Tekton Double Impacts

I use Herbies sliders and love them! Sound great and so easy to move the speakersas needed. Great!

@nitewulf  LOL!

I bet they sound very good. My wife would cry, not laugh, at first sight. No way they could could ever be in our living room. I would love to hear them however. 

Goodness you are a lucky man Kenny! If I had a set of the DI speakers I would go to town! I would place the crossover outside the speaker for sure in its own special box with vibration control etc...

I would use the best parts in the crossover and the beauty would come from the inside, not the outward apprearance of these babies😁Well the beautiful sound would surely help me forget about the looks. Actually the beautiful sound may well help me to see them as outwardly attractive over time. 

It just occurred to me that the very first speaker I purchased as a junior in high school, with my life savings, was a set of Micro Acoustic speakers with a 5 tweeter array back in 1978-79. I loved the big and open sound! I purchased them at Tech HiFi after listening many, many times at the Nashua, NH store location.
http://audiokarma.org/forums/index.php?threads/micro-acoustics-frm-1ax.441659/

I remember my set having a 5 tweeter array, but this picture shows a 4 tweeter array I think? You could also adjust the tweeter output level. Good idea for Eric.

I bet Eric was inspired by the same speaker!

Understood and just having fun. I hope to someday hear these as I own a highly modified, and improved, set of AZ Crescendo speakers that I love.....but always open minded.

On paper his design sure looks promising and innovative! 

I will also add that his innovation has and will continue to  impact the direction of many current and future speaker builders. Innovation is a wonderful thing for us all!

 Chris I also miss Paul of TRL. I also owned the Samson monoblocks twice and loved them. The only other SS amp I like as much happened to be hybrid types. I liked the Aesthetix Atlas and a CJ  ET250s. They were not as fast or extended as Paul's very last version of the Samson amps which he incorporated some new learnings. 

I have mostly owned great tube amps and in the end always came back to tubes. Well, this has changed over the last year and a half since owning the Lynfdorf 2170 dac/amp/room correction unit. This 20 pound all in one box has me scratching my head and not longing for tubes still. Is it the very short signal paths, absence of ICs and power cords etc... due to everything being in one unit? Is it their cutting edge digital technology and innovation around Class D amplification? Is it the SOTA room correction that removes the room from the equation and causes your speaker to sound as intended by the builder? Yes to all! 

I would love to hear the DIs with this unit after room correction has been run. 

In the end I am guessing one of the speakers will stay in your main rig, not both. Let us know which one stays put in this #1 position. Thanks for all your posts here. Good stuff for us interested in this speaker.

Kenny, better not call and just let it go as you are happy with what you have and have no need for this digital mumbo gumbo box of mine. 😀

Belles makes great sounding amps and this amp below (link) is a fine deal. I owned it and the more powerful 350 ref. Having owned many nice SS amps from the likes of TRL, Electrocompaniet, Aesthetix, CJ, Blue Circle, Monarchy Audio, Levinson, McIntosh, and others I can tell you  Belles amps are worthy. For $1000 it is worthy!
https://www.audiogon.com/listings/solid-state-belles-ref150a-v2-2017-06-14-amplifiers-70764-plaquemi...

I did not know xlr was a must. The Belles is rca with xlr only when used as a mono amp. Need to find another matching Belles amp for use in balanced mode. I did see this Pass Labs amp......It is some 12 years old but a great amp and balanced inputs also......
http://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649340044-pass-labs-x3-150w-x3/

Also, these amps were already  mentioned and very good.

http://audioasylumtrader.com/ca/listing/Amplifier-SS/Odyssey-Audio/Stratos-Extreme/Mono-block-power-...

Agreed Charles. They need a marketing/sales professional equal in quality to the sound and value represented in his line.  This is a must to take it to the next level for his company and free him up to innovate and create. I see a company on the verge of a big breakthrough and they are at the point where they must invest in marketing/sales talent to "take the hill" in a big way. 

Keep an eye peeled out for a set of George Wright  2a3 monoblock Amps. Point to point wired with high quality trannys and great sound. Around $1000 used. I like point to point vs circuit boards and having owned these amps I can tell you they are great. Easy to upgrade coupling caps etc...if one wants to.  These amps can also run 300b tubes if you like. I liked the 2a3 tube better in these amps when I compared on my Cain & Cain IM Ben's.  

Good to remember that tube amps are not practical for all and impossible for some. For mixed HT and 2 channel use they are not practical. Can't imagine watching TV and movies with $1500 300b tubes😁 

I most always have music on in my home. I bet my system runs at least 8 hours daily. Some days much more. Sure, often as background, but I am not going to use a tube amp day after day with this kind of daily use. 

Some have small children and do not have the luxury of a dedicated /set aside music room with a door keeping those hot tubes away from children. 

Lastly, I have found SET amps shine on certain kinds of music with jazz being one. So the type of music one listens to also plays a role IMHO and based on my experience. 

Let's not forget we listen to systems, complete systems. The resulting sound is not a matter of amps alone and the right SS amp as part of a well thought out system and tweaks can certainly deliver on the sound adjectives used for SET amps in this thread. I have tweaked my current rig with wire, capacitors, gear, tweaks etc... to the point that I no longer miss my tube amps and SET amps. It can be done as today's technology and gear is making it a real possibility. It's a great big audio world out there with near endless total system possibilities. No single person can possibly have exhausted and experienced all that can be making definitive statements on the best Impossible. We all must find our own way and settle in on the sound we think is wonderful. Once we have done this remember that where we land is based on finite and biased preferences. 

As Charles has eluded to, one may be so captivated with the sound of a 2a3 amp paired with high efficiency speakers that they can't possibly imagine others not thinking it is the pinnacle of beautiful music reproduction. Fact is others may not and do not. Think of it like food. I love Indian food and find the liberal use of spices and resulting flavor to be unbeatable and so very delicious. Others are not particularly fond of it and while that is near impossible for me to understand, it is nevertheless true.  

I am also interested in the DI SE with even better crossover parts including Duelund, Path Audio, and Jupiter. I bet they would be fantastic! 

Kenny, I meant o say the SIT 2 is my main interest......

Kenny, can you point me to a link on building your DIY amps? I am interested in a project like this. Your version of the f7 really is interesting to me. Thanks!

I use the standard on my 125 pound Acoustic Zen Crescendo speakers. Works great and all you need. I use the studded/threaded gliders. Perfect.

For clarity my gliders are on hard wood, not carpet. They are also the threaded type that screw into your speakers....important!

Hope this helps.

Yes I use the Lyngdorf 2170 paired with a Music Vault Ultra Plus server.  The combo is wonderful. I use Tidal and my MV Ultra came with a lifetime  Roon membership. I ripped all my CDs into the MV Ultra also. 

Lyngdorf is using some SOTA technology in the 2170 with their room correction being on the top of the list. They provide the best room correction available today assuring your speakers sound as they should, were intended to sound, in your particular room. 

No additional complexity that comes with using separate boxes and wiring for amps, preamp, dac etc... It is all in one box with very, very short signal paths. Amazing how noise free this unit is and you must hear it to know what I am talking about. I thought my past systems had low noise, but the Lyngdorf showed me there was noise I was not aware of. 

@craig159

Yes I use an upgraded power cord and one I have found to be very, very good.  Mike at Audio Archon can make you one using Furutech cable and high quality carbon cased connectors.  It is called the "blue" cord.  Stunning and affordable.  I paid 
some $250 for a 3 footer if I recall. Very fair price as I also built the same cord and did not save that much.  

I only have the usb input on my 2170 as my server is set up to provide the best sound via USB. 

I also modified my 2170 power supply a tad.   

Watching the Tour and like how close the race is! I'm also a road cyclist. Lots of aphiles seem to like cycling it seems. 

Craigl59

Mods performed to my Lyngdorf 2170, 

I installed an Audio Magic Pulse ZX and Mad Scientist Neo Kegs in the power supply. In addition, I upgraded the output caps to Jupiter replacing the Wima caps. I also used constrained layer damping material throughout the chassis and other key areas.  Lastly I bypassed the binding posts and "direct wired" the output leads to the speaker cables using the posts as a clamp only.

Al, what about dynamic headroom and the role it plays when listening to a particular style or type of music? Below is your explanation on how 1 watt can work with the DI speakers. However I see little mention of dynamic headroom in your comments below? Dynamically challenging music forms would certainly cause the 1 watt amp to show more of its limitations.

I have no doubt that this 1 watt amp can play less dynamically challenging music forms to satisfactory listening levels, but when far more power is needed for those short dynamic peaks on certain kinds of music, one would think the little amp that could would run out of gas. Love to hear your thoughts. Thanks Al.

"The speaker is rated to produce an SPL of 98.82 db at 1 meter for an input of 2.83 volts. Let’s call it 99 db. 2.83 volts into 4 ohms corresponds to 2 watts. So the 99 db becomes 96 db for a 1 watt input. Assuming that falls off with increasing distance at a rate of 6 db per doubling of distance, which is typical for non-planar speakers, at a typical listening distance of say 10 or 12 feet the 96 db would be reduced to about 86 db. If both of the speakers that are present are supplied with 1 watt, the overall acoustic power that is radiated into the room would increase by 3 db, relative to the output of a single speaker, but the increase would approach 6 db if the listener is approximately centered. That brings us to 92 db. “Room gain,” i.e., the effects of reflected energy in the room, would conceivably add something like 3 db or so. That brings us to 95 db. And probably another few db would be added as a result of some combination of dynamic headroom, conservatism in the 1 watt spec, and a small amount of clipping that would not be perceivable as such. Voila!

Here is a simple definition of dynamic headroom given by a fellow Agoner on another thread. 
" In plain English
...means an ability to reproduce a large interval between 'quiet' and 'loud'.
The sound system (mainly defined with amplifier and speakers for dynamic headroom) with large dynamic headroom does not compromise the sound quality with large increase or decrease of sound."

Thanks Al. I understand your comments and still question the ability of a 1 watt amp to scale large orchestral crescendos and the like. Many listeners do listen at weighted average db levels of 86-92db when off the leash. Peaks, clean peaks, would push the amp too close to its max and even beyond.

After owning several speakers ranging from 90-95 efficiency ( Acoustic Zen Crescendos, Coincident Total Victory II, Lahave two-ways) it became clear that 8-40 tube watts was not enough to handle dynamics in some music. Sure the room could be filled with great music at 80-85 average db on vocals, some jazz, and pop. However, more dynamic music or recordings with low gain, sounded fragile and a tad nervous. Classical piano is another place where it became clear more power was needed.

I must admitt the thought of 1 watt, never-mind 8, working in most modest size rooms on lower gain recordings, classical piano, and classical music is challenging to me. Perhaps challenging is too kind a word, impossible to me 😊

@evolvist 

Yes indeed I love my Lyngdorf and I am well aware of the fact few here in the US own it or know about it. As a long time tube guy,  I understand the "cool" factor is pretty low on the unit. It is so understated aesthetically that many would simply think of it as a lifestyle product and not take it seriously. The room correction is nothing short of transformational. The room is what limits most of our systems and gear. 

I do not own the DI speakers. I own Acoustic Zen Crescendo speakers. I would love to try a set however. Most interesting speaker and achievement.  

Evolist, agree that you must hear and experience it to know! I know the Lyngdorf room correction helped me obtain sound improvement that was beyond my past switching and upgrading of all manner of gear.

True that. 

@vitop,
Well said and I was thinking the very same thing. This is a big subject however and I am not an expert. 

Great question and yes I have used the analog outs to try several SS and tube amps. Here are the amps I tried.

- highly modified Cary Rocket 88 R
- Von Gaylord Triode Legend tube monos
- highly modified Dynaco mk4 monos wired for both standard and triode modes
- Job 225 SS amp

I also used a digital rca cable and output to try Lyngdorf’s own 2400 amp. I wanted to see what more power would bring. Sure the room correction feature was still in use with all these amps, nice feature, but I kept going back to the 2170 on its own.

In the end I preferred the 2170 on its own. It just sounded more right. Most impressive unit really. I found it responds well to a nice upgraded power cord. Contrary to their literature, I found it also liked a decent power conditioner in front of it. I also use a dedicated 20 amp line with upgraded Porter Port cryo outlet.

I am always thrilled when I compare the sound of my system with the Room Perfect turned off and then back on. Such a great improvement with it on. I was never able to get this level of improvement with my vast array of properly placed diffusion and absorption panels in the past.

I am still open to trying other tube amps to mate with the 2170 as I may find one that l like as well and brings a different sonic perspective. Fun. However, thus far the 2170 on its own is my easy favorite. Something about introducing another box with ICs, another power cord, longer signal paths etc.....must play a role here. I know this is counter to our audiophile separate boxes for everything dogma. Even I had to break through this strong experiential bias when trying the 2170 initially.

Yes we as audiophiles can now put together amazing sounding systems for reasonable money. Great options such as those from Tekton, Lyngdorf, LTA and others.  

ICC, well it is always active and I have not listened with it off. I must say I don't know that much about it and should read more in my manual. My bad. I will do so now. 

Here is the explanation from the Lyngdorf site. I understand the point and just know it, the unit,  sounds very good:)  Someone smarter than I in these matters, such as Almag, can perhaps comment on the theory anyway. 

"ICC (INTER-SAMPLE CLIPPING CORRECTION)

When music is being mastered, the level is often very high; upon analysis, you will often find several consecutive maximum samples, indicating something has been clipped away from the original signal. Audio that exceeds 0 dBFS (decibels relative to full scale) will sound very compressed because the headroom is nonexistent. This harsh sound is an unfortunate trend in the music industry and is typically referred to as “the loudness war.”

In order to compensate for this, we have created ICC (Inter-sample Clipping Correction). With ICC, the TDAI-2170 can automatically adjust up to 12dB headroom in the signal processing to avoid clipping of the signal. Through this you will enjoy the full dynamic range and a more natural sound."

http://www.lyngdorf.com/media/43162/without-icc.jpg?width=1800&height=1350&mode=crop&qua...

http://www.lyngdorf.com/media/43163/with-icc.jpg?width=1800&height=1350&mode=crop&qualit...

Thanks a bunch Al. Your post makes complete sense.

Vitop, the Lyngdorf is a killer value when one looks at it in its whole. It is not an amp. It is a complete rig with other add-ons and options. I replaced over $22,000 worth of separates and wire with a $4000-$4500 unit. That’s seems to me to be a killer value. Others are doing the same.

I sold the following when I picked up the 2170.

- Tube Research Labs preamp - Super Dude
- Luxman DA06 dac
- Von Gaylord tube monoblock smps
- all manner of room correction panels and traps
- 4 power cords
- digital cable
- 2 set of ICs
- various footers

That’s what going to a one box solution does.

I also gained many other capabilities that I did not have before. Room correction is the biggest one. So yeah, please consider the cost of a preamp, dac, amplifiers, cables, cords, footers, and physical room treatments.

I understand thinking of it as just am amp or int amp, but that is not what it is. My previous preamp alone cost more, much more, than the Lyngdorf. Many folks own a dac or amp or preamp alone that costs more than the 2170 system.

One could purchase the DI speakers for $3000 and the Lyngdorf for $4500.  Great system for $7500 new.  All that is needed is a streamer or computer as a source. Killer value all around when one spends under $10,000 for what is arguably a system that competes with many systems costing 4-10x that. The electronics/wire  driving the high value DI speakers in this scenario are of equal high value.......most spend a much higher percentage on the electronics and wire for their systems.  

I suggest buying the Duelund 16ga stranded copper wire in cotton or NOS Western Electric 10ga copper wire in cotton (speaker cable) for $2-$10 foot depending on the one you choose. No connectors needed and just use the bare wire which is tinned and will not oxidize.  

Great at times for an audiophile! 

Understand vitop.

@charles1dad

I have watched you build your system over the years. You have been very careful and deliberate in building exactly want you want and desire in a system. Your system is first rate and there is little chance throwing out all your wire and electronics for the Lyndorf in one instant will yield the same results for you. Little chance. Ok - infinitesimal.

I greatly respect your approach, experience, and passion for good music. I wish I could hear your system as I am sure I would connect with it deeply. Well done for sure.

@porscheracer,

I love the fact you are using very good value wire that sounds very nice indeed. I like two bulk DIY wires that represent wonderful value also.

The Western Electric NOS 10ga stranded and tinned copper wire and the new Duelund 16ga stranded copper, tinned and in oil impregnated cotton.

I ended up using the WE10 as it is warmer and full bodied sounding than the Duelund 16ga. The Duelund is more lively and open. It really depends on your system and what you are looking to accomplish.

Both easily had me selling off $2000 worth of high end cabling. Others are also finding this out. Both Jeff .Day and Jim Smith speak to this on their sites. Good stuff and priced so right. The WE10 gauge wire is only $2 foot!

No termination at all on the speaker cable for best sound. Very easy to make a set of cables for little cost.

I happened to sell off MG Audio speaker cables selling for over $2000 new.

@brotw ,
I have a very good idea for you based on my experience with your speaker cable. I used it in the past and know the sound. It can sound bright. The ICs from them can also sound bright. I owned both.

Buy the Western Electric 10 gauge bulk wire below. It is sold by the foot as twisted sets! So if you need an 8 foot set on one side, then buy 8 feet per side from this seller. Do not terminate. Just strip and hook up the bare wire. Please start here. An 8 foot set will cost you $65 and drop your jaw after 100 hours of run in.

You will indeed warm up your sound and hear more body and fullness through your wonderful DI speakers. Your sound will become more natural and unforced. I will eat one foot with salsa if I am wrong😊 Start here and know where to go from there based on what you hear. 

Also, I would be willing to make you one meter ICs using the Duelund 16ga wire with Switchcraft RCAs for the cost of the parts - about $65 also. These will also so improve your system. I can say this with absolute confidence.

http://www.ebay.com/itm/per-foot-Western-Electric-AIW-10ga-STRANDED-cloth-covered-gray-PAIR-/2316636...

Yeah it is work to get the system where you want again when you make a speaker change. Are the speakers pointing straight  ahead with no toe in at all? This is where you should start. All you know any toe in will increase he upper mids and highs energy to your ears. 

You mentioned some very good wire/cabling and this is a good place to look based on your current cabling.  Before spending that kind of money the $69 option I gave you is competitive sound quality wise. It's hard to believe, but true, Right now another Agoner with over $2000 of used wire for sale is also learning how great the Duelund and WE10 wire is. 

No, that was not me. Funny. I have one set out for a Agoner to try and will let you know if he plans to return them. My sense is he will keep them and sell off his big $ set of ICs. 

Wow! That is an impressive list of speakers.  Am I hearing you say the Tekton DI is an enjoyable as your wonderful ML15A speakers? If so, then the DIs are very, very special. I listened to the 15As recently and loved them. 

@james_w514,

When referring to "refinement" do you mean sonically or aesthetically? Or both? If sonically, please help me understand how you define refinement. Thanks.

Agreed. We are starting to see cabling, speakers, dacs and digital electronics that represent astounding value and performance. There is a portion of our community that will not open their minds and simply discounts the exciting reality around them. 

I am thrilled that Tekton is shaking things up. 

I have three of the cords from Audio Archon. They are made with Furutech cable and are quite stunning really. Replaced my DIY power cables that I loved over the past two years. FURUTECH FP-S20N | FP-SO22N MAINS POWER CABLE. He uses high quality rhodium over solid copper connectors with carbon housing. Very high quality connectors. Made in China, but very good.

He he also treats the stripped cable ends with Furutech’s very expensive Nano Liquid. Small dropper costs $200 and is made of pure gold and silver.

Now you can make them yourself, I made one cord, but it will cost you just as much when factoring the cost of the Nano Liquid. Mike does a great job building them and they are priced VERY fairly.

Furutech sells the same quality cable in 12ga also should you desire that. I built my one set with the 12ga and heard no improvement. 

Great power cords for sure.

Is there anyone in Tennessee, or even reasonable distance from the Nashville area,  that has these DI speakers? Love to hear them.....

Ok stop it with this crap! All these over the top accolades and better than $28,000 speakers hype. I can no longer take it!  This stuff is nuts, just nuts, for a $3000 speaker. No doubt you are all part of a Tekton conspiracy to take over the Audio world. STOP IT! 

You've got me worked up into a frenzy and I must try a set now. This is really the last thing I want to do as I am most content with my rig. However, I am blessed, perhaps cursed, with a strong dose of curiosity in life. 

Kenny, you may be right. I don’t think they would let me carry it on however. May have to check it? Even then I think security would want a closer look once it is viewed on their scanners? Not sure,.

Wether 1 or 8 watts is enough is most likely more dependent on listener preferences as well as music preferences. I have spoken with several DI owners who cannot live with 1 to 8 watts on the DI speaker. Terry, the reviewer, likes 1 -4 watts. What is great and best for one ( 3-4 2a3 watts) is too lacking to another listener. Subjective for sure.

Charles I also believe that Terry believes the combo is best for/to him. I bet the system does some things in an extraordinary way. The key here is ...to him. Audience of one. In addition BEST is a very fickle thing. Over the decades with all my various types of systems, many great sounding, I learned something that I know is true for many audiophiles. One uses care, careful research, trial and error and finally settles into a very enjoyable system. The system is enjoyed for a season only to be replaced by another "type" of system that is deemed to sound better. Does the new system really sound "better"? Sometimes. However, most times the audiophile is really more pleased with the new sound. Something new that is now hitting different auditory pleasure points. Example...Going from ESL speakers with huge SS monoblock amps to high efficiency speakers and a 4 watt tube amp. It is exciting to both the ears and mind to enjoy a completely different musical flavor. Is it better? Well, for that season and to that person you bet it is.

I realize you are a different type of audiophile Charles not fitting into the group above. That’s great as no type of audiophile is best or right.

Well many do read reviews and are swayed completely buy a reviewers subjective tastes. What you say is obvious to all I have found is not that obvious to some readers. My point needs to be repeated in threads like this. Not all readers of this thread, or reviews in general, are seasoned and experienced shoppers/Aphiles.

Teajay, you are absolutely correct with your EGO comment and some audiophiles. I see this attitude more and more of late. Why? Because we are now seeing some extraordinary sounding wire and gear being sold at reasonable prices. Tekton is certainly at the top of the list for speakers. I really believe high end sound is becoming more and more affordable. Yes,  I realize astronomically priced gear is also on the rise. However,  I see that as a reaction to the fact that the SQ gap between big dollar gear and "affordable" gear is shrinking......and fast.

Products like Tekton can actually help expand our industry and bring in new consumers. This needs to happen.