Time for a total system upgrade


Hello Audiogon members! I never imagined a site like this existed! Who ever put it together should be appropriately rewarded! Let me introduce myself: I’ve enjoyed music all of my life, played trumpet for about 10 years, and have listened to quite a bit of live music. During college, of all times, I discovered “audiophile” equipment and so began the affliction! Now, after a long hiatus from serious investment in listening equipment – career changes and finally Grad school – it’s time to update the system. Quite honestly, I’m kind of giddy about finally having some money to spend on the sound system. After all, it’s probably a better investment than my 401K! But let’s not open that wound… Let me start by listing the current components (please, no laughing!):

Audible Illusions Modulus 2B preamp
Superphon DM200 dual mono power amp
Sony DVD/CD player – moderate quality, non-progressive
AR turntable and arm – unmodified
Benz Micro cartridge
Techniques Tuner – el cheapo
Various Monster interconnects
NHT 1.5 with stands
Phase sub woofer

Here’s what I’d like to do: update the 2-channel system and add home theater. I realize this will necessitate certain trade-offs at the outset. Would like to keep a dedicated 2-channel system that can run through an analogue bypass in the HT pre/pro. The ratio of music to HT is about 50-50. Music includes classical, jazz, Black gospel choirs (wife), female vocals and some contemporary stuff. Here’s the budget so far, but I’ve got some wriggle room if really justified:

Multi-channel power amp - $1500 (used or demo)
HT Pre/Pro - $1500 (used or demo) must have component video out
Progressive DVD/CD - $800 (new, used or demo)
Main speakers (for now, NHT’s move to the rear for 5.1) - $1500 – 2000
Center channel speaker - $500
Update the Tube pre - $1200 (used or demo)

What has worked with the current system: soundstage, some detail and transparency, good volume capability without any listener fatigue. What it lacks: bass that’s integrated and not tubby, more detail and transparency, 5.1 capabilities. I’ve come to enjoy, perhaps prefer, the tube sound for a pre, but still want the power and transient response of the SS amp. Here’s what I’ve listened to so far:

Rotel RMP 1075, 1095, RSP 1066, RDV 1080
Anthem MCA20, Anthem AVM20
Classe stuff, but out of the budget
Sony DVP S9000ES
B&W 604 series, CDM9NT’s
Paradigm Studio 40’s and 100 v.2

Also considering:
B&K Reference 30
B&K 7250
Anthem AVM2
Anthem MCA 50
New tube preamp? (Anything from Audio Research, Conrad Johnson, etc)
Energy Veritas 2.3 speakers

So here’s the subjective part. And believe me, I know these are just my very uninformed opinions. One significant thing I’ve noticed so far is listener fatigue, something I’ve never before experienced. This occurs after several hours of critical listening in dedicated rooms. Don’t know if this is the SS preamp, speakers or what. Whatever the case, I can’t imagine investing in new gear that’s fatiguing. In terms of music reproduction, the B&W 600’s were quickly eliminated. The CDM 9nt had very good detail and transparency, but lacked a solid bottom end. The Paradigm 100 v.2 had a tremendous bottom end, almost too much, but sounded rather veiled when compared to the CDM 9nt (same electronics). Have thought of using the CDM 1NT for the mid and high detail in combination with a pair of good subs to drive the bottom end.

What are your thoughts and recommendations on the new system? Rather than a 5-channel amp, would it make any sense to add 2-channel and 3-channel amps to preserve a dedicated 2-channel system? BTW, sorry for the HUGE post. Thank you very much for taking the time to read and respond!
horn_blower

Showing 1 response by nighthawk

Your speaker/amp combination will be the major determinant of the amount of listening fatigue you experience. My advice is listen to a lot of speakers, pick one, then find an amp that will drive them suitably. Since you seem to like speakers with a warm character, I'd recommend Soliloquy, Vandersteen, and Vienna Acoustics. Meadowlarks and ProAcs are also considered non-fatiguing but I haven't heard them. Basically, to minimize fatigue, chose speakers with soft dome tweeters instead of metal domes. If you chose a planar, like a Magnepan, your will need a high-current amplifier (a good idea anyway).

A lot of SS amps sound bright. You may need to spend more than you think to get a decent sounding one. It is hard to beat a used Rowland for the money.

Good idea to move the NHTs to the rears.

I recommend buying a mid-priced HT receiver, such as a Denon 3803, instead of an HT pre/pro. This eliminates your need for a multi-channel amp and gives you all the latest surround sound decoding formats. It also saves some money and allows you to spend more on the main speakers/amp combination where it will make the most difference in sound quality. The amps in the receiver are plenty good for HT duties. Use the amps in the receiver for the center and surrounds and power your mains with your power amp driven from the pre-outs of the receiver. Cardas Neutral Reference will work well for the IC from the receiver to the power amp (about $250 used). This cable is very neutral and non-fatiguing and is a great performer for the money. Use the DAC in the receiver as your source with the DVD player you already have as a transport.

This system will give you a baseline to build from. Live with it for a while before spending any more money. Try your pre-amp between the pre-outs of the receiver and the power amp. You may find you don't need a pre-amp. However, if you like the sound of the pre-amp in the circuit, you can use it for 2-channel and only use the receiver when you want to play movies. You'll need an external DAC or a CD player if you use a pre-amp.

Cabling can make or break a system. If you find the system is too bright, try some warm or warm/neutral cables such as Cardas, Audience, or Nirvana. Kimber tends to sound fast and neutral. Copper cables tend to sound warmer than silver ones. The Cable Co. has a rental program that lets you try out many types and applies your rental fee towards purchase.

You said you need component video connections on your HT pre/pro. You will get a little better picture if you connect your DVD player directly to your TV and only use the pre/pro for audio processing. That said, the Denon 3803 has component switching if you want to use it for convenience's sake.