Perlisten D212 Subs (2) in the house.

Skinzy, I tend to think subs without a highpass are not worth the time as it never sounds quite right. Wilson audio makes a pretty good sub controller for around $5k that would allow for the integration. Might not be worth it to you though if you are moving away from the subs.
 

jab_kib_sz

i am curious if you have tried a higher crossover point. I found 60hz to be where most of these subs come into their sweet spot. Where they slam without sounding like “subs”. I currently use 2 JL E112 and have pretty munched highpassed them all at 60hz. My speakers (JBL 4367) also go down to the mid 30s and a 40-45hz crossover is fine but nothing special. At 60hz the system has noticeably more dynamic low bass. Once I get to 80hz crossover I feel like my system loses some bass texture. 
 

with your speakers so close to the wall they probably do kick pretty hard down low. When I had my Revel 228be (similar size to the Sopra) I had them 5’ off the wall the a high crossover of 60hz was needed to get a flat response in room. 

Ja_kub_sz,

Your system looks nice. Sorry to hear about your sub issues. JL’s electronics in their E-subs are pretty much trash. I have had both mine fixed twice so I am effectively on my 5th and 6th sub from them. They fixed them under warranty and then once out of warranty it was $500 for a full rebuild. They changed out everything (including the driver) in my original box. If you ever want to fix the JL there is a repair program.

The internal highpass on the E112 works well but adds a lot of hiss to the system (my speakers are 93db eff) and I need to get an external crossover sooner than later.

I like reading about the sub comparisons so please update the thread when you make a decision. I plan to switch out my JLs. I am leaning toward JTR RS1 or the JBLs SUB18s that match my speakers (pricey and don’t go that low). I have read a direct comparison of the RS1 to the E112 where the RS1 was more textured for music. They are huge and ugly but I am setup as a combo music/theater room so looks matter less. I have also considered the Perlistens but the price gives me a moment of pause, so they need to be really good at their asking price.

Music tastes might play a part in crossover point. I have also played with my crossover point for years and I can mirror your opinion. The 4367 has great textured bass but lacks the power under 40hz for that dynamic thump. At 40hz crossover for me I a near perfect blend but moving up to 60hz I gain a ton of dynamics and slam for modern music. I might lose a touch of texture at 60hz but it could be debated. Above 60hz the sub can be clearly heard with its damped bass. If you listen mostly to “audiophile” music I could see enjoying a 40hz crossover mor than 60hz  

Anyway good discussion, there seems to be very few people who buy and compare different subs for music. I for one think it matters a lot. Sadly high efficiency large driver subs might be a better choice for music than some of these very inefficient subs on the market.

Ja_kub_sz

thanks for the feed back. We are more or less on the exact same page.
 

The Sopra does looks awesome and sounds good too. The JBL 4367 is my ugliest speaker ever lol… but I think they will be keepers. 
 

Good to know the CR-1 is silent, I have read the manual and I am familiar with how it works. I will probably go that roughy in the spring when I switch out to a new subwoofer system. I have looked at digital systems but kind of like the old school knobs of the CR-1. I tire of diving into a computer everything I want to change something. The E112 hiss was not to bad on some of my old speakers but is crazy loud on the horns. Most people would hate it, I have learned to ignore it for now. 
 

the only other thing I do I don’t hear much about on here regarding subs, is I move my main speakers depending on the crossover frequency I choose. I find the crossover point and slop effects the room gain a good bit. Roughly placing the speakers at 1/4th the distance of the frequent wave length of the crossover seems to aid in the blending. Not sure that is easy to follow in writing but simple enough in practice with a frequent length chart and a measurement mic. The phase distance relationship is also at play. Subs are a pain but worth the effort to me. 
 

Anyway as you play with the Perlistens more let us know what you think of them. 

Ja_kub_sz

Nice looking setups for sure. I have never tried side placement of subs due to just having limited runs of wire. Maybe once I have the CR-1 I will move them around more as longer runs of balanced cables are more common than RCAs. 

Based on the measurements they look like very nice subs. I have window shopped them a few times but the price is hard to swallow.

Are you running your wilson full range then? Probably would be better high-passed. wilson make a pretty good sub controller that would allow you to highpass the speakers.  
 

Anyway I will be interested to hear more about them as you get used to them.