Suggestions to upgrade from Lyra Delos


Greetings again folks:

I've done a bunch of tweaking and fiddling with my Thorens TD124 including a new arm (Jeff Spall), Audio Silente bushings and other minor things.  I love my Delos in general, but I feel like it's missing something.  It's very detailed, fast, tight bass, good channel separation and soundstage (in general, feels a bit compressed front to back) but I feel like I'm missing that 'thing.'  Of course it could just be perception on my part, but I don't have much to compare with so that is the intent of this thread.

The rig:

Thorens TD124 Mk1 w/Mk II mods
Jeff Spall (Audiomods UK) Tonearm,v6
Lyra Delos, with Microridge stylus (original, not rebuilt)
Hagerman Audio Labs Trumpet MC (Loaded at 110 Ohms)
Stax SRM-007T Headphone Amp with Stax Lambda Nova Signature headphones

I'd like to stay under $5K as well and would prefer a similar cost to the Delos ($2K) if possible, but willing to invest more in a different experience if that experience is better.

I realize this is a highly subjective ask.  I would appreciate responses from those that have gone from or to a Delos and what you went to / from.  I'm certainly considering the Kleos or a used Etna (if I can find one in the price range) but again, would like to try another direction to experience a broader range of sound signatures.

Thank you, in advance, for any suggestions.

dducat

Showing 7 responses by dducat

I don't know that I know the max, but the docs say it can take a 10g Ortofon with no problem, so I can't imagine the MC Anna, for example, at 16g would pose any problem given the construction of the arm and the available balance weight options available.  (For example, you can dismantle the weight and use different mass loading of the counterweight itself up or down).
@rauliruegas:

I didn't say that the entire thing was compressed - just the front/back soundstage.  

I'm not sure what would be wrong with the phono preamp here - it's a very clean circuit, one 12AU7 and two 12AX7s per channel, and at the moment, all are vintage Telefunken.  I've got it very low loaded and a decent amount of gain, so I don't think it's really the phono preamp (I mean, I guess it could be).  If I had my druthers, I'd get a Herron VTPH-2A but well, that's probably not going to happen any time soon.

I do appreciate the suggestion on the at-art9xa.  I hadn't really thought of that cart as a serious comparison but it's certainly something I will look into as well.

@larryi  - thanks for the suggestion on the ART 1000.  I'll look into it.

@dover  - I'm curious what a top arm would be in the price range of the audiomods arm?  I figured I would have go $5K or more for a better arm which wasn't in the cards (and still isn't).

@solypsa - I'm fairly confident the arm can handle pretty much anything you throw at it.  While I don't know that it would handle an extremely low compliance heavy cart well, there are additional cartridge mounting plates as well as counter weight discs that you can swap or add so I suspect that even for the heaviest, lowest compliance carts, there's a solution.  Whether that's going to produce the best sound possible out of the combo needs further examination, I guess.  
@dover - what I feel like I'm missing is 'roundness' of the overall sound presentation.  It presents well and is highly detailed.  It just doesn't feel 'musical' to me, I guess.  It's hard to explain really.

@solypsa - I have the most recent version, with the 15VDC wall wart power supply.  I think it sounds good - dead quiet, no over-coloration.  Again, I wish I could have pulled the trigger on a Herron, but I haven't been able to do that.  At least, not yet.

I do have designs on a Schroeder or Kuzma arm in the future.  I had forgotten that the Audiomods arm comes with a larger mass cartridge mounting plate, so I'm going to try that, for the moment, to see if there's any audible difference.  
@larryi 

The other problem is that I don't know what I don't know.  I don't have much experience beyond my Lyra (other than a Denon 103R) since I've gotten back into the hobby after decades of being away from it.  I'm aware of the Dynavector XX-2, but have never heard one.

I certainly don't want to be 'sluggish' and I would not trade detail and speed for 'warmth' and 'sluggish.'   There may not be another option, per se, and I'm ok with that, but I thought I would reach out to this group to see if there were any similar experiences and/or advice which I've gotten a great deal of - so, thank you all for that.
Quick update - swapped out the cart mounting plate to the heavier 'low compliance' plate and there is a noticeable difference.  I'm going through a series of recordings the see how much there really is, but definitely stronger bass response, wider soundstage (although it was wide before), slightly better space / separation between instruments.  I think the extra mass definitely was a plus, along with some gain tweaking.

I'm still investigating arms, carts, phono preamps, etc.  But this certainly does sound great.
@larryi 

Yes, I've adjusted VTA.  I have also played with loading and gain previously as well as after this most recent change.  Right now I'm running it at the lowest possible load and 60db gain.

I have tried a variety of tube complements in this preamp, and so far the Telefunken combination is the most 'natural' sounding without being overly colored.  The Mullard repros it came with are a waste of time.  I like the Telefunkens slightly more than the vintage Mullards.  I'm working on (because as you've said, it's not exactly 'free') sets of NOS Siemens, Bugle Boys and Vintage Raytheons.  I've actually ECC803s in this stage and it was a very weird sound signature - felt like the midrange was being thrown in my lap.

As I said, I'm looking into other phono preamps a notch or three above this one.  Sutherland, Herron, Musical Fidelity NuVista, and a few others.

But, I do think I've got this finally dialed in for the moment so I'm going to continue playing with it to see how it goes.
@larryi - yes, I was talking about vintage/NOS tubes.  That's all I use.  I appreciate the suggestions, and I've been interested in the Vifa as well. I'll look into the Zanden, for sure. 

@noromance - yeah, I thought I was at the lowest load setting on the Hagerman and it turns out I wasn't. (It isn't obvious because the gain adjustment, which is built the same way doesn't operate the same way and neither are labeled or marked, so I had assumed that I was already at the lowest load based on knob positioning). That's what I meant earlier when I said I tweaked load as well. 

Again, it's definitely sounding better overall and on quality recordings it's sounding rich and full so, I think I have addressed short term issues.