System too bassy - Primaluna & Usher


I'm looking for advice on how to tame my bass. Since upgrading my amp to the Primaluna Dialogue One from a low end Harmon Kardon, I've noticed my fatigue level from the bass has shortened my listening times drastically. That could also be because listening levels are higher because of the increased power. Regardless, I would like to tame the bass which these Ushers are known for.

THE SETUP:

Lossless Files
Apple TV > unknown decent quality optical cable to...
Rega Dac > low end Monster RCA cable to
Primaluna Dialogue One > $3 ft speaker cable to
Usher Be-718 speakers
VTI Metal stands

The room is 12' X 13' with one side open concept into the rest of the condo. The wall that the system is against is actually a couple of feet shorter because of the HVAC system, which puts one speaker in a corner.

I just got the Primaluna amp and I love the Ushers and do really like the Rega Dac. So I'm not willing to change those.

MY THOUGHTS:

I'm thinking of interconnects, speaker cables and room acoustics. I think room acoustics is a must regardless. Perhaps I do that first, then look at the total sound.

What are your thoughts?
deetothevee

Showing 11 responses by mapman

Try dnm reson ics from source to amp for nice balance top to bottom and lots of clarity through the midrange.
Probably a lot of room acoustics involved. Moving the speakers 2-3 feet or more out away from the walls, especially the front wall, and corner(s) should help tame the bass I would think. Should also help with imaging and soundstage. Experiment with teh speakers at different locations. Even subtle changes in location can have a big effect on bass.

ALso how high off the floor are the speakers? If closer to the floor, getting them up higher on a good pair of rigid massive stands might help.

Toeing in speakers so tweets face more towards primary listening position might also help tilt the tonality in the direction desired away from more bass.
If options for locating the speakers to help tame bass are not practical or sufficient, and speakers must remain closr to walls and corners, then adding bass traps to the corner(s) is another thing to try.

Only after all practical placement and treatment options are exhausted would I start to think about changing anything. Some different ICs/wires might produce some change as well, but I would not rely on those as a primary solution to address bass issues.

A 250w/ch or so Class D amplifier might be an option to consider if all else fails to get that particular tube amp and speaker combo sounding the way you want. Tube amps and smaller speaekrs/monitors like those that attempt to deliver extended bass out of a small box/package is often not the ideal combo, but addressing room acoustics first in various ways as described to the extent practical might help to make things work out better.
Maybe experiment with position of speakers when no one else home, just as a test, not permanent, just to get a feel for how that works. Then play something the lady likes that sounds really good, and maybe you can negotiate something. :)
20", 80%, I say go for just a few more; to shoot for 100% and act like
nothing happened. :^)
" I love hi-fi but it's not my life, I still want it to look like a home."

Tell me you did not just say that!

This is audiogon. Do you realize the kind of characters here who are just now reading that? 😚
"Mapman - what made you recommend the DNM reson ic's? I've been reading about them and of course, mixed reviews. "

"And right now I would like a little less bass, maybe a little more detail and I always want more sweetness in the midrange (but without the expense of anything else at this point) and soundstage."

DNM is one of my preferred ICs that I use a lot, so I can recommend them.

The design is quite minimalist and unique, which has some advantages that I think could play well in your case as described.

They are very balanced top to bottom, quite detailed. SOundstage is also quite good accordingly.

Bass is just right on my system with those. Towards teh leaner side of things but articulate and muscular. Getting the bass right help expose details that can be masked otherwise.

They are also uniquely coherent top to bottom, meaning that the parts of the music come together in very natural and fulfilling manner.

One way that all this plays together well is I am able to understand vocals in most recordings better with these than any others I use. There is usually no mistaking the ability to understand what the human voice is saying or not in a recording. Plus being able to greatly increases the pleasure of listening IMHO. When voices come through loud and clear, that's a very good omen for all the rest, which can be harder to judge accurately.

Plus they are not expensive and can be had for not much, especially used.
"The speaker measurements shown in the stereofile link posted by Samhar show that the speakers have sensitivity of 85db coupled with 4 ohm and -41 deg phase angle at around 2k Hz."

Yea, as I mentioned above, I do not think the amp/speaker match is ideal for best bass quality possible, especially at higher volumes, and this is probably a good indicator, but hopefully getting the setup tweaked first buys enough to make things work.

ICs may help also, but an optimal amp/speaker match is usually one of the things that pays biggest dividends over time, as does getting a handle on speaker setup and room acoustics in general.
Biwire to resolve bass issues in this case seems like a total potshot and a bandaid at best.
I'd use the same wire for both myself at this stage jut because that will keep things simpler. You can always experiment with whatever variations you want from there later.