyna amp(circa 1970).The front ends were a Dyna tuner(Blew me away,playing classical opera),and two tape decks.One I had owned years ago.This was the Classic Tandberg unit,which he did not play!
The tape recorder he did play(and BOY is this thing jewel like,and Rolex gorgeous)was a rebuilt 1970 Stelovox unit.Playing 15.5 ips little tapes.The unit is really small,and you play a tape and reload,about every few minutes.There was a coffee table quality "art book" sitting on the chair,that he had obviously contributed to,which was all about these MAGNIFICENT Stelovox tape recorders.Think Leica,here!I told him he had better put it away,or fear someone walking out with it.Don't think the thought did not cross my mind.Though I'd never do that!Maybe Albert Porter has knowledge of these CLASSIC tape decks(what an incredible front end "music delivery system",these little jewels are).
This fellow was there to give a seminar on the history of tape recording,and he refurbishes the Stellovox units to the few "lucky" fans of this "classic" device.Apparently there are quite a few hobbyists that pick these up,and KNOW WHAT TO DO WITH THEM!Too bad I'm such a moron!I have basically shot my monetary load,for this year,with my most recent audio mods/expenditures.A couple of "thou" already this year,and I'll have to reload for next year.I pace myself,in my old age.
Sonically,everything was placed on "Crapola" hotel tables,for audiophile grade support -:),what we all heard was UNBELIEVABLE presence,naturalness,and huge,really HUGE stage size and depth(haunting actually,and I was not the only person stating this),followed by rediculously good "seemingly full range sound".I'd have to suspect it actually got down to about fifty hz.Yet WHAT a FIFTY hz!!!--CLEAN!!!--Like I seldom hear this level of CLEAN!---ANYWHERE!!---He also played some acoustic jazz.Having heard the same thing three weeks earlier on my friend Sid's huge,yet great set-up,I was shocked at how tuneful,pitch perfect and BIG,these little "baby shrimp" speakers could do this.I'm talking real power.I thought my Avalons were good at depth and stage.--HA!!--Don't believe me!I don't care!I pinched myself,and know it was NOT a dream!!
The little two way "clone" speakers were out about four feet into a small hotel room.When we switched to the Dyna tuner(remember circa 1970,but everything was rebuilt,and modded, and the "guy" knows what he's doing)to hear some opera,live btw,the harpsichord sounded SO real and the singer's voice so filled with beauty and natural texture that I decided to go back to the two or three other really good sounding rooms,for a comparison.Remember,the other rooms had very expensive stuff,and some were getting very good sound,for a show!It was a small show so there was not alot of external noise.It was as though I had NEVER really been to those rooms an hour earlier.Now they sounded,"well, err", flat out BAD!I had thought they were great,just a little time earlier,but I was now a "new" listener.For life!!It happened "that fast"!!Whew!!--I'm now thinking "Twilight Zone",and am beginning to get scared,and worried.I asked someone if they could actually see me.Just to confirm I hadn't died.Thank goodness they acknowledged my existence!!I tried to walk through a wall,and hurt my shoulder,but was glad to still be amongst the living,and listening!
NO CONTEST!!! COMPARED TO THOSE PREVIOUSLY GREAT SOUNDING ROOMS!!--I went back to the little "unofficial" room,again.Selling no equipment for the consumer.Just a set-up for the sake of demoing some tapes,on this no longer made tape machine.Nothing really special.--JUST FRIGGIN GREAT!!
This guy,Charles King,after hearing all the accolades coming his way from some "lucky to be in his room" showgoers,and most were actually exhibitors,taking a break(that told me something,there),had said to me "it's really amazing how little money you really have to spend,once you know what you are doing"!Now I have met another "classic music lover/treasure",to go along with Sid Marks!This is the kind of stuff that keeps the hobby fresh,to me.Yes,I do admit I'm not all there.My wife reminds me of this often.
Well after having recently heard the now famous,BIG BUCK, Nola Grand Ref system.Driven by all the stuff we hear/read about(ASR Emitter etc),with superb playing material,I do have to admit that if I was strong enough to actually listen to my heart,rather than my brain(which is not too big)and if I could have either of these systems,my choice would be the GREAT Mr King's "upstairs set-up".
He stated this was his secondary system,and was beginning to tell me what he used for "serious listening",when he was told to close up the "treasure chest",I mean room,and give his seminar.He never returned,and I had to go home.So I'll never know!
How much fun can this hobby be,when you are really open to new experiences,and don't have frozen conceptions of what is good?
Sorry for the lengthly rant(and please excuse me if some comments seemed condescending),but my system has been down for about three months now.Maybe I'm actually better off!
Best! |
The responsibility of ANY audio "best friend" is to try/buy ALL products of interest,to your pals!Then allow yourself to be the "moneyman/guinea pig",whereas all others can make a determination whether they,themselves, should obtain said equipment! I'll send you the authorized paperwork -:)
Best!BTW--nice(well thought out) setup!! |
Larry,I was not hinting at you needing to mod,or go to a super tweet.Just asking if you were familiar with it.A friend had mentioned that he knew of two horn based set-ups that added the Townshend,and it greatly helped.Not that it is a necessity,in a rig like yours.Sorry,if you felt I was insinuating a mod in a system I've not heard.I don't do stuff like that.
BTW,Steve Huntley completely re-built my pre/phono(Audio Research SP-15)and it is definitely world class.Cost me big bucks to do,but really worth it!
I've already laid the groundwork for one of my audio "best friends",who now owns a Temper-v,to upgrade to the Orpheus in early fall.God I'm so cruelly cunning sometimes,but when it comes to "things audio" I can't control myself!
Best!
Best! |
Tubes108,THANKS!!!!Really! |
The only differences in specs between the Temper-V and the Orpheus(I know it means little,but interesting anyway)is a very small difference in internal impedence,and a slightly higher output and new body style,in the Orpheus.I hope the slightly higher output did not tip comparisons in favor of the Orpheus.I'm fairly certain this was NOT the case,in the comments from those hearing both designs,but believe me I've seen stuff like this before.
Best! |
Larry,could you let me know what equipment you have,as well as the LP's you use to determine a cartridge's performance?
Thanks,in advance. |
Larry,I could not be definitive that an upgrade to an Orpheus would be comparatively priced,as the Temper to Temper-V,which was two years ago,for me.I'd like for you to PLEASE post your thoughts,regarding comparisons with the Temper,once you've gotten the new cart. broken in.Also,perhaps you may "now" have some thoughts as to the new Orpheus,in general.
I have tried to get some info on this cart. but my particular dealer is out of the loop,as he claims it's too new.Though I did see the info on a website,but would love to know how much I'd have to spring for,should it really trump the Tranny-v!
P.S.--Raul,if you're reading this,and have some clout with Jan Allaerts -:)I would seriously consider trading my Tranny-v for the Formula One,possibly the "Finish"too! -:)Since I'm quite idiosyncatic as to what "floats my boat",those are about the only two cartridges that currently appeal enough to me,for me to move to,"ear unheard"(that expression doesn't quite have the same ring as "sight unseen")!Well,I would go for an Olympos or Koetsu Coral,as a friend has both(the bastard)and I trust his sensibilities.
Best! |
Nsgarsh,like you I am already "blown away" with how superb,already, the "underated" Trannies can perform.Of course that would consist of an arm that was NOT "sibilent",as it would destroy the magic.-:)Since both our arms are not of the "sibilent" variety-:)we have nothing to worry about!Heh,heh!(stroke of my moustache).
In all seriousness,I too have the Boulez performance you mention,and it is a "corker"!I have at least a half dozen Firebirds,and can really recommend the early pressing Mercury with Dorati,for the incredible double basses in the opening movements.Warmth and power at the same time,along with a huge,wide stage,that the Mercury pressings were famous for.I'm talking real/gorgeous/almost scary tonal balance,when "right".We're talking midbass resolution,as opposed to deep bass power,which is there too.BTW,the Speakers Corner Reissues are superb,but an early original has better tone color,across the board.That is why we love the "super cartridges".They can portray this clearly.Hard to quantify the difference between the "great cartridges" if you make a steady diet of heavy metal,and rock,though some of that stuff is loads of fun.I could never bring myself to getting rid of my rock collection.
I do look forward to your future comments,Larry.Take you're time.It will probably take a good few weeks for breakin and revoicing.Don't feel pressure to post quickly,just to satisfy "nuts" like me!Just do it soon -:)
I do know that the Trannys are considered in the highest echelon of designs,in some quarters,but they haven't caught on for a long haul in the U.S.I hope that is NOT one reason for a new model,but I'm always suspicious of newer models.One reason why I never warmed up to the Eidolon speaker,after living with my Ascents.
Sorry for the rant.
Best! |
Larry,though I do love your comments,the fact that your original Temper-v was bought used,and then began to degrade(I had a Temper that was still going strong for 8 yrs,before I upgraded to the "V")kind of dulls down the comparison.I mean this with all due respect,and have NO doubt the newer model(Orpheus) is better,as you hear it!
Transfigurations of the past have all been better in each new generation.My friends have owned about three or four different vintages,and that was the case,so I'm sure the Orpheus is the best of the lot!
In any event,I'm really happy that you are getting such satisfaction from yours,but remember that your "V" was not a fair comparison!
Best! |
Larry,I may have some "egg dripping down my face",as of this morning!!To be specific,I was awaiting my wife and daughter,who were shopping.I was in a bookstore,waiting for them when I began to read some of the British audio mags.
Well,it appears that the Orpheus has gotten a big headstart in merry old England!It was NOT formally reviewed,but WAS mentioned quite a bit,in some general discussions,revolving around some superb equipment.
One was a review of the NEW SME 20/12 table(I think that is the designation)which has the new 12 inch SME arm.The Orpheus was also mentioned,in a very favorable light,in other areas of discussion.
It appears that this will get a superb amount of good press.The overall impression I got,was very similar to your "obviously accurate" comments!
So,regardless of the "newness" of your now defunct Temper-v,you seem to be "on the money" with your Orpheus comments!!
Maybe some day,when I finally get my amp back(like in a month,if I'm lucky)I will actually be able to hear some TRANNY music again.It might not be an Orpheus,but GOD do I want to hear my record collection,again!!!
Three months without my little late night private listening sessions,really SUCKS!!
I WANT MY MUSIC AGAIN!!!!
Best! |
Larry,Hi Fi News and Record Review!
Also,if your CD sound was equal to your analog,before the Orpheus,than maybe I do not have egg dripping down my face -:)The Temper-V should have "smoked" a digital system(regardless of vintage,and I have a good one too)in areas of detail, and information retreival,ease,stage,etc.HMM! -:)
Best! And I do look forward to your future comments,but be careful because I don't want to irritate the ZYX crowd with too much Orpheus info,at my behest! -:)Just kidding!
BTW--If things go my way,and as the Orpheus is still big bucks to update from a Temper,I'm seriously thinking about jumping ship,and moving to one of the two top Allaerts models,next year.
I had ten years with different Koetsus,and now ten years with the Transfiguration vintages.I'm beginning to suspect that my loyalties don't go much beyond a decade,with small transducers.Of course I also suspect Raul may think I could go longer with an Allaerts,as I have a superb low noise,high gain phono section!
Time will tell! |
Larry,I seem to get the impression that the older(circa 1962,like yours)Klipshorns are the most desireable.Is this so,and why?Just my curiosity.Surely they must be great.
Also,if you've been following the analog threads for the last year and a half you will have noticed some superb correspondence regarding some of the finest "small transducers" around.NOT speakers,but cartridges,which can have a HUGE impact on an already high resolution system!
Sorry ZYX UNIV folks(you know who you are) -:)
There may be a new kid on the block,in the Orpheus,and due to my financial equity in the Temper,I simply have to find an excuse to love the Orpheus!!
What say YE, O' exalted UNIV crowd? -:)
Larry,thanks for the complimentary reference to my wonderful son.Sadly,he is given to trying,STILL,to get a rise out of his mom,so he's leaning on work with infectious disease!!Why can't he just be a dermatologist,or something like that,I say!He won't have any of it!
Best! |
I doubt if I could find the '62 gloss hardwoods,and original finish.Besides those suckas are heavy.I really don't have the same desire to constantly upgrade as I did some years ago.That's one reason I really like your set-up,and "audio mentality".I can identify with your decision to update/modify what you like,and build a really good/unique system to suit your tastes.Not the advertising hype!That's where I'm at these days.I like the idea of having a very well thought out,modded/updated system,that is unique to me.Not that I'm necessarily correct,but that's how I go about things,in my old age!BTW-the best set-ups I've heard,and I have heard a ton,are by serious hobbyists who like a specific combination of stuff,and set about refining that stuff.There are a load of different sounding,but fabulous systems out there.I love them all!!
Yet,I like having a very desireable,diverse music collection,above all!
Good luck with your wonderful hobby!
Best! |
Roy,as a Temper-V owner,I was curious to get info on this,as well.I know a fellow "poster",named Karl Heinz claims to own one.
I have asked him,on his "audio system" threads,to please give a description,if possible,yet he has not responded.
I also asked the dealer,who sold me the (wonderful,btw)Temper-V for some kind of info,but even he could not come up with anything.Frustrating,but what else is new,in the world of "high end audio"?
My reason for interest is obvious,yet my current Temper-V has few hours on it,and is really a "killer" cartridge in my Graham 2.2("sorry Dougy" -:).
However, past opgrades in the Transfiguration line,from my dealer,has only cost me the re-tip costs,for a completely new cartridge.Hence,my interest!!
I also have a good friend,owning a Temper-V(2.2 ,and "Toto too"),who would move with me,if I could get some darn info,on this supposedly new cartridge!
What gives,anyone??????
Best! |
Nsgarsh,nice to hear from ya!A couple of points,that I may not be accurate about,but here goes.Firstly, why would a lower compliance necessarily be better?Especially at 9 grams. Also,from the experience of myself,and all my audio friends,a lower output design produces better subtle detailing and overall sound,and is preffered by us.A stronger magnet would surely be better!Do you know if this is actually the case,or is it conjecture?Fewer coil windings would be nice,once again do you know if this is so?
Don't get me wrong!Based on the track record of Trannies,and the two I've owned,the later designs always were clearly better than their previous models.I hope this is the case here,as I'm betting it is!However, knowing how the "business of things" usually works,especially those "things audio",I like to let things play out,before "jumping out of the groove"!With all of the newer competing designs always coming out and getting their exposure,it would seem logical for Transfiguration to have a new model designation.No?We'll see how well received this new,and interesting design plays out.I hope it trounces my Temper-v,and am already working on a deep pocketed pal,to go for it.I'll know soon enough,as I do his installations.He currently has a Temper-v!
If it gets anywhere near the postings of the ZYX Univ,it will surely be on my short list of new toys,next holiday season!Sorry,Dougy!!-:)I'm a "Tranny Guy"!-:)Now you know!-:)
Best! |
