One key to building great systems over time.

@mdalton

Thank you for your comments.

I really do not think we disagree. I am definitely not saying there is one path. I am pointing out that there is a path, that while still requiring lots of work, has a much higher probability of long term success. There is a real long term learning curve over time for listening and often values. You constantly don’t know what you don’t know yet.
 

Yes, exactly as you say, I am saying it is a safer path to take… I think that captures it. The path has lots of markers… it is not thrashing around the woods so much.

I have actually spent more money (early on), thinking I had found this wonderful component, only to find I didn’t when I learned more. Are there boutique components that hold up to the big guys in all respects… yes, but they are far between. Those are the budding new companies that will eventually become main stream.

1)After 50 years in audio, I’ve learned a few hard and valuable lessons. I started working in stereo shops in high school and became addicted. I have heard almost everything currently available at high end retailers and shows.

My best advice is as follows;

2) Listen to a $1000 system and then a 5K system and on up the ranks. If you’re not impressed, don’t invest. 
3)There is a point where a little improvement costs a great deal more.

4) If you don’t have a decent room, the best equipment will sound very limiting and disappointing.
5) Really good recordings will sound better on lesser equipment than average recordings do on the very best gear.

6) I have never found a dealer I fully trust. I have been burned  by them many more times than private party sales. I am referring specifically to after sales support as much as what they sell you.

7) Off brands, mods, and custom made one of a kinds are high risk.

8) Buying used or demo gear is great, but not usually cutting edge unless spending a great deal of money. Used loudspeakers are higher risk because of how they were run and handled previously.

9) Digital audio takes more money and time to get right than vinyl.

10) At some point, spending more just becomes an expression of addiction and ego.

11) Great cables, power supplies , RF,  and vibration control really do make a big difference.

12) Enjoy the hi end while you can because we are a dying breed. Portable audio is  taking over.

As an example, under point number 6.

There are only 2 high end dealers in my area of Jacksonville Florida. After returning here 15 years ago, I started doing business again with a shop that had the same owner since I was here in 1980. He sold this business about 5 years ago. The new owner sold me his design of music server. A $7,500 unit. After sales services were spotty and the software didn’t measure up. I then invested in other equipment that he felt I should have bought from him despite the fact that he didn’t have this equipment at the time , and I never auditioned it in his showroom. That’s when he stopped all communication with me. I was then forced to sell the server at a 50% loss. I couldn’t even trust him to provide support to whoever I sold it to so I traded it to a dealer. No names here but buyers beware.

I had my eyes on Magico, DeAugustino, T and A and Levinson,  but 15K in losses from 3 dealers has forced me to scale back.

@b_lee

Wow, I am really sorry to hear the experiences you have had with dealers. That is horrible.

Much of my interactions with dealers has been extended and great. One for ten years and two for twenty years. Each were generous with their time, absolutely honest (if they thought a component that they did not sell would be better… they would recommend going elsewhere), and collaborative.

When I go into a new store, I first find the owner / head honcho. I introduce myself, and my current system and long term strategy. Then I let him go. If he quizzes me, to better understand my values in sound… generally resulting in broad discussions on all things audio, this is good. From this discussion, I can assess his skill / experience level, his integrity, and emphasis on selling. Is this the kind of guy who knows all the different categories of sounds different people value, or only knows his own? Good folks take the challenge of understanding you and helping you achieve what you want. Most often my first trip is simply to establish a relationship… of see if it is possible. Sometimes, I know much more than he does. In that case, I can go in if I know what I want and I can ask him to hook up the components I want… I end up teaching him… that can be fun if he wants to learn.

Sometimes the result is that sales are the only important thing. This can be great, because the guy looses interest in you and you can just go into his best listening room and he goes back to his office. I have spent hours and hours with great systems like this.

I have found seldom has a trip been wasted. Even if it is clear I may never buy there, I get real experience. Then I have gotten a couple of long termed friends from this.