I wrote Jim Salk about solid state and he didn't have many opinions, but likes Wells Audio. Anyone compare Wells Audio amps with Pass or Hegel etc.?
Solid state amp to go with tube preamp; used ok; budget: $3k max
I may have posed a similar question like this a while back, but I'm curious to get any updated thinking from folks, older or newer.
Situation: I have a Quicksilver Line Stage preamp and 60w monoblocks. I'm happy with them. I'd like to have a solid state amp to swap in for the monoblocks from time to time (weather, variety).
Typical desiderata in the amp are, as you'd expect, great grip on bass and pacing, smooth highs, good presence in mids, as wide and deep a soundstage as possible.
I tried Atoll 120wpc integrated (bypassing the preamp), Van Alstine SET 400, and my old Adcom 535L. None did the above to my satisfaction --problem mainly with mid, treble and with soundstage depth.
I've heard that stepping up the quality could bring something to the table, and to look out for Hegel, Ayre, Pass. Open to any topology. My speakers are 87 db, 8 ohm, and are driven just fine by 60w tube or solid state.
Specific recommendations for brands and models are welcome. I'm willing to buy, try, and re-sell if there's a good chance I'll want to keep it.
I'm going to be watching for things on used sites. Again, for this I'm setting an upper limit of $3k but am hopeful I could do fine with much less.
Situation: I have a Quicksilver Line Stage preamp and 60w monoblocks. I'm happy with them. I'd like to have a solid state amp to swap in for the monoblocks from time to time (weather, variety).
Typical desiderata in the amp are, as you'd expect, great grip on bass and pacing, smooth highs, good presence in mids, as wide and deep a soundstage as possible.
I tried Atoll 120wpc integrated (bypassing the preamp), Van Alstine SET 400, and my old Adcom 535L. None did the above to my satisfaction --problem mainly with mid, treble and with soundstage depth.
I've heard that stepping up the quality could bring something to the table, and to look out for Hegel, Ayre, Pass. Open to any topology. My speakers are 87 db, 8 ohm, and are driven just fine by 60w tube or solid state.
Specific recommendations for brands and models are welcome. I'm willing to buy, try, and re-sell if there's a good chance I'll want to keep it.
I'm going to be watching for things on used sites. Again, for this I'm setting an upper limit of $3k but am hopeful I could do fine with much less.
Showing 24 responses by hilde45
@tvad Thanks for the link to the Monarchy. I have to admit to not wanting monoblocks for the solid state out of a desire for (cringe) convenience. Good to have that Pass model specified. @jason The review in Stereophile of the Eagle 2 is great. I'm making a watch list for things mentioned, so keep them coming! |
@tvad Would this count? https://www.usaudiomart.com/details/649774010-pass-labs-int-30a-integrated-class-a-amplifier/ As I research past sales, I see this Int 30 doesn't typically sell lower than $3k whereas the 30.5 (amp only) typically goes around $2400 or so. Question is: is the amp section the same in both. |
@elliot -- thanks for the Vintage options. Not confident about vintage but you’re opening my eyes. Someone locally posted a Coda at $5300. Too much for me to pay but I wonder how Coda ranks...and, more importantly, whether it would ever appear used at $3k or lower. The key -- key! -- is that this thing be a league above... my Adcom, the Van Alstine, the Atoll. I need, perhaps, to overshoot the mark to make sure I don't land back where I've been. |
@tvad — you’re right. I wasn’t cherry picking, just looking at the wrong thing. The 305 used at Reno looks interesting. 10 years old. $3.3k. Hmmm. For a second amp, I can see myself looking to spend 1/3rd. Still, I know there is Pass Magic at work, so I don't want to just dismiss that factor. @jjss49 mini gan 5 — that’s a really nice offer and my inclination is to say "yes!" but I suppose the question becomes whether it could possibly compete with the local Hegel. I like how you guys are chasing me away from my max price point! As for it being the 21st century, I’m open to the GAN technology, but people’s ears don’t think in terms of centuries -- people love Pass, et al. for a reason, right? Still, open to achieving similar results with newer, cheaper, technology. I’m a skeptic but not a denialist. |
@tvad and @sbank -- I may have miscommunicated. I’m looking for a certain performance from the piece, with a maximum of about $3k. If I can get that performance with an expenditure of $1k, then that’s just a better value. If your view(s) is that the Hegel would not accomplish that, then I would just be wasting $1k, though, as @jjss49 comments, I’d be learning about the Hegel in the process and probably re-selling without a big loss. Regarding your comment about the wattage being sufficient, here’s a nice recent confirmation of your claim by the maker of Pearl Acoustics: https://youtu.be/4yZRdVXT8U0?t=554 @djones and @yogiboy -- thanks for the threshhold suggestions and the Benchmark, too. @unsound I'd consider CR, too. |
First off: no one mentioning PS Audio. Why? @twoleftears @pennfootball71 Good ideas, there. I am tempted by the Belles but is it as good as Pass and Ayre? Might not hurt to try. Another vote for Benchmark — noted! Hoping for that Class A sweetness… @mwasilow Schiit up there with Hegel and Ayre and Pass, in your view? I tried Van Alstine for $2.2k and it was not "there" for me. Don’t want to make that mistake twice. Another vote for Conrad -- thanks for the specific model numbers. Noted. BEL Canto -- noted. @jjss49 -- the mini gan is 5 lbs? I hear you on the Hegel. Could be fun to compare, but I’d have to pull the trigger on the Hegel. I’ll send you a p.m. |
Thanks, all -- Hafler, Stratos, Coda. Good to add to the list, investigate, too. Anyone compare the Stratos with Pass, Ayre, or other smooth customers? Hard to imagine a $1500 amp kicking butt at 1/3 the MSRP, but who knows? These smaller makers can surprise you. I will admit that with the new KT 150s in my QS monos, there’s no problem with the low end, at all. But I’d just like something which presents a bit differently and which adds a certain rhythmic "snap" which I heard with Van Alstine’s 125watt SET 400 but with a better midrange and high. Those neg’s on the SET400 were deal killers, and I ate the shipping to get my money back. (No disrespect to AVA lovers, this was just my experience.) |
@donvito You expected not to pay for shipping on a return? What's that all about?Not what I meant to say. I meant to say, "It cost a fair amount to ship the amount back because of the weight of the amp, the lack of packaging in the way it was initially packaged, and the insurance I paid. Despite all that, it was worth it to me to pay the shipping -- which of course I knew in advance I had to pay and agreed to pay -- because I just didn't want to keep the amp." Hope that longer version of "ate" brings you a fuller understanding of what I said too quickly. @tvad and @jjss49 -- From all I've heard, Class A/B is not going to cut it; it will have to be Class A or perhaps an innovative Class D (curious). The notion that "anything below the 190 in the Hegel line won't be good enough" (paraphrasing) is surprising to me. I suppose there is a range of experience here. |
@twoleftears Good point. Some brands are like Volvos -- tanks which run forever. If I can get the audio equivalent of a Volvo at 50% off, then that risk is acceptable. I don't need and and don't want to spend $7k on a brand new Pass Labs amp, but I cannot see me losing that much sleep over paying roughly half that for a well cared for used Pass Lab. Other car and amp brands can be subbed in above and that will make the same argument. |
@jjss49 Thanks. I don’t listen that loud, so if my speakers are not bears to drive and the sonic signature is effectively the same, I prefer not to spend more, needlessly. The 190 appears to be overkill. Incidentally, I saw a Hegel 160 out there, used. Possibly better than the H90? @jbuhl Perhaps you missed my comment to donniewn below, "Steering away from monoblocks." |
@jbuhl No worries! Clearly you like their stuff. I am open to Wyred4Sound, PS Audio S300, Rogue -- but I want to ensure I hit a level *above* Atoll, Van Alstine, etc. I know that sounds vague, and that price isn't everything, so I'm relying on folks who've heard these things and know what I mean by a level above. I have few doubts that Pass or Ayre or Hegel could do these things. |
Another for CJ. Benchmark -- are $3k new, whereas Pass, Ayre, more like $5-6k new. Bel Canto S300 about $2k new. So, folks feel they're equally good, I take it. Not interested in integrated at the moment because I have a preamp I like. Never heard of Robertson but will look. Sony -- my Walkman maker! I take that back. Too snarky. Perhaps a find. Will look. Very much heading toward Pass, I think, at a lower model. Still in process. |
@unsound thank you for the very good advice and I do understand about looking to find a match and not just follow advice blindly. in part, there is a bit of experience I need which might only be gained by trying things. I understand that this is an iterative process but it can be embarked upon in a more or less intelligent way and the advice here is helping. |
Bit of an update. I decided to get the Pass XA-25 via Reno HiFi. Very happy with the price, condition, warranty, and service. So far, I'm finding it a remarkable sounding amp. Never harsh, never lacking power, voices very intimate and present, soundstage complex and articulate. Lots of *depth* to the soundstage, too -- something the Van Alstine SET 120 piece lacked completely (a trial I posted about a while back). I know they're in different leagues, but it was something else to hear that difference. Very happy with this amp. Don't feel I need more power. Drives my 87 db Salks just fine. I regret not being able to try the other great amps mentioned here. Someday, who knows… |
@mesch Good to know! I looked extensively for a used version.
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