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Questioning the need for a DAC

Friends,
I have a modified Oppo 103 that was a huge step up from my $2K Consonance tube CD player.  I also have a Jolida FX Tube DAC, maybe the II version, which I have had for many years.  I ran the Oppo directly into my system (I have a Don Sachs tube preamp and various amps, tube and SS, and Spatial Audio Hologram M4 Turbo S speakers) and then through the Jolida.  I honestly didn't hear a difference.  Some months later,  I demo'd a Schiit Gungnir and did the same comparison.  I really couldn't discern an audible difference with the Schiit in or out of the system.  I will admit that I sent the Schiit back for a refund after only 30 hours or so of burn-in so maybe 100 hours of burn-in might have lead to a different outcome.  A boatload of audiophiles rave about the sonic improvement with the pricey DAC's in their systems, no question about it.  With my ears, not so much.  

A "cheap and cheerful" audiophile friend of mine, who doesn't listen to much digitally-reproduced music, posed an interesting question.   If one invests in a modern quality CD player (i.e., like the Oppo 103 or 105, which make the Stereophile list of "Class A" products or many others between $1K-$5K), why is there the expectation that one needs a separate DAC to improve the sound of the DAC?   It is not trivial question.  As a matter of fact, I called Oppo while I was auditioning the Schiit DAC, nonplussed, asking why I wasn't hearing some significant improvement with the addition of an external DAC of the caliber of the Gungnir.  In response, the Oppo rep suggested, quite casually, that maybe the internal DAC in the modestly-priced Oppo 103 was quite good.  Indeed, because that is what my 63-year old ears told me.

I'd be keen to hear feedback from others who ponder the same question.   As I age, I am aware of the desire of sellers of many audio products to strike a deal with me that frankly might benefit them more financially than I  benefit sonically.  Cheers, Mark 

  
whitestix

Showing 4 responses by randy-11

randy-11
1,913 posts
 
You don't say how you tested nor on what equipment, or music.

I would expect the OPPO DAC to be very good.  I'd also expect the type of speakers (and the ability of the amps to control the speakers) to be fairly critical.  We might be at the dawning of the Age of A-DACiness (an Aquarian analogy where most DACs are pretty durn good; A quality and A+ or A- but no D- DACs).

I did some preliminary testing on a stock Oppo 103 vs. my ancient Cal audio Icon and did not find a different or much difference.  I didn't have time to make up a good A/B set of discs, but RS, Floyd etc. did not sound much different to my 64 year old ears using a Sonic Frontiers Line One > Sunfire Cinema Grand bi-amping Maggie 1.5Qs. I did try hard to listen to the initial attack impulse on drums and perhaps there was something there??

IF I'd used Jazz at the Pawnshop maybe I could have heard a big difference - maybe.  But I don't really like that CD all that much.
randy-11
1,913 posts
 
if you are addressing me then you didn't understand my comments
randy-11
1,913 posts
 
For one, I like CDs.

I prefer them to the snap/pop/crackle of vinyl.  The CD does need to be properly mastered tho.

I also agree that the Oppo has a pretty good internal DAC.
randy-11
1,913 posts
 
https://www.oppodigital.com/sonica-dac/

they are saying better SQ than the 103/105 players, and they are highly regarded, so....
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