Sub Sonics and woofer pumping


I have a VPI prime on bear claws sitting on a maple base. Floor is concrete. I use a Nagaoka MP500 cart with going to an ARC PH3se phono pre, then to a Herron 1A preamp. Amp is an ARC Classic 60. Speakers are Thiel CS 2.4’s. 
I get pretty aggressive woofer pumping with vinyl. 
I’ve lubed my bearings on the table.

my alignment is spot on. 
Tracking force at the upper limits of cart. 
I’ve added the 2nd pivot point to the 3D arm. 
I’ve even switched out the counter wt to a much heavier unit and added a comparable head shell weight to change the total mass of arm. To no avail. 
None of these things have had any effect in reducing the pumping. 
I REALLY don’t want to use a rumble filter. 
I’m left with the conclusion that the cart may not be a match for the arm, even after adding all the extra mass. 

Any thoughts or solutions. 
last_lemming

Showing 5 responses by last_lemming

I changed out my counter wt from 140 gr to 180 and I added a head shell wt, can’t remember the weight but it was about the size of a dime and about as thick as a nickel. 
No change to the woofer pumping. 
I do have the Soundsmith weights, but they are too short to use on the cart. 
So I’m noticing that on the lead in grooves where there is no sound yet but the record is playing my woofer appears to “pump” exactly once on every revolution. Also the pumping is more pronounced at the beginning of the record vs the end. 
Could have to do with the edges of records being a bit more warped than closer to the hole, but that’s just a guess. 
Is this vertical movement of the arm to blame?  And if so what is the solution here?  I changed cart thinking it was related to compliance, but this cart pumps as much as the last cart, and the new Grado i. Using now is suggested by VPI. 

I could add some wt to the head shell. But when I did that Nagaoka it didn’t change anything.  But I still could try I suppose. 

I could try setting the TT on the ground but presents issues of its own. iC’s aren’t long enough. 
I can’t buy another cart, so that’s out. 
Yeah. Maybe. The thing is sound isn’t up loud enough to cause vibration In the turntable. 

Are you saying the operation of the TT is causing the pumping?
It happens with every record to one degree or another. On the quite passages (lead in groove, etc). That’s why I don’t think it’s a resonant thing. If there is no music how could resonance contribute that much to the pumping.  I suppose the lead in groove could have low freq vibration. 
I will try and do a thorough inspection of platter bearing and arm pivot point. 
You know i do use the 2nd pivot point modification- I wonder if that could be causing the issues?  That’s easy enough check, I’ll just disengage it. 
Ok. So it’s got something to do with the cart and the tone arm. Which is weird since VPI suggests the cart. 
I have a record that has a bump in the vinyl, the pumping corresponds with the bump.  Weirdly the right channel is pumping more than the rest regardless of how the antiskate is set. 
I’d like to use the calculator on vinyl engine to check resonance, but I don’t know what values to use for the 10” 3D tone arm. 
Does anyone know what I should input to check?