I have been reading and seeing more and more reel to reel decks being used. They have been displayed at several audio shows over the last couple of years. With the Tape Project tapes, and United Home Audio's list of master copies, it seems that they are making a slow but steady comeback.
Making your own recordings is very rewarding and great fun.
I wish more would try.
Zavato, love your Patti Boyd photo. A real classic.
Norman
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Hello Sam,
There are many to choose from. I originally used a NAGRA with fine results however 10.5 " reels are a must for me and the extension arms needed to accomodate the large reels for me were a problem. That and the machine must be laid onto a table top. I was always having trouble with people getting to close to the spinning reels and the extension arms are fragile. The Pioneer RT 1050 is made for location work. It has excellent specs and is very robust. It is also an excellent sounding machine. It comes in a "road case", with a front cover. The one I use at home looks new, the one I use for live recording look very well used but it functions perfectly. Also I have several NOS head blocks which are plug and play. You might search one out. They are multi voltage and parts are still obtainable. Also it has NAB and IEC bias profiles. Now. I wish I had an 820! Maybe someday.
Norman
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Mountainsong,
There are many good machines available. Don't be afraid to buy a used machine as most were very well built. I would get half track machine as that will allow you to play master copies. Sony, ReVox, TEAC, Tascam, Otari, Crown, Studer, Denon, Pioneer and Tandberg all made excellent machines. Find one that has been well maintained as servicing a worn machine can be expensive. Deepending on your budget, there are several companies that refurbish these machines to like new condition. That or seek one out from and original owner who has maintained his machine. You will never regret owning a fine feel to feel.
Norman |
Honestly, in having owned Akai, Sony, Pioneer, ReVox, TEAC, Crown, Ampex, and Otari over the years, I have never had any of the them ever fail. Even through rugged use. I have a lot of recording studio experience (late 70's as a former studio musician) and was quite used to seeing Ampex, Scully, Studer, and Crown used as mix down decks. In many radio stations here in Chicago, Ampex and Pioneer were used extensively. I have never had an occasion where I remember seeing Technics in a professional setting. I know they are good machines, but it would be hard to say that they are the 'most reliable'. The condition of the machine is really what to look for.
For me, a master tape played on an open reel is the ultimate music experience. I agree 100%, it's not about the gear, its the music. Blu-Ray doesn't do it for me. But that's me.
Norman |
Sam,
A Tascam 32 or BR-20 are great machines. Even after servicing they are very inexpensive.
Also, the Studer A807. A bit newer than an 810 and less money as well.
I was wondering what microphones you use?
Norman |
livin_262002,
When I bought my ReVox B77 half track new (series one), I thought nothing could top it. I still have it, but rarely ever use it. My Sony TC-765, and Pioneer RT-1050 sound so much better it's laughable. And I believe it is because the ReVox is tied to the NAB eq curve. The Pioneer has both NAB and CCIR, and is just an amazing sounding machine. So much headroom.
For all my years in the hobby (over 40), I have never even seen a Tandberg reel to reel. But, if they are anything like their cassette decks, or receivers and amps, then the sound must be first class!
I too am a BASF SM911 fan. I also enjoy Agfa 468 (very smooth), but you need a bit more bias to make it happy.
You should get a couple of mics (even something like two Audio Technicas or Shure 57's) and do some live recording. You won't believe how wonderful it will sound! An entire second addiction will ensue.
Norman |
Inna,
I too have cassettes and reel to reel tapes that I made in the seventies which still sound superb. Use good tape and handle properly, they will out last us.
N |
Inna,
I used to own an Otari MX 5050. Excellent machine! What was especially nice was that though it was a full half track record and play it also featured a fourth quarter track playback head, which is usefull for many commercially available tapes. Extremely well built, and very flexible. I wanted the IEC/CCIR eq, and the series one MX 5050 was set up for NAB. Series two and three 5050's have both.
You wouldnt ever be disappointed with e Otari. They still build these new, and parts are plentyfull.
A Pioneer RT1050 can often be found for very little money and were built for hard use. It would be hard to find a similar quality machine for the same investment.
Norman |
Jnovak,
Time to look for another Sony! The 880 is a really nice machine. The big Sony's have a wonderful sound. I would be happy with an 880-2! So many fine machines to choose from, and so much fun to use and listen too.
Norman |
Inna,
I don't believe the Studer will sound better then the Otari. What you will notice with regard to difference is how the Studer performs its functions. It's like a Swiss watch. Tape handling is smoother, the machine runs quite. Stopping and starting are more positive and assuring. The 810 is a world class machine. I wish I had one. I wish my ReVox ran like one! But that is the huge difference between ReVox and Studer. ReVox is a home machine, and not nearly as smooth as a Studer.
The Studer also boasts world class electronics.
Norman |
Inna,
I suppose e differences that I notice are not so much with the Studer sounding better than the Otari ( some may disagree). It's just the feel of using the machine. It's silky smooth at every touch, and the engament has more finesse. That said, the Otari's while not as smooth handling have a sterling reputation as excellent machines.
Norman
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cerrot,
I have a B77 series I. How were you able to get the IEC eq profile? ReVox is standard with NAB. Glad to hear you're enjoying your machine. Record your most listened to vinyl with it, so that you don't have to get up from your chair every 15-20 min! Also, do this.. take your favorite CD and tape it with the ReVox, then play it back and tell me how far your jaw drops. =)
Norman |
ct0517,
Thank you for the procedure. The ReVox doesn't have this flexibility, at least not to the end user. And this would be another reason for buying a Studer and not a ReVox. Cerrot must have had a technician do it.
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Sam,
What type of venues do you record live? Do you find that you are consistently using a specific mic polar patterns, or do they differ each time? I'm not familiar with the Gordon. Is it similar to a small mixing console?
Norman |
Cerrot,
Ok, now I have to research Opus. Tape Project tapes are the only ones I've tried. I see that United Audio has quite a good list of companies offering master copies.
Norman |
cerrot,
Spent the morning coffee in hand looking at Arian's website. I would love to hear one of his ATR10's. I just did a quick check of the ReVox PR99, and it seems that they are pretty reasonable. Even if you had to have a total service on one, it would come in less than $4500.00. Something to consider. When I bought my B77 back in 1979, I don't think the PR99 was available, at least I hadn't heard of it. I would have certainly opted for that since it has additional features that I would use. (most of which are already present in the Pioneer RT-1050). I also wish that ReVox had plug in head assemblies like the Pioneer. That is my most used feature of that machine. You can swap out a head-stack in 4mins time.
I would be interested in seeing what Arian would charge to mod my ReVox, since it sits on a shelf most of the time.
Thanks so much for the information!
Norman |
Livin_262002
Thanks for the PR99 update. I currently have my Pioneer RT-1050 calibrated for +6 tapes. That is a bit surprising for me, but maybe not if the machines were basically used for radio hot bias isn't an issue.
N. |
topoxforddoc,
The Sony looks intoxicating! I haven't that type of budget or room! But what fun?
N. |
alectiong,
The UHA machines are fantastic especially if they are in your budget. You can however find well maintained Otari's, Tascams, Pioneers, Studers, for much less. All of these machines will have the needed IEC eq profile, high speed and half track configuration needed to play back master tape copies. Some can be had for under $1000.00. Even with servicing, your total would be less then $2000.00 This will give you a good taste. From there, the skies the limit. Be prepared, as I promise you've never heard anything like a master tape copies.
But there is more, tape your favorite songs from albums you enjoy, get a couple of quality mics and begin making your own masters! Have a few favorite CD's? Tape them, somehow they become totally listenable without fatigue. I love analog tape and half track reel to reel is outrageously good!
Enjoy
Norman
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alectiong,
Tapes of my LP's sound like the LPs. I don't think they sound better, but I have heard that before and I don't believe there would be a different unless someone is under biasing the tape and exaggerating the highs.
N |
c1ferrari,
Sam, I hate to ask but is there a huge difference with the half inch tape? Are you running it at 30ips?
N |
inna,
I was thinking the same thought, but now I am wondering. When I last worked in a studio they were using two inch tape for 24 tracks at 30ips and then mixing the masters down to half track quater inch tape at 15ips.
I would imagine that if you were recording live to half track half inch there would certainly be an advantage. It's silly, I don't even know where I would put another machine, but I can't help thinking about it. =)
N
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Sam,
Thanks for the link to Gordon Audio. Makes for good reading with my morning coffee. This is a much more elaborate way of recording live. I have a small Nakamichi microphone preamp, and a small CRATE 6 channel board was well which allows me to alter frequency etc. What I have really been enjoying are two Nuemans KM184's straight to the machine. Excellent results.
I recently seen someone recording with a couple of older Sony's that allowed you to alter the microphone pattern. I am very interested in experimenting with this, since the Nuemans are cardioid only.
Norman |
Cerrot,
Is that from the abc records japan? The US company was purchased by MCA in 1979. I would be interested in some abc titles.
Norman |
Sam,
Yes, I use the KM184's into the RT-1050. I have also used them with the Crown 822. Finding venues here in the Chicago area is easy. Most will let you set and and record their performance, especially if you promise to make them a copy.
On one occasion, I was offered to plug directly into the sound board! The recording sounded superb and got me to thinking about maybe using one on a regular basis.
Enjoy the holiday.
Norman |
Sam,
Yes definitely. They did have a 2" 16 track machine but that was in another studio. The 24 track machine was an MCI, the 16 track machine was a Sony, but I don't remember which model.
I am wondering where you were able to find 1/2 inch masters, and who uses them? I know that the old Studer 37 could be configured for 1/2 tape, but I think that was a four track machine.
Norman |
topoxfordoc,
And this is why those old companies (Sony, Studer, TEAC, Pioneer, AKAI, Tandberg, Nagra, Otari, etc., ) need to get back to manufacturing machines again. If they could build one that was economical enough, those who love the analog sound would purchase such a machine. That and the continued availability of second generations masters is what is needed for this to work. At this time, it's better than it has been in years, but new machines are needed for this to take off like LP's have.
N. |
Inna,
This is an excellent point. Today manufacturing can be controlled and quality maintained alomost anywhere.
Even without waiting for a new machine to appear, one can buy a quality used open reel deck and have it refurbished for under $2500.00 total and have an excellent sounding system.
As I was reading your post tonight I was thinking about the two new second generation masters I ordered from abc records. More titles coming online all the time.
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Back in the early 80's, an audio friend of mine who was also a jazz fan would record some of his rare out of print LP's to 15ips half track and send them to me for a listen. They are some of my most treasured recordings. I would likewise reciprocate when I came across a rare find.
It was great fun and a wonderful way to enjoy music you would otherwise never be able to obtain.
We should do that again. As a community it would open all kinds of doors to great music. (Talking about stuff that's out of print).
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inna,
I know. We should all be doing it. I recently came across a collection of 10" 33 1/3 lps. Miles, Evans, Talyor, etc… I haven't listened to all of them, but every song on them is currently out of print.
We should begin making lists of rare recordings! I also have a pretty large collection of classical, even though it's my least listened too genre.
I purchased it about 10 years ago, and have only gotten through maybe a third of the Lp's.
Most of my LP's are classic rock and jazz.
I have a hard drive with something like 64,000 songs on it. It is a copy of a hard drive from a classic radio station. It's great fun. When I think I might want to buy a classic rock LP, but I'm not sure if l will like it, I can actually listen to it first via the hard drive. =) I make copies and give them away as gifts. Great for when your having guests over and need music in the back ground for hours on end.
I would happily make half track recordings of LP's to share. We all should.
Norman
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Mike, I used to have a 3300SX. Fantastic machine. Mine was super smooth. I would imagine that your recordings are as excellent reproductions of your vinyl collection. I actually do the same as you with my favorite vinyl. The TASCAM would be a little better for live recording, as it has a little more headroom than the TEAC. I believe the heads are exactly the same however. You should check here for some second generation master copies. There is nothing quite like them. http://avshowroomsforums.com/showthread.php?5-Companies-Currently-Producing-15ips-Reel-to-Reel-tapes...! Norman |
Tomic601,
You will love recording with the ReVox. I have a B77 series 1, that I used to use extensively. Get a couple of good used mics to start with with and plug directly into the ReVox. You will be floored at how good a recording you can get with two well placed mics.
I've never really cared for recording with digital. It's certainly easier and less costly.
But don't stop there with the ReVox. Tape your favorite LP's, make mixed tapes of favorites. Even try recording your best CDs. You will be stunned at how they come out on tape.
And certainly get get all the master copies you can.
Enjoy!
Norman |
tomic601,
You probably want somethijng with an omnidirectional pattern, or a mic with a selectable pattern. Used mics are a bargin and ususally the older the better. Look for AKG, Audio Technica, Sure, Nueman and Sony. They all made outstanding mics. I usually go to a session with a couple of omni's and at least one directional, depending on crowd noise. You can usually get good stereo and soundstage by monitioring one or two songs. From there its just set back, listen and watch the meters.
I have used boards in the past or even in some cases just plugged in to the exisitng souond board, but don't be afraid to just record straight to the deck. It's made for that and the ReVox has an incredible 24db of headroom. Thats the highest for any consumer deck.
Obviouly running a 15ips is best for recording live.
Norman
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