Thinking of Magnepan ... finally!
Until recently, most of my amps have been tube-based with the exception of a few great SS integrateds thrown into the mix for fun. That's probably the main reason I have stayed away from Magnepans (or other speakers of its ilk) thus far. Now that I have an Aavik U-280 integrated amp that can do 300 watts @ 8 ohms and doubles to 600 @ 4, I would love to scratch that itch finally. Keep in mind that I do not intend to get rid of my other speakers (Joseph Audio Perspective2 Graphene, Harbeth SHL5+, Fritz Carrera BE) since I love them all for different reasons. The Magnepans will be rotated in the main listening room with Joseph Audio Perspectives. One thing I like about Maggies is that they are relatively lightweight so I can move them to the closet without breaking my back when not in rotation.
Since I've never owned Magnepans before, I have a ton of questions and doubts. So here we go ...
Bass (or the lack thereof) -- I've been told that the Magnepans are very light on bass and definitely require at least on subwoofer. Is this true in all cases? Anyone using them without subs and happy with the performance? TBH, I really would prefer that I don't use subs but not set in stone for sure.
Breathing Room -- my room is 20' x 15' with 12 foot ceilings. The speakers will be placed along the short wall (15'). I can pull them out by about 4.5 feet from the front wall and 3 feet from the side walls. Seating distance will be approximately 8 - 9 feet. Is this good enough or do you think more distance, especially from the front wall, is required to truly enjoy the speakers?
Mods -- I've also heard that the stock components (crossovers, fuses, etc.) and stands are suboptimal. Is this true? If so, what are the minimum requirements to bring the speaker to a higher standard and at what cost?
Value -- For someone who is just starting out with Maggies, which model is a good entry point? I know that LRS+ is a good value, but my other speakers are very very good, so I want to do justice to the Maggies as well. But at the same time I don't want to spend more than I need to. Where do you think the sweet spot lies, i.e. which model(s)? I will be looking for used only since I've already spent way too much on other speakers.
Imaging -- I've also been told that imaging on Maggies is not that great. I have never heard Maggies before so I have no idea if this assertion is true or not. Your thoughts?
And finally, I want to hear from folks who love their Maggies. What is that you love most about the speakers? What qualities do they bring to the table that no other speaker does? Are there magnetic planar speakers from other brands that I should also be considering? Keep in mind they have to be readily available in the used market. So please don't suggest something that doesn't meet this requirement.
However, to bring some balance to the feedback, I would also love to hear from those who tried Magnepans and moved on to something else. Why? What was it that you didn't like about them? What did you move on to?
Thanks in advance and a sincere request: Please keep it civil ... no need for haters of Magnepan to use this as an opportunity to diss the brand.
Thanks for the feedback. I am going to give it a try. One reason I want to do this is because I was reading a review of my RAAL CA-1a headphones, and the reviewer stated that it sounded like a Maggie without the room issues. I have both the RAAL SR1a and CA-1a phones and I have yet to hear speakers that sound better than them (the room is a big factor as is the ribbon driver). I also have a great amp in the office, a CODA #16, and it is not really getting a workout with my KEF LS50 Meta. I sold my KEF KC62 sub last month and bought it back yesterday for the LRS+. That was a $200 loss. 😀 I will alternate between the LS50 + KC62 and the LRS+ and KC62. |
@campoly I did read that FAQ and also asked Magnepan a question about my room (no response yet). Whatever the case I am going to buy it and give it a try. Reading here about the popularity of the LRS+ makes it an easy resale. Though I think it will work based on what I have read and the feedback I got. |
Not sure if I have vast experience, just recent experience. I placed a 50% deposit on the LRS+ today. I may get lucky and get the LRS+ this week, otherwise, maybe another 3 months of waiting. I emailed Maga Risers earlier today and will order a stand from them when they get back to me. I can get about 36 inches from the front wall. I also have the room treated. I had the Thiel CS3.7 in the same room for 2 years and while not allowing it to shine at its full potential, it was not a bad setup. The LRS+ should be a bit easier to setup. I will sit about 8 feet away. I sit with my back to the speakers and have an additional 4 feet of open closet space in front of me. That extra space was a big help. I can keep the speakers about 6-7 feet apart. I also have the KEF KC62 subwoofer, which I sold last month and bought back last week (for the LRS+). That was a painful $200 loss. BTW - after about a decade of waiting, I also plan to buy my Livingroom speaker tomorrow, the Yamaha NS5000. I will be using my modded PeachTree GAN1 on it (don’t laugh it is an excellent amplifier after the mods). In my office, I will be using a CODA #16 amp on the LRS+. I was expecting to get the KEF Blade 2 Meta but I have a kids birthday party happening this month at my home and the thought of all those kids near an unprotected Blade drivers made me go with the NS5000. The GAN1 can also drive the NS5000, I doubt the GAN1 could properly drive the Blades. |
@arafiq I got lucky. When I called the dealer on Monday they said a new delivery was expected the next day. Lucky for me they had an extra unclaimed pair. I will pick them up on Sunday but will only be able to listen on Monday. @jjss49 I sold my AHB2 monos because I liked the modded PeachTree GAN1 more and I also like the simplicity of the GAN1 system. My CODA #16 has become my favorite amp now, The PeachTree GAN1 next fav, and then the AHB2. They AHB2 have a sonic signature that I think I like the best, but I am finding it underpowered. For high sensitivity speakers I would put them on the top of my list, but I never get high sensitivity speakers. I also got a great deal on the Yamaha NS5000 speaker yesterday (for a bigger Livingroom) and bought them too. I had to trade in my Lumin X1 DAC for that, but that is where the PeachTree GAN1 saves the day. I am done now speaker shopping. I was hoping to use the AHB2 mono's + Audience FrontRow speaker cables (very short length) for the NS5000 if that ever materialized. I really did not expect this purchase to happen, However, I sold the AHB2's before I got the very agreeable deal on the NS5000. I think the PeachTree GAN1 will work very nicely but if it does not then another CODA #16 would be great.
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I setup the LRS+ this morning in my office, 12 x 11 x 9 with 4 additional feet in the closet where my desk is stuffed. The room is treated, and I think it is sonically in very good shape. I learned over the weekend that my Benchmark LA4 preamp has an issue with the RCA outs and maybe the mono summed XLR outputs for a sub. I was blaming the KEF KC62 sub all this time for my sub issues, it was the RCA and mono summed on the LA4. The LA4 was sent back to Benchmark this morning for repairs. I only have my modded PeachTree GAN1 available now with 'preamp' capability and I cannot use my KC62 sub with it (at least the way I want to do it). I have connected the LRS+ to the GAN1 and put them 3 feet out and 60 inches between the speakers. I am 84 inches away, so 70% space between the speakers and my distance from them. I sit with my back to the speakers and have 4 feet extra space in front of me. My initial reaction. This thing kicks arse. Have 200-300 hours more to hear the full deal. I decided to use the GAN1 as my RAAL CA-1a headphone amp. I got a 25-foot headphone adapter cable from RAAL on Sunday and that is amazing, so I now have headphones in 2 rooms with 1 system. That also means I need to buy a second preamp, a Benchmark LA4 or a Rotel Mitchi P5 for my office and Livingroom. Thus, the KC62 sub will soon be setup with the LRS+ and the 2nd preamp. A CODA #16 will be the amp for the LRS+. BTW - If you only want to stream, the modded GAN1 at $1500 is a screaming deal for the LRS+. I have tuners and DACs to add into my office system so the GAN1 will not work there.
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@arafiq Unfortunately, I have not been able to hear the LRS+ at its best. I think I need a sub and I cannot use a sub easily without my Benchmark LA4 preamp. I sent the preamp in for repairs, and it was found to be working fine. So, when the unit returns today, I will be interested to see if the sub will work. I have been using the LRS+ with my modded Peachtree GAN1 and it sounds great. The sound is clear, large, and COHERENT. I think this coherence thing is the most important to me. I say this because my RAAL SR1a and CA1a phones are incredibly coherent and the best things I have ever heard, until today. I got delivery of my Yamaha NS5000 speakers yesterday. The 3 drivers are made out of the same material, and I believe that aids in the coherency of the sound. Listening to the not even broken in NS5000 with my Peachtree GAN1 was mind-blowing. That was goosebump level sound. The LRS+ has a similar quality above the low bass region to the NS5000. In my small room the speaker is the best I have had in this space. The others include, LS50, LS50 Meta, Audience 1+1, and Thiel CS3.7. The LRS+ is better than all of these. The LS50 Meta + KC62 sub is maybe equivalent. I preface this by saying in my small room. In an hour or so, when my preamp returns, I will hook up the LRS+ with my CODA #16 and the KC62 sub. If you are not familiar with the #16, it is in my opinion one of the best amps at any price. The LRS+ is my long-term keeper now, even before I hear it with the sub. It is that good. It lacks a bit of the dynamics of the LS50 Meta and the KC62 sub, but I have the LS50 Meta available to switch it around if needed. However, now that I got the NS5000 I have a feeling the LS50 Meta will not go back into rotation. The NS5000 is substantially better than the LRS+ and maybe anything else I have heard except the KEF Blade. Though the driver on the LRS+ and the NS5000 are likely better than the Blades. BTW - over 125 hours on the LRS+. I was going to buy this one but got an incredible trade in offer for my Lumin X1 DAC. Bonus points for the NS5000 being the most attractive speaker I have seen. The photos do not do it justice. The LRS+ not so much. Yamaha NS-5000 3-Way Bookshelf Speakers with Stands Customer Return (P — Safe and Sound HQ
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I lucked out and managed to grab my Benchmark LA4 preamp before the CVS drugstore where it was dropped off closed. A total mess-up on UPS delivery. I now have the CODA #16 | LRS+ | KC62 sub setup and the bottom-end is now present. It is a nice combo, and I am glad I bought back the KC62 after I just sold it. I got it just for the LRS+ thinking I would like the LRS+. A good move. I need to setup the sub better, but I have a winning combo now (a little too much bass at present).
BTW - my wife came into the office and said I have new speakers. The LRS+ has been there for 2 weeks. She said that it looks great though I am not that impressed by the looks. She also said it is a much better-looking speaker than the 2 penises I had before, the Thiel CS3.7. |
@arafiq I am now somewhere around 300-400 hours on the LRS+. I listen to it from 9AM to about 9PM, later headphones, I am busy with work so a lot of music these days. I have noticed that the speakers have really opened up and sound very clean. It has more bass than expected. However, I finally got my KEF KC62 sub positioned properly with longer Benchmark RCA interconnects. I crossed over at 50Hz on the sub. Wow, that made the system go up several notches. The KEF sub is very fast as is the LRS+. I was using the PeachTree GAN400 amp with the LRS+ and Holo Serene preamp. It was OK for the longest time, and I was considering returning the GAN400 because I wanted great. However, adding the sub and maybe more hours on the LRS+ just blew those plans out of the water. The GAN400 is staying. It is a fast-sounding amp and I think mates well with the fast LRS+ and KC62 sub. A lot of toe-tapping listening. I have a better speaker in the Yamaha NS5000 downstairs but listening to the LRS+ does not make me feel I am losing out. It is a different presentation from the NS5000. The LRS+ has a more wall-of-sound presentation in my small room and I like that. The NS5000 has a more traditional cone speaker presentation but those drivers are incredible. The LRS+ sounds a lot like the RAAL SR1a phones with my VM-1a tube amp. The RAAL sounds a bit better but maybe moving up the Magenpan lineup evens things out. I like the NS5000 setup a bit more than the RAAL setup.
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I am back to listening to the LRS+ with the modded PeachTree GAN1, which is a heck of an amp. It would be perfect if I did not listen to FM over the airwaves. FM is a big part of my day, so I need to use an amp | preamp | tuner and so cannot just use the GAN1. I returned the PeachTree GAN400 which is pretty good but not as amazing as the modded GAN1. The GAN1 has shown me that 200 watts is good enough for the LRS+ in my small room. I am thinking of getting a Benchmark AHB2 again to rotate the CODA #16 and the AHB2 with both speakers. The 100 watts on the AHB2 and almost 200 watts at 4 Ohm could be good enough. The NS5000 is sounding great. I moved things around in the Livingroom/son’s playroom and I have a good placement now. Essentially nothing of consequence in-between the speakers. The sound of the NS5000 takes me away into the music, it is even better than the RAAL SR1a phones and VM-1a tube amp. I never thought would say that. I think the Zylon drivers on the NS5000 are more advanced than the almost 15-year-old Thiel CS3.7 drivers. The soundstage on the Thiel CS3.7 may have been a bit bigger. Though the NS5000 is good at that too. Looking at the old fashioned NS5000 you would not think it sounds as good as it does, but Yamaha seems to know what they are doing. It is a very beautiful speaker. My wife was happy that I sold the 2 pen_s’s, which she called the CS3.7. A shame I am not really able to listen too much. That will happen on Jan 1, 2024.
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The LRS+ I had were relatively close to the side wall. The most interesting aspect was that the acoustic panels on the LEFT and RIGHT for the first reflection point were NOT needed. They were needed for all other cone speaker and the Audience 1+1 V3 speaker that I tried in the small office. With the LRS+ removing the side panel improved the soundstage and did not cause any negative side effects. The LRS+ was the easiest speaker I had for placement in my small office. I sold the LRS+ since I no longer have this room. I did use acoustic panels behind the speaker and behind my seating position. BTW - The Sanders Magtech amp is made for Maggies (my sales plug). The KEF KC62 sub is what I used with the LRS+ set at 50hz.
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After selling the LRS+ a few weeks ago I turned around and got a used Magnepan Mini for my new smaller office space. A question for you Maggies owners out there? I was using the Audience FrontRow speaker cables with my LRS+, but I need more speaker cabling for the Mini since it has 3 panels. I read a single post online from someone that seemed to know their stuff. That person stated that Maggies are not that dependent on speaker cables. The person also said to use 10 AWG or 12 AWG speaker cables. Is this something that others have noticed with their Maggies? What cables are you using? I plan to do a shootout with the Schitt Aegir v1 monoblocks (70 @ 8) vs the Sanders Magtech (500 @ 8 | 900 @4). I have both in the house. I am hoping that for the Mini’s the Aegir will be good enough and I can sell the Magtech to raise cash. Anyone using Aegir monos with the Maggies? @arafiq You should have a listen to the Diptyque panel speakers. Shop New Diptyque - The Music Room (too bad they raised the prices) before you get deep into the Maggies. There is an interesting YouTube video where one of the Maggi principles hears one of the Diptyque at an audio show. He was impressed.
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@northman Thanks, I just ordered the 10 AWG Blue Jean cable. I need 2 sets for the Mini and it cost $200 for all of it. I will put my Audience FrontRow with 1 set of the Blue Jean and compare it with the 2 sets of the Blue Jean. Unfortunately, my second set of Audience FrontRow is spade-2-spade and that will not work with the Mini. That would have been an apple-2-apples comparison. The FrontRow has been significantly better than all other speaker cables I used with my prior speakers and also my current Yamaha NS5000. I used it with the sold LRS+ (my current spare cable) and it was better than my WyWIre speaker cables, so that is interesting. |
The Mini was really the only option I have for my current space. It will not be on a desk, and there will be an unobstructed path from the speakers to my ears. I was not really particularly about getting a Maggie, but I already have a great amp for Maggies and I have the KEF KC62 sub with all the cabling to make it work. It was the easiest path. Here is a discussion on speaker cable for Maggies. What are the best Speaker Cables for Magneplanars? - General Forum - Audiophile Style I will find out if this is true starting today. My Mini Maggies arrive in a few hours, and I have the 10 AWG Blue Jean speaker cables already in the house. I will try the Audience FrontRow on the bass module of the Mini and also the satellites. Not a perfect comparison with the pure Blue Jean cable setup but it should have some value. Mini Maggie System – magneplanar
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@mclinnguy I am not making a general statement that speaker cables do not matter. I have been using the Audience FrontRow speaker cable on my now sold LRS+ (office) and my Livingroom systems. This cable can compete with any cable at any price. It was easy to hear the difference on my Livingroom system when I did a speaker cable shootout last year. What I am trying to determine is if I did not need to use the FrontRow on the LRS+ in the first place. Today I have setup the Magnepan Mini system with my KEF KC62 sub. The only difference between the LRS+ system I had, and the Mini system today are the following:
The similar parts are the following:
Even on this still breaking in speaker cables it seems like the Mini is smoother sounding and a bit more detailed than the LRS+. I will be giving this about 2 weeks of heavy play and then putting in the spare FrontRow to the bass panel of the Mini (from the amp) to see what happens. Given how good the Blue Jean is already sounding I would not be surprised if I sell my spare FrontRow cables to recoup some costs.
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I have over 12 hours on my Blue Jean speaker cable and the Mini was bought used so it is broken in. At this early point I can easily say the Mini setup is sounding better than the LRS+ system. The top end is a bit better and there is more clarity in the Mini. This is a massive home run for me. What a great speaker and it cost $1000 used. The best speaker I have used in my office. The 3.7 must be a very nice speaker given how the Mini is said to be a miniaturized 3.7. BTW - I was thinking of selling the Sanders Magtech before I got the Mini. Now that I have heard it on the Mini there is no chance. I thought the Sanders maybe a little bright on the LRS+, but it is not on the Mini. It was the LRS+ that was slightly bright. The Sanders is 500 @ 8 and 900 @ 4. Roger Sanders told me it was made specifically for the Maggies (by CODA). I did not think it was amazing on my Yamaha NS5000 speaker, but on the Maggies, it is an exceptional amp.
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GIK did the treatments in my prior larger office. They were perfect with all the speakers I had except the LRS+. With the LRS+ I removed the panels for the first reflections and the sound was better (soundstage). I kept the panels behind the speakers and also behind my seating position. The arbitrator of what stayed was ear fatigue. This was another reason I got the Mini since the Maggies seem to have less side reflection issues. |
An interesting observation for me today with my Mini. I switched over to my Schitt Aegir monoblock amps which run at 70 watts 8 Ohm in Class A. Not sure about 4 Ohm. All other gear was the same. The sound was a little more rounded than my Sander Magtech (Class AB). The sound was also rather boomy. I was getting fatigued and was thinking that I needed to put some of the GIK panels back behind the speaker to tame this sound. However, I gave all my panels away so that is not an option anymore. I put back my Sanders Magtech and the boominess and fatigue went away. This was without any acoustic treatment in a weird room.. I am assuming that the Mini was not well served on the low end by the Aegir and the boominess was the result. My takeaway is to use a very powerful amp with the Mini. I am surprised I am not getting any sonic issues with the Sanders. It sounds great. After a few more days with the 10 AWG Blue Jean speaker cable, it is no longer a question of whether I am keeping the cable. I put my Audience FrontRow up for sale. I am not even trying it on the Mini because I would need to rearrange some things to make the short FrontRow cable work. I also do not care for any marginal improvement, if it even exists, with the FrontRow. The Blue Jean cost under $300 for 2 sets and the short FrontRow speaker cable was about $5k MSRP.
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