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"Frightening" or "Relaxing" sound quality?

What do I mean by that?
Not that I wish to start a new controversy --- knowing some of the usual contributors, it may not be entirely avoidable, so let’s see what gives.

Following some of the threads on the –ultimate- ‘phase-coherent’, 'time-coherent' or yet better, both, 1st order up to steep slopes, an so on, cross-over opinions, I have these notions. So let me explain.

One quite well known ‘maverick’ (done some picking on some other well known reviewer, posting it on his site...), somewhere he states: a good speaker must have the ability 'to frighten you' --- his words, and I can see/hear what he means, at least I think so.

Some other dealer in Wilson’s marvellous products (he's around my place), tells me he can only listen for about ½ hour than he is 'exhausted' --- i.e. too intense to do any longer listening…

Nobody is talking about ‘listening fatigue’ actually, it is more an emotional fatigue, as far as I get it.

Now me, I go to a life orchestra listening and emerge pretty well ‘up-lifted’, never had any fatigue (maybe my bottom, when it got a bit too lengthy) never mind emotional fatigue! Gimme Mahler, Stravinsky, Mussorgsky, heavy (classical) metal, whow --- upliftment. Never occur to me run away, get uneasy, GET FRIGHTENED!

I clearly get ‘emotional fatigue’ listening to some types of speakers!
What were they?
I think they had one thing in common: They all where, in some way, VERY realistic, but they also had something else in common, --- they did not, as it seems, stick too well to a reasonably flat amplitude response… ah ha.

What this design regimen seems to produce during listening to keep on making you jump? Apparently always something rather unexpected in happening! Now we do also know what makes us (as humans) ‘jump’: it is some unexpected ‘something’ coming ‘out of the bush’ a snapping branch, some sort of VERY REAL sound, that does not quite go along with the general set of the acoustic environment.

Now take some ‘benign, dumb’ kind of speaker, it has so little in REALISTIC sound to offer, it just can’t frighten you. You (your instinct, subconscious) just don’t ‘buy’ into it.
Now take a VERY realistic sound-producer (the ones that can make you jump) and mess with the amplitude response, what you are getting is this on the edge of your seat reaction. The VERY opposite of what a lot of music has as its intention. (Not like AV ‘Apocalypse now’ kind of chopper going to attack you from any old angle, top, behind, etc.)

Lastly, has this something to do with why lots of folks perhaps shy away from these sort of designs?
I have listened to my share and I shy away, because as REAL everything seems to be in the reproduction, it keeps me in a state of inner tension, apprehension --- even listening to some Mozart Chamber music, as there is ALWAYS something very REAL, but somehow unsettling going on.

It might just explain why some of these designs don’t ‘cut the mustard’ and not survive in the long run. Unless, and open to opinion, that we are (most of us anyway) so messed up and transistor-radio-sound-corrupted that we seem ‘unworthy of these ‘superior’ audio-designs.
I honestly don’t think so, but you may have it otherwise, as they say YMMV.

I thought it is of value to bring this up, since it does not ever seem to be part of any of the more ‘technical’ discussions ---- the human ‘fright/flight’ element in ignoring proper FLAT amplitude response in favour of minimal insertion losses, or proper impedance compensation, notch filtering, et al, just so to obtain this form of stressful realism.

It might be also something to do with age, a much younger listener (in my experience) likes to be stirred up, and emotionally knocked all over the place ---- listening to Baroque music like bungee jumping?!
Maybe.
It be interesting to hear if it is just my form of ‘over-sensitiveness’ that brings forth this subject.
Best,
Axel
axelwahl

Showing 13 responses by mrtennis

mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
the hippocratic oath should apply to audio: "do no harm"

so where does the harm come from ? i think, mainly peaks in the upper mids/lower treble. these peaks are not relaxing, but not frightening either.

balanced frequency response or a slight attenuation in the range 1000 to say 4000 hz may be easier on one's nerves.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
without being a reactive person, you won't be frightened.

the personality of the listener is being completely ignored.

opinions are interesting, but some are wild and defy common sense.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
hi mapman:

it's all in your mind. if i listen to the sound of a thunder storm on a stereo, i will not be frightened. there are sounds that are not loud that warn of impending danger that can frighten. it has nothing to do with sound, but rather conditioing, between stimuli and responses.

it's not the equipment, it's our fears--irrational or real.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
hi axel:

many responses to sound are within our control. one can choose to get angry , or sad, or frightened.

we humans are not just passive actors. i think you exaggerate the significance of sound to create fear responses. i will chose to dislike sound rather than be frightened of it.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
hi shadorne:

i don't think philosophy has anything to do with the subject. i detect a tad of obsessiveness with the words "frightening" and "relaxing".
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
music that frightens, depending upon one's personality, may not necessarily be the fault of a stereo system.

i think it is more useful to consider the term consonant or disonant with one's sonic preferences, in lieu of frightening or relaxing.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
why would one react the same way to something that is real, e.g., live music and something that is not real, i.e., the sound of a stereo system.

i think we are getting carried away with this frightening stuff. listening to recorded music is listening to a facsimile--an illusion. unless you really get carried away, an illusion isn't frightening.

live music may or may not frighten you. i think you almost have to will yourself to be frightened. i've never experienced fear in a concert hall, nor am i aware of such a reaction on the part of anyone who has attended concerts.

oh well, the placebo effect is alive and well, and the power of suggestion can be very strong.

don't confuse the startle effect with fear.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
hi detlof:

if you can be so taken with an illusion , more power to you. especially with orchestral music, the diffference between real and recorded is great indeed. it may be mind over matter, again.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
a good stereo system puts you to sleep, while a bad one frightens you. who wants to be frightened ? perhaps a masochist. does anyone belong to o-c anonymous ?
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
it's just talk. a lot of things are said without any ddeep meaning. one would have to not speak all the time because much of what is said is that of opinion. i'm not asking anyone to accept what i say as fact.

indeed, many of the threads would be vacuums if it weren't for opinions. it's just small talk. it is part of life.

there is knowledge, fact and opinion. there is very little knowledge, some facts and a lot of opinion.

good try tvad.

what is said is not always of great significance or importance.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
hi tvad:

you have a bone to pick with me. however, i can't argue with your analysis. what's interesting is your purpose for selecting my statement about "good stereo systems".

it's also interesting that you occasionally regurgitate some of my posts. again, while not disputing the facts, i am curious as to the reason for this.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
here is my stereo system:

quad 57/magnepan 1.6

vtl deluxe 120 and quicksilver mid mono amps

maplesahde ultra 4 se and nobis proteus preamps

vincent d s6 cd player/transport

ess technology sabre 32 bit evaluation dac

cables:ear to ear, soundstring and two homemade power cords

ear to ear speaker cables, soundstring and aural thrills gold interconnects

ps audio power plant, nirvana audio isolation transformer, enacom speaker filter, enacom ac filter, enacom interconnect filters, bob young line filter furniture foam and sound boosters as anti resonant devices

room treatment room tunes, and eggcrate mattresses on walls.

i haven't broken my own rules. sating an opinion that is unimportant, like other opinions for the purpose of conversation is ok.
mrtennis
3,295 posts
 
i have never been frightened when listening to music on a stereo system.

i think there may be a confusion between persoanilty or listening styles and sound.

although over simplifying, there are two types of listeners, namely, stimulus seekers (ss) and stimulous avoiders (sa) .
the easiest way for sa listeners to avoid discomfort is to turn down the volumeand/or make sure high frequencies are well-behaved, perhaps, somewhat attenuated.

there are too many variables present in stereo system configurations and operations to ascribe a capability of a speaker to do something. in addition, a listener would have to be so inclined to be a very reactive person.

there is a lot more to this, but it is most applicable to a listener's personality rather than to the audio equipment.

one last thing, two listeners auditioning the same stereo system will have two different experiences.

thus speakers are not intrinsically frightening, but, listeners may frighten easily.

it's about psychology, more than components. don't take the listener out of the equation. for evrey so-called "frightening" speaker, there is a stereo system with that speaker in it which does not frighten, because a listener does not have such a reaction.
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