Original vs. imitation ; MC275 vs. Cayin A88T


First off, I can see how this might cause some controversy, and that is not my intention. I wish to learn, separate fact from fiction, and hopefully gain some objective insights. To a fault, I'm a natural skeptic, I test everything. Almost exhaustively. Frankly I find myself having to verify too much, so this is my first post in hoping knowledgeable posters might shed some light. Ok here goes. Please no flames.

I have been very happy with the Cayin integrated, (as a pure amp) it is wonderful. It is detailed, tuby, and airy. Cymbals resonate like they should, no glare, highs aren't rolled off, and bass is respectable. Drums have authority. The imaging and soundstage are very believable. On good material, I am transported into the front row. Simply magical. However after going to some live events, I noticed live music, at least the amplified kind, was more of a wall of sound ( Jazz, orchestra, soft rock) rather than the distinct detailed space we audiophiles crave and adore. That didn't bother me much since I was not comparing a live presentation to it's recording and thereafter recreation. I was comparing apples to oranges, but nevertheless, it got me thinking... did the real Mac sound more life like? I wanted a little more power too, for when the mood stuck me. The Cayin at 45w/ch was loud enough for normal listening, but I wanted a little more emotion for those special times. As happy as I was, I wanted the real McCoy and see what I was missing. The reissue MC275 was said to push closer to 90w/ch. The amp is a legendary, and not is a small way. It stood the test of time for 45yrs, and still going strong. I had to try it for myself. I ended up purchasing a "mint" used MAC. My first.

My MC275 series V, is beautiful, and arrived without a scratch, 10/10. The very reputable dealer said it was retubed from the factory and factory sealed. It was. I prepared myself for a treat :) Initially, my first impression was that the Mac had a more expansive feel...a wider stage, but at a cost of some smearing. What was that? Smearing? Could it be? Yes... OMG, it is! Not by much, but some. I lost that lovely detail! The air between instruments and vocals was not readily discernable as it had been with the Cayin. Could this be?! I interchanged the power tubes. Same thing. Blasphemy!! No way! Maybe the Mac needs Burning in, that must be it. After 15 hrs, I did not notice ANY change from my initial finding, I audition each repeatedly, interchanging amps, carefully double checking connections, tubes, etc... Indeed, I much preferred the sound of the Cayin! Although the Mac could play slightly louder (guessing 15-20 % louder?), it was marginal. Could that also account for the wider soundstage? I am astonished! I am hoping that the Mac will burn in and sound sweeter. But even if it did, I can't imagine it SURPASSING the Cayin. Or could it?

Does anyone know if rolling the non output tubes will give me back the detailed holographic feel? At this point, I am a little doubtful the Mac can close the gap. Right now the margin is distinct. Is it going to make a world of difference?
larry_yo
Thanks for the input. I will give the Mac a fighting chance. What's surprising is that swapping the power tubes between the two made no difference. The Cayin tubes (at least 1000 hrs and have lost a bit of lushness since 9 months ago ) didn't change the way the MAC sounded. Nor the Cayin tubes in the Mac.

The point is well taken about having adequate time for gear burn in. My Ming DA 2A3 pre took ~300 hrs before it lost it's glare and harshness. I got the pre after reading some reviews of it here and took the chance that it might improve the A88T. It made a big improvement. The Cayin is a MUCH better amp than an integrated. I'm quite happy with it other than I want more power. Any other amps I should try for ~5k?

So from my experience burn in takes the edge off, and the harshness mellows. But will it help with dimension and detail also? Will trannies and the non power tubes bloom? If so, after how long?

Buconero117,

My speakers are AZ Adagios, so we seem to have comparable rigs... I'm very interested in your take of your other amps. How does the bigger Cayin compare to the A88T? Does it lose any detail or is it just a bigger brother?

Have you heard any amp in your rig so far that equaled or rivaled the A88T?
McIntosh equipment is good, but it is not as good as the hype surrounding it would have you believe. In the late 60's and early 70's I knew a guy who worked at a stereo shop that sold McIntosh. They sold a lot of it based on the name and the hype. He owned Marantz equipment, even though he could buy the Mac equipment at a discount. I asked him why. He told me not to tell his customers, but the Marantz sounded better. I bring this up not to trash Mac because I have heard it and it is very good. The hype would have you believe there in nothing better. Not really true. I have a Cayin A88T and the clarity still amazes me.