It's Magic, It's Magic, It's Magic!!!
I agree with LLanger whole heartedly. I think interconnects in general reach a rediculous level of diminishing returns very quickly. I think after you get past the first level of interconnect and speaker cable upgrades, you will get a much bigger bang for the buck upgrading your equipement. If you are paying $1500 for interconnects, I contend you could pay $150 for a set, and spend the other $1350 upgrading your pre-amp, or one of your sources and make a much bigger improvement in sound.
I have gone down that road several times, and come to that conclusion with speaker cables, and interconnects.
But power cords, that's just MAGIC. Yes you can improve on the ones the manufacturers give you, easily. Get a shielded one, made with excellent condutors and a hospital grade connector (Signal Cable, some PS Audio's come to mind). But come on, if you have a $5000 amp, and you spend $1500 on a power cable??? Don't you think you could spend that $1500 on a better amp and upgrade the sound more? That is if the cable makes a difference at all. I contend IT DOES not, past a certain level.
Buy better upstream gear with your money, or better speakers. |
Danny, it's good to admit it when you have a problem, now sell those cables and use the money to upgrade some other equipment that gives you real improvment.
Ahh, it feels good to help. |
Russe41, a voice of reason in a storm of superstition (or justifying a ridiculous purchase). |
Lissnr, I've done that test. I have bought several very expensive power cords to try with my amps, preamp and soucrces, and there was no apprciable improvement over the first level of cords I had bought. None at all. So about $2000 worth of cables replacing my modest cables, and no improvement at all.
I put the Signal Cable cords back into play, sold the other power cords and I was very happy. Were the signal cables an improvment over the stock cords? Yes they were, but after getting a dedicated line put in, with a PS Audio Soloist wall socket, PS Audio Duet conditioner for my amps, and an APC S15 for all the other gear, my power situation is great. All I needed was a conduit to get to those nicely designed circuits.
I once again contend that I have never heard any super high end power cord that made much if any difference over the first level of after market cords. Clean the power first, as everyone does, then get it to the very nicely designed circuits.
Avoid the MAGIC cords. |
I've had my whole house rewired with pure 10 awg copper, but the power from the grid just doesn't do it for me, so I've gone green and added a wind mill and enough Solar Cells to generate my own, clean, green power. But since it rains a lot in Houston, and every once in a while the winds from the Gulf stop I also installed an GE LM6000 gas turbine generator. It's a bit loud, and uses a lot natural gas, but I get to sell my excess generation (close to 100 MW/h) to the grid for a nice tidy profit.
Although it's hard to hear the music over the roar of the turbine, and my neighbors are a bit annoyed, I think I finally have solved my power problem. |
HiFiTime that great, and the best part is that between the 110 MW/h turbine genarator, and the new blast deflection soundproofing you have so kindly suggested, I'm probably only going to be in about $22 million. That's still less than a lot of the Hogwarts graduates here pay for their power cables on their $20,000 worth of gear. |
Shellie, I think you are missing the point of TP's post. Read up the string, it's sarcasism, lampooning those who try to justify buying ridiculously priced cables that go from an expensive power conditioner to a beautifully designed circuit, and say it effects the sound. |
It's your money, and you can certainly spend it on whatever you wish.
The contention of a large percentage of the respondents on this string is that if the power is conditioned prior to going to the amplifier or other main transformer circuit, as long as there is an ample flow of electrons, no power cord is going to effect the sound. Therefore, you are better spending the extra money on better source/preamp/amplification than a "Magic" power cord.
This is one subject that gets a lot of people on here worked up, because exotic power cords more than anything else are percieved to have a placebo effect. In other words, the science says it's a bunch of BS. There is no signal being transmitted over a power cord so how could it effect the sound? As long as there is continuous and sufficient flow of electrons to the gear, there should be no effect. The power supply of the gear is what can effect the sound.
That said, I think most on here would not dispute that you can get improvement in sound with an aftermarket power cord that has better contact, a large wire, and shielding, but that after the first level of upgrade (Signal Cable for sake of arguement) there is no appreciable improvment. |
Your right, it's Magic. They build most of those cables at Hogwarts. |
Shellie, it's funny you bring up a power plant, you see I'm not exactly ignorant of how those work seeing as how I have developed, in a group, greater than 15 power plants over the last 10yrs. That's about 7000 MW of power. That has given me access to a lot of brilliant electrical engineers, and they would tell you that your proximity to the plant would make no differnce since you would need a step down transformer anyway, so that doesn't make any sense.
I no longer work for the company that built them, and I am not an electrical engineer, but I have worked on the design, construction, of all aspects at this point, and I love to bring strings like this to the attention of my buddies who are transmission and power circuit design engineers, it gives them a tremendous amount of pleasure. Your latest post I am sure will be memorialized by them.
Once your power goes from the wall or the power conditioner, as long as the correct volume of electrons, flow into the transformer of the amp/preamp/source then the transformer powers up the remainder of the circuit, tell me again how the power cord affected that? If it is getting the power, enough power to the ciruit the transformer then takes over the power duties. The power transformer can and does affect sound, and the better the gear, usually the better the transformer and the rest of circuit. So if you think your super expensive cord sounds better than a moderate one, good for you. IT'S MAGIC. Did you buy it on Diagon Alley (semi-obscure Harry Potter reference).
Please, could we get a comment from a real electrical engineer here?
Also, I have done this listening test with some very expensive cables, and never heard any difference at all, and power amps used are MASSIVE power hogs, so that should have made a difference.
I usually respect other peoples opinion, unless you are screaming an opinion that makes no sense.
Tell yourself it's better, if it makes you feel better. Hey, I have some land I'd like you to look at too, really great price just for you |
Also Shellie, from looking at your other posts, I wonder if you actually work for or represent some cable company, because that is almost exclusively what you discuss. Always the same mantra "buy expensive cables". So, do you work a purveyor or build expensive cables? |
We could put in a GE LM6000, the heat rate is not as good as a 7fe, but smaller footprint. If we do it in Texas or California there is an excellent secondary market for exces power. I'll get a buddy to work up the plans. At about $22 million it won't cost much more than Shellie's power cords. |
Shellie and Knownothing (once again, very Plato-esque), you may now only refer to me as your Copernicus.
Neither of you are members of the inquisition are you?
Or since you obviously are practicioners of Magic, with your Magic Electric cords, are you by chance minions of the Dark Lord, "He Who Cannot be Named"? Oh what the heck, are your Magic cords some dark magic from Lord Voldemort? |
You won't believe what just happened! The passionate (panicked) defense of hugely expensive power cord purchases swayed me and I went out and bought the most expensive cord my dealer had, thanks for opening for a Monday emergency Viet, and you guys were right.
I plugged the cord into one of my amps (sorry couldn't afford the $5k more for the second one) and when I turned on the system it started to GLOW, and then when I set the arm down onto Police's "Ghost in the Machine" (irony), the whole room began to shake, and the very air seemed to pulsate. Suddenly there was a great flash, and I was knocked out. But through my semi-conscious state I could here the strains of "Spirits in the Material World" beginning as I have never heard them before. My God, you are right, what a difference.
But my God, as I came to I realize that the sound is so great because my system is now gone and The Police themselves have materialized in my living room. Shellie you were right about my ears, I just needed to once again do a listening test with an open mind.
I can't wait to see what happens when I put on The Beatles or Jimmy Hendrix. I'm going to get the camera out for that. |
TP, Really, reallly, Really????? Then why did I just spend the last half hour at Whole Foods buying organic everything for a Vegan meal?
Thanks God Stuart was raised in Lebanon, he wants some bloody lamb chops (got those at Whole Foods too)!! |
Ozzy, that sounds pretty personal. Don't worry, everyone is impressed by your purchases, and I'm sure you are right that your power cords are changing music. You are a genuis and a great man, and I am humbled and shamed by your criticism, I believe my life is changed. |
Sorry, I haven't joined in this for a while, I was "trolling" other places. Well, really Shellie made me cry and stay in bed the last week :( |
