"I must leave this thread"
That's the smartest thing you have said in this thread.
Shakey |
I should add here that I was a dealer for Tannoy and have a little experience with them. Probably not enough to satisfy the KID. |
It is obvious that Kiddman knows best. You can simply ask him
no doubt he will tell you that the 15" woofer is going to give you fast and tuneful bass plus it will integrate seamlessly with the 2" tweet
.I must leave this thread
I fear I am being stalked
.
|
Sound Real, your logic is faulty here. You clearly don't understand the nature of the transformer (the horn) that takes the load off that 2" driver, compared to a "bare driver", to the tune of an order of magnitude.
It's useless to argue with someone (you) who obviously has no technical understanding of the subject, and who not many years ago was asking Audiogoners what to carry! Seems to me the general consensus in that thread was that you should go learn something, and that still applies. Don't just spout off before learning the subject matter. Rather, do the mature thing and go learn about the compression driver and horn loading, from a technical standpoint, then go test several of the best models, involving several brands. Do some measurements to correlate to your listening experiences. Then come back and talk, you'll at that point be able to bring something to the table. A couple decades more experience and studying and you will then REALLY bring something to the table.
Unlike you, no commercial affiliations here. I don't do retail, I'm not in the speaker business, I own both cones and horns.
Remember one of the first rules of credibility: know what you are talking about before you throw dogmatic statements around. |
Most folks don't even realize that these Tannoy mids really are horns, and that the woofer acts as a continuation of the horn for the central compression driver.
On the Westminster, the enclosure itself then takes over as an extension of the horn formed by the woofer.
The woofer also is backloaded by a folded horn in the enclosure. This all brings the efficiency up to 99db per watt. |
Day and night two different speakers. |
Sounds_real_audio -- I you think the 2" midrange driver can carry the day going from 1 kHz up to 20 kHz then have at em
..I prefer a larger but not to large midrange, between 6" and 7.5" to get the heft from instruments and especially male vocals. A 2"(voice coil) compression driver, in this case (augmented by the 15" paper cone) and others, functions in conjunction with a horn/waveguide in which the effective area of air displacement is considerably larger than what the voice coil diameter would suggest - in effect close if not equal to the mouth area of the horn or waveguide; suddenly a 2" comp. driver is converted into an air impedance transformer, being much more potent than what a 6-8" cone driver can achieve with better speed, much higher sensitivity, lower distortion, and providing much better energy coherence in tandem with the larger and light-coned mid/bass unit Moreover, as stated already, a single 1kHz crossover has huge benefits compared to a crossover point in the higher frequency range where the human ear is even more sensitive, not to dismiss avoiding the negative impact of crossing over a bass unit in the 200-400Hz and the negative effect this can have on the lower mids/upper bass and how it further affects the coherence here. My own speakers only sport a 1" compression driver placed in front of a 12" OSWG waveguide crossed at 1.3-1.4kHz to 12" mid/bass unit, and I can tell you the heft, physicality and clarity of Frank Sinatra's voice on Frank Sinatra Sings for Only the Lonely makes most every other conventionally driven speaker I've heard pale in comparison. I've never heard the Westminster's, but would love to. |
Maybe Kiddman doesn't understand. Using that same logic, "small drivers that play loud" line array speakers would not need woofers to support the bass. You just put 10 4 inch drivers, line um up and turn up the bass. Right?
I have listend to the Tannoy's at some length and know what they sound like. The midrange is still coming out of a 2" driver
..
"Studios need to be able to play LOUD" ?? there are a lot of studio monitors out there. How come??
Look this isn't about " buttering my bread" I don't carry Sonus Faber, so no butter here. What's on your bread MAN? |
Thanks Shakey. PM sent to you, check your in box. |
Kiddman,
I like your posts. They are like a breath of fresh air, and usually make me chuckle.
Shakey |
Sound's real, you don't get it man, it's a COMPRESSION DRIVER, there's huge energy in that 2 incher. Studios need to be able to play LOUD, musicians demand that, and there have been more of those drivers used in mastering recordings, over decades, and still in use, than any cone driver you can name. There's a reason. Dynamic as all get out, efficient, and as you yourself mention, a wide range driver so no crossover garbage in the midrange, no different voices from different drivers through the critical regions. Nearly all cone speakers sound like a box of drivers after experiencing a wide-range, low distortion driver like that.
But unlike you, I don't sell retail, I have no vested interest in any speaker products, so I understand you need be aware of where your "bread is buttered". |
Go to the Tannoy website and look at the spec's. Then check the crossover frequency and you will get my drift... |
If you buy things for their "designer boutique" looks then get the Sonus.
If you want the most musical, realistic sound, go Tannoy.
As to the guy who had the Westminsters and thought they were too analytical or revealing, I would say you had a very flawed system or you never really had them. Musical and natural is the hallmark of great Tannoys and the Westminster is arguably the greatest. Folks live with Tannoys for decades, more so than any other speaker I have ever seen, for precisely that reason: they state that "they sound like music".
If there is any flaw on the Westminsters, it is that they can be lacking on the ultimate extension on top (the opposite of "ruthlessly revealing"!) and can be a little warm (again, the opposite of the above poster's claim).
Search Google for "Tannoy Westminster" and you'll see that the overwhelming consensus opposite to the above poster's description. Except for the size, they are extremely easy to live with. |
None of these speakers has a 2" midrange. I am confused. |
I you think the 2" midrange driver can carry the day going from 1 kHz up to 20 kHz then have at em
..I prefer a larger but not to large midrange, between 6" and 7.5" to get the heft from instruments and especially male vocals.
|
I owned the Westminster SE and I would opt for the Sonus Faber in a heartbeat. I felt the Westminster to be so room dependent not to mention the ridiculous size. They are ruthlessly revealing of all FLAWS in the system and none are perfect. My experience with them was a nightmare and I took a huge loss trying to sell them due to there size, shipping cost and limited fans in the US. I believe the Sonus Faber are a more user friendly and just down right pleasant to listen to. Don't get me wrong here the Sonus Faber is very revealing as well but I feel they highlight the positive. I vote for the Sonus Faber a beautiful one as well. You will get tired of the Westminster IMHO.. |
It all depends on the amplification.
Tube = Tannoy Westminster Royal SE
SS = Sonus Faber Amati Futura |
