Raven vs primaluna integrated amplifiers

I listened to a Raven Audio Osprey and Primaluna Dialog Premium HP a few months ago on the same day, same equipment. Truth be told they're more similar than different. Both have excellent dynamics as far as tube amps go, very clear sound, and you get the holographic three dimensional sound without being overly lush or warm. So from an SQ perspective, it's a wash. Now when it comes to looks, the Raven Audio looks much better to me, and yes I know its very subjective.

For me the choice was clear. If the price and sound quality are on par, why not spend your money to support a local business (Dave and James of Raven are fellow Texans). Because Raven bypasses the middleman, a better portion of the cost goes towards parts and craftsmanship. I eventually bought the Blackhawk MK3 and have enjoyed it very much in the 3 months that I've owned it. BTW, don't let the 20 watts output fool you. It plays as loud, but with more refinement and control, than my previous amp, the 100 watt Cronus Magnum II. Having said that, let's be real -- it's not a giant killer. It does very well within it's own price bracket but no, it's not going to better a tube amp costing $10k. I briefly had an Audio Research GSi75 in the house and compared it to the Blackhawk. Sorry, not even close! I ended up selling it for other reasons but still miss it to date.

but using the "it’s made in China" reasoning is dumb.

Set aside the genocide, forced organ transplants, and the fact everything in China, every business, every dollar, is ultimately under the control of the CCP, which means every dollar that goes to China supports the CCP policy of unrestricted warfare against every nation on Earth. Make pretend none of that is going on. Set all that aside.

We are still left with the fact that China has no respect for the rule of law. They steal intellectual property. They steal technology. We all know they do. Look how many threads there are about Chinese ripoffs of amps using technology stolen and copied from others. Technology developed at great cost by people in countries with the rule of law, they steal and copy shamelessly. To the extent this happens it robs the rightful developers of technology of their just rewards.

Then on top of that something else we all know, not all solder joints are created equal. A great solder joint takes great skill. Either that or great facilities. If you want it done at Raven level you are not going to find it in China, where fast and cheap is the order of the day. Face it, no one builds anything in China for quality. China is for fast and cheap. You know it. I know it. Everyone knows it.

Finally, on top of everything else, with PL you are looking at the difference between a corporate product and a personal product. With PL made in China you have no idea who did what. When there is a problem who do you even deal with? Your dealer? Or PL? Or China? When you have a problem with Raven there is no doubt. This is Dave Thompsons product. Dave Thompson stands behind it.

You can dismiss all this if you want. But please don’t call it dumb. That would be what psychologists call projecting.

With the Raven you’re limiting your power tube options, so you should do some research re the 6L6. Also the PL 200 weighs 5 pounds more, which i assume is in the transformers, and there is for a reason other than to increase shipping weight I would guess. And 44 wpc vs 20. 

One thing to watch out for in the Forum is product opinion runs hot then cold. The Raven is currently hot, a lot of which is based on the bash China baloney. If you prefer not to buy Chinese based on politics or trade issues that makes sense...but build quality? That’s nuts.  PL quality control is world class (for its price point).

Personally i think your better off buying used than either of these, and I’ve heard them both.  

To be fair, from what I've heard, Kevin Deal of Upscale Audio stands behind PL just as well. We can be patriotic and support our own manufacturers (I try my best), but really there's no need to justify this by putting down an equally good sounding product made in another country. I buy American whenever possible, not because I dislike China, but because I want to support the little guy in my own country.

" the fact everything in China, every business, every dollar, is ultimately under the control of the CCP, which means every dollar that goes to China supports the CCP policy of unrestricted warfare against every nation on Earth. Make pretend none of that is going on. Set all that aside. "

Get off the soap box, it  hasn't stopped you from buying and repeatedly urging others to buy the Chinese made Nobsound springs, Schumann resonators.