One speaker observation from the New York Hifi show.


I was just at the New York Hifi show, and perhaps because of the size of the rooms, all speakers were toed in, and most were toed in severely. The result was very little effective imaging.  Most sound appeared to come from one central spot between the speakers.  I realize hotel rooms are not ideal, but even in the larger rooms, noticible toe ins were prevalent  I don’t believe this positioning shows systems off to their best advantage.  To me, speakers pointing straight ahead produces the best imaging.
rvpiano

Showing 3 responses by newbee

If you have positioned your speakers too near the wall behind them, as many folks seem to do (from the system photos I see) I believe your observations  are probably valid, certainly are to you. However, if you bring your speakers well out into the room I believe your observations would change. My speakers are set up close to the 'Cardas' recommendations.  My imaging is spot on in all dimensions and with 'extreme toe in' superior to firing straight ahead. My speakers are 6' out from the wall behind them which is consistent with the Cardas set up however they are closer to the side wall than recommended. It is this sidewall closeness that causes some deterioration in image specificity that is remedied by the toe in. FWIW, my room, my speakers, my ears.
My room is 13.5x19.5x9. My speakers are 6ft from the wall behind them and 2ft from the side walls. The listening chair is set up at the apex of an equilateral triangle.  
rvpiano, Not necessarily for your benefit, but FWIW as it does relate to others, re 'side to side' imaging, it is important when evaluating this to remember the 'stereo' construct does not provide for any 'in phase' stereo image to appear outside of the boundary of the speakers themselves, i.e. between the boxes (?) on the plane of the speakers. 

What does happen, which suggests to folks that sounds appearing on the outside of the speakers is inherent in the speakers/stereo signals is that these sounds are the result of 'out of phase' signals (reverse one set of speaker cables connections and watch the stage expand, become amorphous,  and loose center image altogether) on the disc or a speaker placement too close to a side wall. Such placement can not only enhance the sense of brightness which can be reduced by wall treatment or toe in the latter of which I believe is more effective. To not deal effectively with the close side wall reflections can definitely give a sense of increased stage width, but it can also increase the sense of brightness and, due to the too early merging of the direct signal from the speaker and the side wall reflection, reduce the resolution in the main soundfield.

Perhaps, just perhaps now, your friends system is properly set up and the reduced sense of stage width is as it should be.

IMHO, anyway.


rvpiano, Re GE, I find it not so strange (other than 8" does sound a bit close to me).  Bass is, to many, the reason that distance of placement of the speaker from the front  wall is important. That is a common problem we all share. But, the importance of depth of image is illusive for many simply because they have never heard it. You won't find it at Shows and rarely in dealer's showrooms. Aesthetics commonly prevent many folks from undertaking the job of developing depth of image so why should they try in the first place. They are pleased with what they have, more power to them. This hobby can drive you crazy.