Ortofon Kontrapunkt C vs. Cadenza Bronze

Dear @dogberry  and friends: Due that a little trouble with Agon @jcarr  can't post this time and he sends to me this personal post to be shared in this thread:

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The Kontrapunkt and Cadenza seem fairly similar in overall design, which allows us in this specific case to ignore the influence of the myriad construction choices that typically affect how a cartridge sounds, including body material and construction, polepieces vs. magnet only, magnet material and design, armature size and shape, coil material, cantilever rake angle, cantilever length, etc..

When the major design choices are the same or very similar (as with the Kontrapunkt and Cadenza), the choice of cantilever material and design, but also the pairing with the dampers, will have a substantial effect on the sound.

Every cantilever (material, length, diameter etc.) has its own unique colorations, and will be best used together with dampers (which again have their unique colorations) that will accentuate the positives and minimize the negatives of the pairing. The choice of dampers will be guided by the experience and sensibilities of the cartridge builder, but also his goals for the cartridge model (does he intend for it to have a fun, energetic and physical sound, or give a contemplative insight into the music?)

This is why cartridge manufacturers keep quite a wide variety of dampers, with raw materials, additives, foamed vs. solid, diameter, thickness, flat vs. tapered all being deliberate variables.

If the cantilever is changed to a different material, my experience is that it should be paired with a different damper to bring out its best. If the diameter, or length are changed, up to a certain extent the same damper can be used, but too big of a change is again likely to benefit from different dampers.

While I agree that the stylus shape has comparatively less effect on the sound (than the cantilever-damper pairing), keep in mind that the diamond block carrying the stylus comes in different dimensions and may be intended to be affixed to the cantilever in a specific way, which will affect the sound (and stylus alignment).

Also, some stylus shapes are simply more demanding to set up than others, requiring more time, precision, and trial-and-error.

A stylus with a larger major radius (70µm, 80µm, 100µm etc.) and smaller minor radius (2.5µm, 5µm etc.) may give less satisfaction than a more forgiving stylus until the setup becomes optimal.

Also, how the stylus is affixed to the cantilever has a significant effect on the sound. The most extreme example is when the stylus and cantilever are made from a single diamond with no glue between the two (as seen on Sony's XL-88D from the 1980s, and more recently Audio-Technica's AT-MC2022, and DS Audio's Grand Master EX).

But even when the stylus and cantilever are the typical separate pieces bonded together, the choice of adhesive used between stylus & cantilever and cantilever & joint-pipe, can affect the sound quite noticeably, which can be a useful tool for the cartridge manufacturer to tailor the sound of a cartridge model.

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R.

Very interesting. The FG2 will be on the same cantilever (tapered aluminium) and mounted nude. The only difference I can find is that it has a larger measurement of 70µ instead of 80µ.

Thank you all for your input, I have sent the cartridge off to VAS. I will report back when it is here.

Thank you, Raul. Audiogon staff were able to sort out the technical issue, and I am able to post again.

I used to own the Kontrapunkt "c" and later owned 2 Cadenza Bronzes. I still have a Bronze. I share many of your feelings -- the Kontra seemed a bit more fun and satisfyingly musical somehow. The Bronze offers a slightly more restrained and "proper" audiophile sound. That said, their design is highly congruent (Bronze directly supersedes "c") and they still share 90%+ the same flavor of sound which you will not find in other cartridge models! This is due to sharing the same generator motor design and (IMO crucially) the tapered aluminum pipe cantilever.

What’s changed in Bronze is the Replicant vs. FG80 stylus, aluminum vs. plastic inner structure, and Acurum (gold plated copper) vs. pure silver coil wire (Kontra). I suppose there could be other minor changes that might not be documented. Hard to say what is most impactful of the listed changes, but I’d suspect the silver coil wire and plastic inner body might be more important players than the stylus?

Anyways, you can perhaps tilt the Bronze a little more into "fun" territory with phono stage matches. It’s an excellent cartridge in its own right, and remains one of my favorites. I’m listening to it on a high-end Stax setup right now! But certainly, I regret selling my Kontra "c" many years ago (it had a LOT of life left). Wish like anything I’d kept it. I still look out for one on the used market, occasionally.

In short, I would NOT seek out a retip on the Bronze to try and make it sound more like the Kontra "c". It’s kind of its own thing for a few reasons, and retipping that cantilever seems like it might degrade its integrity.

I also owned Kontra "a", a very nice little cart in its own right but man the "c" was way better. Cadenza Red is its successor, and I’d say in that case the Red is a clear improvement. That said, I think the Kontra "a" started out listing for $600 or $700, and wow that would be a stellar option if available today!

In short, I would NOT seek out a retip on the Bronze to try and make it sound more like the Kontra "c". It’s kind of its own thing for a few reasons, and retipping that cantilever seems like it might degrade its integrity.

Nor would I. It is the Kontrapunkt C that is going to get a new stylus!