tzh21y, static is caused by rubbing, the stylus rubbing the groove. I can't see how an Ortofon stylus would rub a groove a whole lot differently than the Lyra stylus. The size of the stylus and the tracking force might make a difference. But, what is probably happening is the naked metal body of the Delos is probably grounded and is discharging the record as it goes. If you can get the room absolutely dark and use loops you might even be able to see little sparks jumping from the record to the cartridge like a mini Van de Graaff generator. All the devices and sprays that discharge the record are not much help because as soon as you start playing the record static electricity is generated and dust starts flying to the record. Just like the Lyra you have to discharge the record while it is playing. Get one of these,
https://www.sleevecityusa.com/Antistatic-Record-Cleaning-Arm-p/tac-01.htm The brush is conductive carbon and the arm's base is connected to ground. It will also sweep any incidental dust out of the way. A little finicky to set up but once it is you don't have to touch it. I have a felt pad carpet taped to the turntable and give the brush a clean before each play. If the brush stops tracking well just clean it with alcohol and it will bounce right back. If you use this and a dust cover your records will stay pristine forever. Mike |
norman, yes that will work but is a bit messy. Geoffkait with two fs you have that backwards. The record transfers the charge to the sleeve. Sleepwalker has it right. The most effective way to control static is to discharge it as soon as it is formed with a conductive sweep arm. Everybody I have set up with one would not live without it. You can buy 4 of them for the price of one Zerostat. |
Wow guys, anybody here know how a Van de Graaff generator works?
What do you do when you want to shock your little sister....hows about rub your feet on the carpet. I'll leave it to you science nerds to look up why FRICTION causes static. Now I wonder where the friction is in a record playing system.
A grounded platter will work only if the mat is conductive. Most are not. All metal platters that I know of are grounded but there are an awful lot of plastic ones out there. Just having a grounded spindle will not work.
Anyway, I must be a miracle worker as not a single one of my records has any noticeable static charge on it. Maybe it is just magic. |
Geoffkait, you have to be kidding. I must be that gullible. Why does a tonearm skate? Oh I suppose you are one of those that does not believe in anti skating. What does geometry have to do with it? VTF maybe. Does a turntable belt rub against the record? This must be an alternative universe.
https://www.shure.com/en-US/support/find-an-answer/stylus-wear-and-record-wearRead the paragraph entitled "Dust and Grit" and by all means read the whole thing. It is a must read for vinyl junkies. |
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Lewm, I think you miss read that. Yes they do mention moving records in and out of sleeves could cause static but it does not. You are only transferring static to the sleeve from a charged record. The amount of rubbing/friction is no where near enough. Again I encourage you to read why friction and heat cause static charges on non conductive objects. It will mean more if you get it from someone other than me. Oh and the Shure brush was attached to the plastic housing of the stylus body. It was not grounded and made things worse not to mention what it did to the skating force. I threw mine away.
Thanx for the support sleepwalker65. I still have some hair left.
On the bright side static is not even remotely my problem. My records have none. You can lead a horse to water..... |
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OK geoffkait, you are either kidding or totally out to lunch. Anybody care to comment on which it might be? Anybody care to make a comment on why tonearms skate? I can't bear it. Somebody out there might even believe him! The tone arm is not subject to centripetal force because it is not moving. If Geoff were sitting on the record spinning with it he would be subjected to centripetal force and who knows, might do him some good. Tonearms skate to the middle of the record. Because the tonearm is offset (bent) friction of the stylus in the groove pulls the arm towards the center causing the stylus to lean on the left channel (inside groove).
This tendency is counteracted by the anti skating device.
This friction also generates thousands of volts of static electricity in just a few minutes. Pulling records in and out of sleeves does not generate static electricity. It is transferred to the sleeve from a hyper charged record and maybe by somebody like geoffkait who is full of static. |
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Cleeds, are you really that ------? The record is moving. Yes geometry is in part responsible for skating. It is called the OFFSET ANGLE. The energy that drives the skating is the friction that pulls the tonearm towards the center of the record. Once more. Zerostats work but as soon as you start playing the record static will build up fast then dust is drawn to the record so your stylus can grind it into the groove. Now, according to geoffkait with two fs, this makes the record sound better. Then he can transfer the dust laden staticey record to the sleeve which will now stick to the record. You have to discharge the record while it is playing. geoffkait with two fs, I suggest that while you are listening to music you stand right in front of your turntable and give it a Zerostat squirt every 15 seconds. Good exercise for your hand. Better yet you could get two Zerostats, one for each hand. Dress like a Mexican Bandit and smoke a big cigar. For those of you who don't want to act like geoffkait with two fs get one of these for $20 and put an end to your problem.
https://www.sleevecityusa.com/Antistatic-Record-Cleaning-Arm-p/tac-01.htm. Even cleeds will be able to install one of these. chakster I'm not so sure. |
Lewm, thank you for butting in. Static electricity forms when electrons are transferred from one item to another. For this to happen one item must be non conductive (vinyl). If you look up the triboelectric series PVC is almost at the bottom of the negative side. PVC loves to collect electrons.
Transferring electrons requires intimate contact and is aided by friction and heat.(rubbing your feet on the carpet). The tonearm being grounded is a fabulous source of electrons. The stylus with some several thousand PSI of pressure is in extremely intimate contact with the PVC and the spinning turntable provide the friction and heat to make it a great static manufacturing system. The charge migrates quickly across the surface of the record but not the label! Which is why a grounded spindle won't help. If you go back to the triboelectric series paper is a little bit to the positive side. It is a weak electron donor. It will not accept a negative charge. I hope that does it for you. |
kcleveland, in my last post I mentioned that paper will not except electrons so it will not remove static from PVC whereas some plastics will. So the paper sleeves seem to cause more static only because they are not removing any(electrons) from the record so the record comes out of the paper sleeve with as much static as it went in. Plastic sleeves discharge the record so when you take your record out of the sleeve it has less static. The old companies knew this and lined their paper sleeves with plastic. Taking the record in and out of the sleeve does not cause static. The sleeve is not in intimate enough contact to initiate the triboelectric effect. Google it! |
I was not being theoretical lewm. If I were I would say something like, "I think" this that or the other thing. I would let it be known then usually I would come up with some way to try and prove it, an experiment. Great that you did further research. That is what I do when I bump into a controversy I seem to be part of like when I screwed up saying record vinyl was nothing more than PVC and Carbon black even though this is what I was told at a record pressing plant 20 some odd years ago. In this case I was relaying sound scientific fact which I think you discovered after doing what a smart person would do, a little research. It is a tricky subject because there are so many variables involved like what kind of mat you are using, that static seems to do different things to different people. Now please do yourself a favor and get one of these,
https://www.sleevecityusa.com/Antistatic-Record-Cleaning-Arm-p/tac-01.htm and banish static from your records forever and I am not being facetious. A big $20. I have absolutely nothing to do with the company. A few tips. I bend the end of the shaft behind the finger lift so that the brush is exactly perpendicular to the record. It tracks better this way. It has this silly balance weight that slides up and down the shaft. I slide it all the way to the brush end and crazy glue it in place then I use the counter weight to balance the thing. I put a bit of low strength Loc-tite on the threads. The brush should be very light on the record. Mike |
tzh21y, PVC is an electron magnet. It is very difficult to stop it from collecting them under normal record playing conditions. The best you can do is discharge them while the record is playing with the device I mention about. It costs a whopping $20 and will definitively end you problem unless you want to be like the gingerbread man and give your record a Zerostat squirt every 15 seconds while the record is playing:)
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geoffkait, are you ever inquisitive enough to research subjects that you don't quite understand? I suggest you put your student hat on and read about Newtonian Physics which you should have had in high school. While you are at it you can read about static electricity, why and how it is formed. All I am going to tell you at this point is that you are comically wrong on all accounts and that it seems impossible for any of us to straighten you out even with evidence from other sources. We obviously have a serious problem with our educational system.
Cleeds, ..........naw, just a waste of time. |
Well geoffkait with two fs what do you expect when you make an --- out of yourself. I thought we were here to help each other not throw monkey wrenches. If you want to argue at least know what you are taking about.
Mike |
