Preamp Deal of the Century

Hi Cello - you're welcome. Regarding your Cortese - I wonder what vintage your Cortese is. You may have to contact Mick for info on those tubes. My Cortese uses the 6688 tube up front followed by the 6922.

Honestly? I haven't experienced too much improvement out of changing the phono tubes. Right now I use Telefunken CCa as the 6922 and Mullard E180F in the 6688 position. I'd say its a little better than stock in terms of clarity but the gains are not as significant as when changing other tubes in this preamp.

Hi Larry, I've had a few pair of the very early (and expensive) Siemens CCa's and they were nearly unlistenable in this preamp for whatever reason. I had read numerous posts on how great the Siemens were and boy was I disappointed.

The Telefunken CCa's are a different story very, very good.

IF you buy the Siemens, be sure you can return them if they do not meet your satisfaction.

Ecclectique - well... In the Supratek, the Siemens Gold Pin CCa's were a nightmare. The ones I had (two pair) were purchased from two separate dealers at different times. I had read how "great" they were so.... I paid the bucks and purchased some. They were open sounding that's for sure.. to the extent of being obnoxious - even etchy or bright - downright screachy!

Given the reputation of the Siemens, I suspect its me and not the tubes.. but.. I would never recommend them to anyone. There is also the possibility of these tubes being candidates for counterfeiting due to their very high price.

I forgot all the "claim to fame" and specifications for this particular tube but it took me a long time to hunt them down. The pairs I had were from the early 1960's (1962) and gold pin.

In the Cortese, Telefunken CCa sounds superb - however.. I use Mullard ECC32's in the line stage. That must be considered as a part of the overall sonic signature. The stock Philips JAN tubes sound fine but ultimately do not have the clarity & resolution of the Tele CCa.

As I said earlier, the changes in the Supratek resulting from changes made to phono stage tubes are not exactly as substantial as the improvements acheived through changing the line stage and power supply tubes. But there are improvements none-the-less only here (in the phono stage) you REALLY have to pay for them.

Hi Larry, Congratulations on the Moray James PC. They require a days or two to stabilize after being shipped. But sound very good right out of the bag. Hopefully Moray can get that cable built and out to you quickly. Let us know what you think.

Mlkiz - I can recall myself being at wits end several years ago when I purchased my first Supratek. The wait was a miserable experience for me. The longer the wait went on, the more I thought about canceling the order out of sheer frustration. I am the kind of guy who likes "instant gratification" when I spend money, and when buying a Supratek, NOTHING is instant.

Once I received (and listened to) the Supratek, I understood and I forgave. It was instantly clear that the wait was well worth the end result.

You know... There is one advantage of the long wait - perhaps it has a lot to do with the high resale value on the used market.

In order to build a Supratek, Mick must order his parts from various suppliers. It's not uncommon for those suppliers to be out of certain parts and/or have them on backorder.

Reasons for delays in getting a Supratek built are often more complex than it may appear.

Americanflag - yeah... Mick has done it. He actually commented that the results could be very positive to some people and therefore understand why people may prefer it to the standard Alps. The downside to him was that the stepped attenuator allowed for very little margin between too quiet and too loud in his high efficiency system.

Bent Audio offers a remote control for DACT attenuators: http://www.bentaudio.com/parts/dact.html

I am not sure if it would fit in a Supratek outfitted with a phono stage but imagine it could be done.

Mick told me he would install the DACT's as an option.

*I* haven't done the swap yet mostly because I am debating what to do about my system. See - I just purchased a new turntable (which is a keeper) and it doesn't visually match the Grange cosmetics of my Cortese (Gold & Wood). I am considering selling my Cortese to get another one in Chrome finish.

If I were to keep my Cortese, I would certainly try the DACT and when I get a new one, I will order it with the DACT (+ remote if possible).

My suspicion has always been that the stock Alps is not very transparent.

Jphii, the Syrah, Chardonnay and Chenin have a rectifier on the power supply & that's it, no regulators.

When I first saw Grannyring's pre, I thought it might be a Cortese power supply hooked to a Syrah - but Grannyring informed me otherwise.

I don't know the history of that unit - Mick might.

Mlkiz, sometimes the fuse will blow if using a rectifier which heats up too fast. Maybe that's why someone suggested changing the rectifier.

The strange thing is that I think the wood cases go on the preamp chassis BEFORE the preamp is built. In my experience, it would be insanely difficult to put the case on after the internals are wired up or remove the case once the preamp is built.

Hi Cello - Hopefully I'll be around to buy them from you.

Just curious, what rectifier tube are you using with the 350B's?

I'm still stuck on the Bendix 6106 - it was weird sounding and almost nauseating when I first started using it but after a few months of break in, became unbeatable.

Anyone know of a source for fat base Mullard GZ34's?

Cello - Thanks for the info. I've purchased many tubes from Brendan - including the Bendix I use now. I'll give the Mullard metal base GZ34 another try with the 350B's as soon as I can find one. Unfortunately, last time the metal base GZ34 didn't do it for me. I presume that some of these NOS tubes are actually NOS (believe it or not) and they need break-in just like everything else. The change to the Bendix over break-in was dramatic. Maybe my old GZ34 metal base was still trying to break in when I wrote it off. Hmmm....

Ecclectique - to break in the Bendix, I ran my Cortese power supply 24/7 for about a month without turning it off except to re-connect the Preamp for listening sessions.

At first the Bendix seemed almost out of phase and disorienting. I hated that tube. But.... once broken in its pretty amazing. I need to pick up a few more.

The only nit about the Bendix is how long it takes to heat up.

I use Mullard CV181 / ECC32's in my Cortese. Take note, they are electronically different than 6SN7's. You can see photos of 'em in my system - good looking tubes to be sure. I think they sound very nice - much like the TungSol Rounds.

Regarding the different electrical properties, I tried the CV181's in a friends Syrah and for whatever reason the preamp remote control stopped working and there was very low gain while the CV181's were in. Perhaps Ecclectique
can explain?

NOS CV181's are hard to find & quite pricey.

Hi Thf,

Sonically they are very similar but the Cortese is more refined, precise and has better bass extension. The highs are more controlled and sweeter with the Cortese. The tonal balance of the mids is difficult to distinguish between the two preamps.

Overall both preamps have the same family sound but in an effort to describe the subtle differences with words I will undoubtedly create a scenario which is more exaggerated than is true. Ready for an exaggeration?? Here it goes!!The Syrah sounds more immature - like a rambunctious child compared to a more mature, strict and disciplined Cortese.

Done exaggerating.

This type of improvement is typical in high end audio when upgrading any component within the same manufacturers line.

Unfortunately the area where there is the most significant improvement between the Cortese and the Syrah is in the overall quality of the unit.

For whatever reason, the Cortese has zero microphonics, zero hum and/or buzz. The Cortese is not as sensitive to tube quality and less sensitive to where its power supply is located. The Cortese does not rattle or vibrate internally - it's heavy and solid - like it should be.

The Cortese seems like a better perfected high-end component whereas the Syrah, to some degree feels like a high-end "DIY" type of component.

Awesome results can be achieved with the Syrah but its subtle quirks can overtly effect the sonics if extra care is not taken in tube selection, positioning / location of the power supply, relation of the preamp to other components, etc.

Is it worth the extra money? I think so.

Thanks Tom! It's good to be back! The past several months have been very hectic. Now it looks as if I'll be moving from California to Charlotte, North Carolina within the next month or two...so it's not over yet. I'll do my best keep up to speed with everyone on this thread as things progress.

When is your Cortese due to arrive?

Thf & Larryrosen - Sorry, I don't have any experience with the Cabernet but would expect it to outperform the Cortese (Sauvignon) line stage particularly due to a better / more refined power supply. I've read good things about the new PX4 tube version and also heard there is a 300B option for the preamp which should sound fantastic!

One of the BIG benefits I'd expect to find in the Cabernet is the use of four regulator tubes in the power supply. I'd imagine this would give tremendous flexibility to tweaking the sound of the unit. For example, we Syrah/Chardonnay and Cortese/Sauvignon users only get two power supply regulator tubes to play with. These tubes impact the sound tremendously! Many (like I) have settled on the Western Electric 350B as the best tube but....in my view, there is something to be said for the Genalex KT66 also. The 350B is powerful and seemingly very accurate sounding but can be a bit harsh if the music calls for it. Sometimes accuracy (and associated harshness) can diminish from the overall enjoyment of listening. The Genalex Gold Lion KT66 on the other hand is a bit more rounded and seductive - something about it sucks a listener in to the music - very, very involving. In my mind, the best setup would be a combination of these tubes vs. one or the other.

I find I listen less often with the 350B's while with the KT66's, I find myself engaged for long periods of time all the while realizing that what I hear may not be exactly faithful to the original recording. Something tells me the 350B/KT66 combo in a Cabernet or Grange would be heaven sent! That alone would make the Cabernet a great choice!

Personally I am thinking of asking Mick to make me a Cabernet/Grange power supply for my Cortese.... or even a "dual mono" power supply!

Ecclectique - thank you very much. I'm actually looking forward to the move to Charlotte. The difference in cost of living should afford me a great listening space!

A few revelations happened today... I got a new cartridge to replace my Shelter 901. I settled on the Benz LP Ebony because Judith Spotheim, the maker of my turntable & arm, OEM's the cartridge and highly recommends it as a great match - plus George Cardas and Jeff Joseph also use a Benz(ish) cartridge on their La Luce tables. Anyhow, the Benz requires a >500 input impedance and to my knowledge, the Supratek's come with a 10, 100, 1000 and 47K input switch.

Has anyone here changed the impedance input switch on their Supratek? What's involved?

Revelation number two. With the Benz, I no longer think the KT66's are a very good tube in the regulator. The 350B's are definately better now. No question. And involving too! Very, very nice!

Hi Larry, I thought about trying the UNIverse and discussed with SORAsound but...I was scared it was going to be too bright. Especially after hearing a Koetsu Onyx Platinum. My table is a bit forward sounding in the upper mids & this is apparently why the Benz is the cartridge of choice for the table.

Heck.. I may still try the UNIverse

Pkaram, the best phono stage I've listened to was my Aesthetix IO Signature DIRECT to an amp... WITHOUT ANY VOLUME CONTRL IN BETWEEN. It was insane! I set the jumpers to 60db gain and let her rip!

The purity of the sound was remarkable but the experience left me very confused.

I compared an Aesthetix direct vs. Aesthetix through a Supratek Chardonnay & it was amazing to hear how much the Supratek tarnished the sound. Sorry to say.

So I tried a passive Placette and it was even worse...it sounded like garbage to be honest. Compressed, ZERO dynamics, flat, dull and lifeless.

The Supratek was definitely better than the Placette for whatever reason.

I ended up selling the Aesthetix because I couldn't find a volume control which satisfied me. Even the Aesthetix built in volume control compressed dynamics to some extent.

That's when I purchased a Cortese and I've been using it ever since. One day I'm going to take the Cortese to an engineer and have the DACT volume control as well as a few other "streamlining" mods completed. Hopefully that will kick up the purity of the Cortese.

But.. to this day, nothing compares to the Aesthetix direct. What an experience!

Ethifi & Fiddler, thanks for the info - I didn't know there were multiple gain switches on the newer Chardonnay's.

Hi Fiddler - Modifying a Supratek?? I am sure the DACT will bring a big improvement over the stock potentiometer. I'm not sure why I haven't done this yet.

The "streamlining" mods I am thinking about include:

> Bypassing the MUTE switch. - To my knowledge, all signals run through this switch. This will be one less item in the signal path which should improve transparency.

> Removing the extra wire from unused inputs - since the wire used inside a Supratek is unsheilded it tends to pick up radio frequency & adds to crosstalk problems which could degrade transparency.

> Removing the balanced output and associated switch - again I think all signals run through this switch. I don't use balanced output and the preamp makes a nasty buzz sound when the balanced output or in-between setting is selected - something wrong is going on there.

> Replacing selector knob with a DACT selector - I expect the stock selector knob is not as transparent as we'd like.

> Taking a closer look at the HT Bypass and improving on the design a little - again, all signals run through this switch and it could degrade transparency.

> Rewiring the signal path with different wire (Kondo or Siltech)

Jpms - thanks for the info on the Cab, I didn't know what. From Slowhands post, it seems that the Cortese now has two regulators. That might be a good thing. Wonder if I can get my Cortese upgraded...

Larryrosen, I received an email reply from Mick at 1:23 AM Pacific... So I know he's there.

When ordering a Supratek, it's always best to iron out the details associated with your particular needs prior sealing the deal. When requesting a price quote on a non standard unit, itemize ALL special requirements in one email. This provides the necessary documentation Mick needs to refresh his memory once he starts building your preamp.

Jazzdude you're right. The star dust, pixie dust, hocus pocus stuff is VERY colored but some of the other cables are colored in the other direction and cause a bleaching effect. Don't get me wrong, coloration and bleaching can be a good thing. The goal should be to make the component sound correct. In my experience the Suprateks do not need too much correcting - changing tubes takes care of most of what's required.

Ethifi - Sounds to me like you need some new 6F6G's. I'm not sure what the "Brima" brand is... Did you mean Brimar?

Tubeworld has a good selection of NOS 6F6G's. They may cost a bit more than you'd pay on Ebay but you'll be taken care of should you have problems with a particular tube.

Tubeworlds tube list is at:
http://www.tubeworld.com/tubes.html

Also.. what is this 3 way gain switch you're talking about?
I've only seen low/high gain switches on Chardonnay's. Is this a new "feature"?

Mhu - choosing the right powercord is usually a matter of finding something which best suits your system - without going over the top. The Supratek will introduce some new benefits into your system and perhaps create deficiencies as well (I hope not). The cord which works best for you will ultimately be a matter of identifying what is introduced vs. what was taken away - and compensating.

Simple right?

In my system, Elrod PC's when used on amps and preamps are a bit over the top for bass but the EPS 2 Sig can create an awesome dimensionality when used on a digital source component.

For the Supratek, I usually find a more neutral power cord to work best. The two I like are the Electraglide Mini Khan (not the plus! the plus sucks!!) and the Moray James PWR 1.5. Moray's "new" PWR 2.5 can be good but I've heard mixed results with people who've tried the cable on Supratek's. Some like it and others do not whereas the 1.5 was almost unanimous - everyone I knew who tried it, loved it.

The one caveat is that if you are used to a more flavorful PC on your preamp (Shunyata, BMI Shark, Acoustic Zen, etc) you will not like the Moray James or Electraglide regardless because these cables are neutral and hence do not change the tonal balance of a component or create a hazy-sugar-sweetness to the music.

Since you've been using an Elrod on a previous preamp, I suspect your system requires something more neutral - (the EPS2 Sig is a bit less neutral than the EPS 3 Sig but still much more neutral than some of the other flavored PC's I've mentioned.)

Of course you'll want to give the Elrod a try but I think you'll find that the Supratek's bass (with the right tubes) is sufficiently accurate to the source and the Elrod may not be necessary in this application.

In which case try an Electraglide Mini Khan (copper) which will benefit the Supratek with increased transparency. Not transparency in terms of added highs - but more of a clean, purity to the sound. Much like live music vs. processed and compressed recorded sound. Or.. try the Moray James PWR 2.5 (the PWR1.5 is no longer available) for subtle improvement that introduces a lively & emotionally fulfilling sound & pace that once you've heard is difficult to live without.

Hi Jazzdude - my mistake in classifying Shunyata as a "flavored" cord in all regards. You are correct, they do have the Alpha series which trys to be more neutral.

Mhu - give it a shot. The Elrod is a great cord. I personally like the EPS 2 Sig you have much better than the EPS 3 Sig which to me had a certain harshness I couldn't live with. However, running an Electraglide Ultra Khan (not the series II or Statement - just the first generation Ultra Khan) from the wall into a Vansevers Power strip followed by the Elrod EPS 3 Sig into the component was very nice sounding. The Ultra Khan's detailed yet creamy sound removed the harshness of the Elrod and made for a superb combo.

Another interesting couple of cords are the NBS Statement - adds pace and slam to the music, and Harmonix X-DC Studio Master - which is extremely detailed but slightly bleaching.

Oh... you might also try the Supra LoRad - I think they're about 125 bucks. Lots of people I've talked to are using these to replace big buck cords. I've never tried one though.

Supratek Modifications - would anyone be interested in a "package" modification to Supratek preamps? I am currently having my Cortese looked at by a local audio engineer named Nick Gowan who operates the US service center for Audio Note & Nagra - as well as a few other brands. Nick's website is at http://www.tsound.com

Anyhow.... Upon opening my Cortese, Nick discovered a few issues which if addressed, could potentially improve the transparency, decrease hum, minimize sensitivity to microphonics, etc.

I considered asking Nick to spend the time required to package a list of improvements - but wanted to find out if there is enough interest among Supratek owners first - so would you let me know? Thanks!

Fiddler - Thanks for the information, I'd like to know a bit more about your solution. Was your amp making a mechanical hum, or did you hear buzz from the speakers? What isolation transformer do you use?

Do you connect the system like:

A. AC Offset Killer --> Transformer --> Supratek
B. Transformer --> AC Offset Killer --> Supratek

Supratek modifications - update on this idea. Since I posed the question to the group, I've received numerous replies & have also considered the concept further.

I am not certain if it such a great idea & here is why:

Supratek's come with a life-time warranty which would most likely become void should there be any modifications performed. Prior to doing anything to a Supratek, you should contact Mick to get his thoughts on what you plan to do.

In my conversation with the audio engineer, he stated there are many reasons why Mick did what he did in order to accomplish what he has. He suggested that he would not be able to "give us back" the results he would want to give because there would be too much design work required to improve on what Mick has already accomplished. He suggested the best upgrade or modification "circuit wise" would be (if you love the preamp) to upgrade to a higher level model.

Swampwalker - did it buzz when you were using the Berning amp or is this new - since the Joule arrived?

So.. let me see if I have this right, the AMP is buzzing? not the speakers?

Ray - 3 days to the west coast.

I think this is the right URL TRON ELECTRONICS? Direct links to the PRODUCTS You'll need to scoll down the page.

Hi Tom - got your email. Glad you like the MJ 1.5 - I told you it was good!! Unfortunately, there aren't many of them that I know of. When I first "announced" that cord, only a few people purchased it. You might email Moray James at: morayj1@juno.com and ask him if he can make you one if the wire is still available. I know he sells the MJ PWR2.5's which were okay but not as good as the 1.5 on the Supratek.

Tell Moray you have a Supratek and he'll know exactly what you want - keep in mind, he is always working on new stuff so... maybe there is a 3.5 or something even better to try.

Mick & tube rolling: I totally understand his position... he is a manufacturer and it would be illogical to build a product which is optimized for rare tubes - plus, he cannot spend all his time answering email questions about what tube works & which do not, what tubes sound the best and which do not.

Admonishing tube rolling is the only logical answer.

Every system is different and so is every tube - this is perhaps one reason why everyone has their favorite tube combo.

Regardless of how Mick "tunes" a Supratek to sound, there will always be something (tube combination) which sounds better for each system. Unfortunately, there is a lot of cancellation & reinforcement which goes on in building an audio system - to create balance - a simple example would be a bright system being made better with warmer tubes. This is a necessary part of audio & regardless of what Mick says, or how he tunes a Supratek (and for which tubes) there will always be compensation required (or equalization) in order to truly optimize a system. Mick can only tune a preamp based on HIS system and room. Plain and simple, HIS listening environment is different than anyone else's.

Yes.. different tubes can change the operating parameters of the Supratek. In my experience, changing those parameters were a necessary part of getting the most out of the Supratek. If Mick spent time "tuning" my preamps, then obviously he didn't spend enough time on important tuning details like asking me how I liked my music to sound.. or asking about my other components, etc. As good as Mick is, his tuning can never be as good as mine - sorry Mick.

Since it is impossible for him to know all of us, and listen to all our systems, Mick must make assumptions in his tuning. Those assumptions will most likely not work for the vast majority of us.

One of the greatest strengths of the Supratek is the fact that it can be tweaked so easily with tube rolling.

Musicbead - the Manley is quieter than the Supratek. Less hum and less electronic noise. The Manley sounds good at low volume but tends to become harsh when the volume is turned up. The Supratek sounds good at any volume. I suspect the Manley 7044 tubes (used in the buffer stage) to be the big problem with that preamp and to cause most of the aggressive sound. I changed these tubes but could not find any which sounded better than the stock 7044. I did not try Bendix 6900 or Amperex 7119 which might have helped fix that problem. I found the Tung Sol Black Plate 5687 to darken the sound of the preamp too much.. however, others on this site have found that tube to be an improvement.

Telefunken CCa's are almost always the way to go in 6922 applications. They improve the Manley considerably.

The Phono is good on the Manley but not exactly better than the Supratek - they are different. The often mentioned "flexibility" of the Manley and all its switches is totally 100% over-rated and most of the knobs do nothing audible (very disappointing and very misleading) with typical cartridges. Of the five "adjustment" knobs, I found only one (the load setting) to make an audible difference.

The Manley will also make your woofers pump violently. It freaked me out and I began looking for rumble filters.

According to a local engineer who looked inside my Manley, there are a great many cheap parts used inside and the flimsy chassis acts like a spring inducing resonance.

That said, the Manley is actually one of the better sounding preamps available. A good value because it sounds okay in stock form (at low volumes) but could potentially be improved with some modification (replace parts inside), find better sounding buffer tubes, add a standoff in the center of the chassis which supports the top cover & keeps it from vibrating, add the DACT attenuator with remote.

Is the Manley better than a Supratek? Well... that depends on what you're looking for. To me, the Manley improved the overall listenability of the system (at low volumes) because there was less electronic noise. Electronic noise was a huge factor to me. I have dimmer switches in my home which caused the Supratek to oscillate.

One thing is for sure, you have to spend A LOT of money to do better than the Supratek given all its features, flexibility, and shocking good looks.

Steve - I agree, good speaker are very important... Unfortunately they but are a real pain in the rear to buy & sell - so auditioning esoteric speakers in our homes, with our systems is very difficult compared to auditioning other components.

I've used Wilson Benesch speakers for a number of years and I've been quite happy with them. But! I am on my way to becoming a first time father so....I sold them and will be trying to build a system which is very low power with high efficiency single point speakers - in an effort to get great sound at lower volumes. The Single Ended / Single Point world is new to me and I'm still trying to determine what speakers to buy.. but they must work well with a 45 SET amp.

Stevem1960 - while I appreciate your comments about the importance of speakers, I must comment that most people on this site (& Supratek owners in general) already have great speakers and are sophisticated enough to understand their importance.

While there is some merit to your suggestion, please note that simply dropping in a new (Stevem1960 approved) pair of speakers will not "solve" anything. In MY humble opinion, adding new speakers (or any new/different component for that matter) to a system will only reinforce the need for additional tuning.

There are many factors which come into play when building a system. Trying to create a synergy between components, cables, speakers, room and living situation (limited space-too much space, etc.) can be difficult.

This is why tube rolling is a very effective means of obtaining a more desirable sonic signature. It is much easier to buy & audition various tubes than it is to do the same with speakers.

Of course, cables make a significant change too... but even the most rare & expensive tubes are bargain priced compared to some of the cable offerings.

Baranyi - nice to hear from you. I hope all is well. In my opinion, there IS an improvement when going up the Supratek line however it is not as significant as I had expected. The Supratek products I've used tend to have a very similar family sound and therefore the gains are mostly in refinement.

In my experience, the Cortese (for example) is ABSOLUTELY NOT microphonic, has a lower noise floor and a certain precision which the Syrah lacked. I think the bass was slightly better and the phono somewhat quieter.

Curriemt - Microphonics are relative. If you have microphonic tubes there is no helping the situation other than to replace the tubes. I'd suspect that was the problem with your Cortese. The Cortese is solid.

But...

Because of it's point to point, solid core wiring and relatively thin chassis, I could see how the Cortese might be considered more microphonic because those elements can exacerbate microphonic tubes when compared to something with a PC board like your Janus - or others.

Without getting too in-depth - I might say, the Janus, Rhea and Calypso have their own set of issues to keep owners and dealers quite busy. So much so that my dealer stopped carrying them.

Hi Baranyi - I am no longer using a Supratek - I had the Aesthetix IO Sig before the Supratek. I've tried many preamps lately and to be honest, you've got to spend a lot of money to do better. You guys should be very happy with these & feel no need to change.

That said, I do have gripes about the Supratek's and if those could be fixed, the units would be truly world class. I presume some of the mods that have been written about lately would resolve some of those gripes.

Curriemt11 - what were the problems you experienced that lead you to believe the Cortese was microphonic? Can you describe them, when they occurred, what they sounded like, etc?

Curriemt, looks like what you experienced is accurately described as a microphonic Cortese. Not sure what vintage yours was but mine was built in late 2002. It was rock solid. Even heavy thumps on the chassis wouldn't cause any problems.. and that's saying something considering I was using tubes from 1940.

My previous Suprateks (Chardonnay/Syrah) had issues caused by just lightly touching the chassis. It made piano sounding noises.

FYI - You are correct, the Janus problems have been fixed - I believe current models have fewer tubes in the circuit and unfortunately don't sound quite as good as the older unreliable Janus.

Steve, come on... please! The Supratek's are NOT "high resolution" preamps capable of reproducing low level detail beyond what (almost) any decent (non-metalic or ceramic) speaker is capable of.

Personally, metallic and ceramic drivers are not my cup of tea. I cannot listen to them because they introduce a non-natural hardness to the music - I guess that can be perceived as "inner detail". If we assume that these types of transducers "bring out the detail" of the Supratek, I would have to disagree and suggest that they create an illusion of air and inner-detail because of their ringing, metallic composition.

Also remember there is a pair of interconnects, an amplifier and a pair of speaker cables between the Supratek and the speakers.

In order to really hear what a Supratek does you have to remove it from your system.

Get a record that starts off slow & quiet. Use Bolero or something like that.. then run your source directly to your amp and then tell me what you hear.... I am sure that will end the discussion about the Supratek's inner detail.

You may end up sending your preamp back to Mick.

Curriemt, sorry about your Cortese. There is not much I can do to help. From my experience, the Cortese is a much more solid unit and exhibits zero microphonics.

I respect Aesthetix. The IO Sig was my favorite phono stage of all I've owned. If you want my comments about the Janus please email me directly instead of in this forum.

I have read comments before about the "hanging tube" found in Merlot monoblocks. I suspect the photos are of a Supratek developed and factory executed design.

If you look inside a new Supratek preamp, it is much cleaner looking because there is less going on inside the small chassis - but still it is not clean enough.

A few posts above, I commented that Suprateks would be better with some "minor" changes. This is exactly the kind of thing that I was referring to and why I chuckled when it was suggested that better speakers will allow us to hear more of the Supratek.

Hi Steve, Okay... please don't take what I wrote as being down on Supratek per se'. A few posts above, I wrote to Baranyi that one must spend A LOT of money to do better than the Supratek.

I did not state that the Supratek wasn't "high-end". I asked for you to by-pass the Supratek and run your source direct to the amp. That is the only way you will ever know what the Supratek REALLY does to the music.... and until you have tried it, everything you say about it is absolutely meaningless. Sorry. There is no other way to really understand what is going on until you elimiate what it does.

Running direct to the amp means NO ATTENUATION. Use Bolero by Ravel to do the test because it starts off very quiet and gradually becomes louder. You can stop the track before it gets too loud.

I used an Aesthetix IO Signature phono preamp set to 50db running direct to my amp. I imagine this test will work with any source... But... CD's always seem to sound more musical through a Supratek regardless. I guess the colorations really help that format. The real test is pure analog running direct. That will show you the truth.

Having heard what the Supratek did to the music, I immediately went to a passive design and it was terrible! Killed dynamics, clipped harmonics, and just destroyed the sound. Replacing the passive with the Cortese made things much better but... I could still hear the colorations of the Supratek.

I have since tried this with many preamps and they all diminish the source signal consierably.

Yes.. I agree 100% the Supratek brings a lively & emotional feeling to the music via coloration - but to me it does lack transparency. To justify that statement, let me just say I know a few Supratek owners who have changed the stock attenuators to DACT attenuators and report greater transparency.

I guess what set me off is the suggestion that better speakers would allow us to hear more of the Supratek's inner detail because I wanted to hear less of the Supratek' effects (both positive and negative) and more of the music.

Even though I love the Supratek, I have gripes with the design and implementation. Maybe I HAVE grown frustrated.

I know the Supratek is good but I think it can be better with a few somewhat minor changes.