Preamp Deal of the Century

Whew, after the better part of last evening and this evening, I just finished reading this very profuse thread. Having enjoyed its eclectic and congenial repartee, I do appreciate all the contributions, but I have a few questions.

I would consider my rig to be one of high resolution and eminently listen able, but it is sans a pre-amp.

What might I expect a pre-amp, and especially a Supratek to do for me? That is, I am running a Wadia 861 direct into CAT JL1 amps. How can additional circuitry, interconnects, etc. help the sonics of my system? BTW, the CAT’s are driving Soundlab M1’s.

Has anyone heard a pre with and without the remote option? Does having it affect/detract from the sonics?

Would using the HT pass-through with my Wadia be equivalent to running direct to the Amps as I am now doing? Other than additional cabling (and the sonic signature of same) --in comparison to my currently direct method -- would I observe any changes in resolution, imaging, soundstage, frequency response etc. by using the direct pass-through? BTW, I picked up on this concept from a previous submittal, but would appreciate confirmation of the pristine pass-through concept, if perchance the Wadia and line stage were not to my liking.

One final question, given that synergy is a very important element of our hobby, would running a CAT Signature or Ultimate pre-amp (vs a Supratek) with my CAT monoblocks be the logical choice (and why am I thinking of a Supratek)? On paper, CAT-to-CAT would be appear to be most synergistic combination, but obviously, paper has nothing to do with the etherealness we are seeking. I did notice some mention of comparisons between the Supratek pre’s vs CAT’s, but read no discussion of the differences. Someone with the experience of hearing both these pre’s, and the desire to discuss same, would be appreciated. Of course, if you feel a discussion of these differences/similarities would impede the flow of this discussion, by all means, please contact me via my e-mail.

Thanks for the cogent and very helpful replies. Indeed, the same should be said for Mick. I e-mailed him just prior to my above submittal to this thread, and he replied in well under FOUR (4) hours -- impressive!

Ecclectique: Thanks for mentioning the Luminescence and the ARC sp-10 mk2. While I have heard neither, based on many recommendations from folks whose judgment I highly respect, both these pre’s along with the CAT pre(s) were on my very short list.

Tubegroover: Interesting you noticed that I didn’t mention a “tt”. My interest in obtaining a pre, is a pending return to vinyl.

While I’ve had a keen interest in audio since my youth, until the last decade or so, I haven’t had the highly resolved system that I now do, and because I wanted CD to be good enough, it simply was. However, with help from friends, and information gleaned from sites such as this, I have a desire to return to spinning vinyl (I still have my entire album collection dating back to the ‘60’s) and wanted a pre with phono that would facilitate that process.

I haven’t a clue as to which medium I will prefer; so my primary interest is to obtain a pre that will do no harm and preferably enhance, my present Wadia 861 experience. Based on all of your comments, and Mick’s, that appears to be more than a given with the Supratek’s.

While it’s possible that I may prefer vinyl, my intent is to initially spend $2-3K on a “tt”. My present thoughts are to obtain a VPI Scout, a Nottingham Interspace, or some other “tt” in this price ballpark. I know “tt”’s are totally off this thread’s subject, but any comments relative to a starter “tt” would be appreciated. I’m wondering whether I should use my budget to buy new or used, any thoughts on, or off-line, would be very appreciated. My last “tt” was a Thorens/Shure V15TypeIII (never had a MC), and was mothballed years ago, so my re-entrance into the LP world is essentially blazing new ground for me, and any suggestions provided would be welcomed.

Getting back to pre’s, the Syrah/Chenin with HT pass-through would appear to be a wonderful choice for my purposes, and especially for the price of admission. While it may not present the ultimate in phono capabilities, I’m certainly not looking for that right now, and perhaps never will, but if the line stage enhances my CD experience as much as I’m told it will, and I can spin some of my old LP’s as well, it would be worth it.

Again thanks for your replies, and the continuation of the never-ending thread Cheers, Mike.

Ecclectique et al: Thanks for your kind remarks and helpful comments. Count me as another prospective Supratek owner. Yep, I just ordered a Syrah (Chenin).

As with other comments in this thread, this buying unheard, is a leap of faith, but one, I have a fairly high level of confidence in. I first tried Harmonic Tech cables well before any periodical advertisements, or reviews simply based on “internet word of mouth” and was very satisfied with them until a local Engineer/Audiophile acquaintance fabricated his own, for which I became quite smitten, and replaced my HT’s .

Internet “word of month” also prompted my audition of the Audio Resolution Opus 21 CDP. Albeit expensive, it’s a wonderful machine for its price point (and lives up to its “Resolution” name), and if I didn’t get a really good deal on a Wadia 861, I would have kept the Opus 21.

With that said, I hope the results of my purchase are as positive as everyone’s herein. I intend to re-read all the posts about tube rolling and start contemplating doing same.

Additionally, I intend to research turntable and cartridge combinations, and if as I requested above, anyone is of the mind to share some of their insights regarding $2-3K (+/- within reason) combinations, I would be quite grateful ..Cheers, Mike

I’m seeking suggestions about interconnect length.

Having ordered my Chenin a couple of days after Saint2, I'm eagerly preparing to hear from Mick that mine is ready.

Because I ordered the Chenin to re-start spinning vinyl after a long hiatus, I'm contemplating moving my rack from in between my speakers to in front, and to the side of them.

My Interconnect run would double from 3 Meters to 6 Meters. I certainly do NOT have to do this. Consequently, I'm seeking advice before I spend the time and money to do so.

Would I experience a sonic degradation from using a 6-Meter pair of interconnects? Are any others successfully using a run of this length, or longer? Or has it been tried, and for the worse?

I would like to thank all the contributors to this thread. Based on your observations, and friendly repartee, I ordered a Chenin, and just received it this weekend, and all I can say is, WOW – what superb esthetics, and glorious music.

As far as I’m concerned, the never ending discussion of whether a CD Player connected direct to an amp is better than a pre-amp in between, has been resoundly answered in the negative! In the case of the Chenin, and my system, there is NO comparison versus direct and Chenin intervention. It’s an understatement to say that inserting the Chenin between my Wadia 861 and CAT JL-1’s created quite an improvement -- dynamics were improved, more detail was heard, the soundstage was better (both depth and breadth), and PRAT and musicality were improved.

Vocals were a prime example of the improvements wrought by the Chenin. They were found to be more “fleshed” out – i.e., they sounded more like a human was behind the voice. Pat Barber’s and Alison Krauss’s vocals were both more musical and detailed -- changes in inflection and breathing were easier noticed without the added glare that sometimes comes with increased detail. And the really good news is that and all of these positives were heard right off of the truck, and out of the box, with essentially no run-in!

So, in the case of my system, by adding more electronics, and cables, I’ve added a layer of simplicity. Yep, it sure is counter-intuitive, but the Chenin sounds better than no preamp at all, and whether that means it’s the pre-amp to end all pre-amps, I ‘m not sure! What it does mean is that it’s a darn good pre-amp, and one that adds, rather than deducts, and as a line-stage, it’s a real keeper.

However, with that said, my primary reason for buying the Chenin was not for its line stage, but for its phono capabilities. Wanting to get back into vinyl after a couple decade hiatus, I thought the Chenin would provide a good avenue for doing this. If it improved my CD playback all the better, but since it is doing so with such aplomb, I’m looking even more forward (if that’s possible) to the receipt of a new Galibier Quattro Turntable, and Tri-Planar Tonearm, and dusting off all the albums I’ve accumulated since the 1960’s.

Thanks again to everyone for the time spent discussing this fine pre-amp, and to Mick for catering to us “Audiophools” (he must be one himself), the Supratek Chenin is truly a wonderful product, and a great find.

Amandarae: Nice try! Chiding a toddler's disruptive behavior without consequences, begets more of the same. The emotional age of some is unknown, so simple chiding is impossible, and results in more of the same. Why? Because they can!
Yep, speakers are the most important component! I just can't understand why my Pioneer Receiver ain't making my Soundlab's sing.
An "S" word might be the most important component of a rig, but it's not speaker -- try synergy.
Every parade is subject to rain; however, a drop or two doesn't require an umbrella. The over all tone of this thread has been more than positive, with nary more than a couple of drops.
May the never ending thread continue unabated ..

Kevin (Ella4ever): My purchase of a Chenin was motivated by this thread. Planning on a return to vinyl, I needed a pre-amp with phono (was running a Waida direct into my amps).
Just thought I would advise that the Chenin exceeded my expectations. Rather than being a detriment by being between my Wadia and amps, it was a wonderful addition. More importantly, playing vinyl again is a blast. Other than to compare a CD with an LP, I haven't listened to any of my CD's, since the purchase of my new vinyl rig.
Cello advised you to check out Teres, and I did, but after fliping a coin, I decided to go with Galibier. Both Chris at Teres, and Thom at Galibier started down the the same Turntable development path, but eventually took separate courses. While I've had great results with my Galibier Quattro, and I can't say enough good things about Thom Mackris of Galibier, I'm sure Chris and his Teres Tables would provide similar results.
In any case, if you decide to go the vinyl route, you won’t regret it, and the Supratek purchase.

Having owned a Supratek Chenin pre-amp for approximately 2-years, last week, I had occasion to contact Mick about a perceived problem. I say perceived, because after Mick's reply, I realized that I had made an erroneous assumption.

However, the reason for this post is to not discuss the specifics of my communiqué with Mick, but to commend Mr. Maloney for his first rate communications skills. Not only were Mick's communications before the sale detailed, cogent, and prompt, but thereafter, my experiences were as positive as before the sale.

It's great owning a fine piece of equipment. It's even better knowing that its designer and manufacturer provides top notch customer service.

PS. The same positive comments apply to my turntable manufacturer, Thom Mackris (Galibier Design), my amplifier manufacturer, Ken Stevens (CAT [Convergent Audio Technologies]), Dr. Roger West -- my Soundlab speaker manufacturer, and Gordon Rankin of Wavelength Audio (my USB DAC designer/builder). I've said it before on Audiogon, but it bears repeating, by buying from cottage and SMALL businesses; I’ve reaped BIG rewards, and have forged lasting friendships. Cheers to all those I’ve mentioned, and to all the other wonderful dedicated, inventive, manufacturers and hobbyists that help us reproduce the music that so fires our passions!

I had occasion to very recently e-mail Mick. My Chenin that I purchased direct from Down Under is still purring quite nicely. My question to Mick involved some machinations that I was doing for which I was seeking his advice. As when I was preparing to place my order, asking many questions, in as many e-mails, Mick responded to my most recent question quite promptly. Thanks Mick .!!!

For those folks that think it's risky to buy boutique equipment, I own three pieces, plus two others that are semi-boutique, and support for all, has been first rate. Moreover, performance to value has been far more than first rate.

Obviously, the phrases your mileage may vary, and let the buyer beware apply; however, for me, these purchases have been the most rewarding over the many years and purchases that I've made while being immersed in this crazy hobby!

More importantly, believe it or not, I’m probably more risk adverse than most; however, after beginning in this hobby well before the internet, my advice was from periodicals spouting all amps sounded the same etc The internet and sites such as this have changed all of that and thankfully so! I’ve found that a little risk has paid me back in a ratio that both the house wins and the buyer in my case, has never lost!

For all of those folks that want to keep their purchases coming from established company’s so be it. I wanted to continue working for General Motors 15 years ago, when my Division was sold. Today, well not so much !!

Cheers to all,

-Mike