What amps are you using? (or have used, since you said your have tried several)
I really think that might be the problem. Are you using tube amps? (Sometimes tube amps are a little weak on low frequency response.)
I would use either Krell or Levinson amps. (I use the Levinson No. 23 (200W/ch) on my Revel Studios and they are rated about the same as your Amatis are for frequency response, and I get pretty good bass out of them. Not thundering, but then again my room (16'x24') would sound boomy with too much bass.)
I believe that the Amatis go down to about 28 HZ, which really means that subs are probably not needed.
Those are my 2 cents worth anyway. Good luck.
PS I used to have a Velodyne (15") that had pretty good bass. The problem I always had with using subs was getting the crossover point right. Given your speakers, I think this might be problematic for you as well, since your speakers (theoretically anyway) have pretty deep bass response. |
I agree with Kurt tank. You pretty much have full range speakers. With the right amp, you should do far better. The problem is finding the right amp. You also might consider switching over to XLR connections throughout to take advantage of the XLR's additional 2volts. These 2volts almost always will provide at least a minimal improvement in macro-dynamics amd bass solidity.
And of course, your room is going to have a tremendous affect on the quality of bass and other aspects. My new room is nothing like my old room. In fact, tonight, I played with speaker placement again and was finally able to obtain perhaps 4/5ths of the bass and overall sound presentation that I had in my previous room (which acoustically was far superior). At least I'm smiling again.
The final placement of my speakers was darn close to the placement recommendations of the program found on Rives audio web-site. Rives advertises on A'gon quite a bit. Thanks Rives.
You did state above that the SF Amati Homage's are extremely difficult to place. I'm not sure why you believe that. I would guess that they should not be too much different from any other full-range speaker weighing under 200 lbs.
I would also recommend your auditioning the Audience Au24 speaker cable. They are a bit amp dependent but with the right amp, they can provide some of the best bass you've ever heard. Even with the wrong amp, your bass may be substantially tighter, but could sound lighter as well. The Au24's are noted for minimizing/eliminating a time smear supposedly found in most other cables.
-IMO |
HI,
IF YOU CAN'T AFFORD AN AUDIO PHYSIC MINOS, DON'T LOOK FOR ANYTHING ELSE. IT WILL INTEGRATE NATURALLY INTO YOUR SYSTEM.
CORDIALLY,
RAMSES |
Kurt Tank, Thank you for the response. I have tried Classe Cam 350's, Mccormack DNA-2 w/smc rev.A, and a Jadis Defy 7. I am pretty sure that we're not talking about an amplification issue. The bass changes considerably as you walk around the room. My room is creating various nodes. The speakers are dialed in for optimum mids and highs and I do not want to change that, which is why I want suggestions for subs. Thanx again Rhythmace4218 |
Stehno, I am using xlr connections.The lack of bass that I am referring to is not something caused by cabling. I have had alot of great cabling including Cardas Golden Ref,and Purist Venustas which is awesome.As I told Kurt Tank the bass is drastically changing as you walk around the room. The room is a perfect square. I need suggestions for subwoofers. Thank you again. Rhythmace4218 |
Ramses, First off thank you for really reading my post. You gave a great suggestion for a subwoofer and I will do some homework on that sub.Thank you again Rhythmace4218 |
The space is definitely the issue. Your room is too deep.
If you can cut short to about 13 ft then you should be fine. My friend has it with Jeff Rowlands, MLs, and Goldmunds and they all mate well with this speaker.
IMHO, this speaker doesn't sing well with sub. |
Call Sumiko (REL and Sonus dealers) and ask to speak to Allan Haggar who can help you. Allan has set up Sonus Fabers all over the country with REL and knows how to integrate them very well. The Stentor III IMHO would be a great match. Just my $.02. |
Tried with REL storm II. Not impressive. |
Well, while they are not Levinson or Krell, I think that the Classe amp you tried, should have provided decent enough bass.
Perhaps changing cables would help.
I changed from Tara Labs Space and Time cables to a MIT 770 CVT, (bi-wired) and I noticed a dramatic increase in bass on my old Sequel IIs, and the bass on my Revels is also good. You could give those a shot.
I hate to say it, but I think it might be your room, in which case that is difficult to correct. I think Rives might be the best person to turn to to solve this problem.
BTW, something I just thought of: What source are you using? I know that some digital (CD) players and quite a few analog sources are weak in their bass response. Perhaps you could try a different source and see if that helps.
Good Luck! |
Hi,
Can't help you with Sub recommendations, as I've never used one. I have owned the Amati for years, and used them successfully in large rooms (10000 cubic feet) and small rooms (13'x16'x9').
Bass in the cavernous loft was deep and tight. To optimize bass integration in the smaller room I raised the speakers a little higher in the front. About 1/2" to an 1" on the front spikes worked wonders.
Since they are so efficient (92db) none of your amps are a problem.
Hope this helps.
Regards,
Tom |
Try diagonal placement in the room if you haven't already done so. In square and nearly square rooms this can be of significant benefit. I would avoid using subwoofers if you can.
Brian |
