Hello rlwainright, You may want to read some archived threads about the Mr Clean ME if you haven't, to help understand what actually is being done, which I don't see as excessive.
What has been suggested, is that first, the Stylus is lightly brushed with a Stylus Brush to remove any light fuzz-loose dirt (total time takes to do this is about 5 seconds at most). Then just cue the Stylus onto a thin cube of the ME positioned on the Platter once, or twice (another 5 seconds) Then lastly again a very ight brushing to insure no dust loosened by the ME, or any micro-particles are left on the Stylus by the ME (another 5 seconds at most)
No Cleaners, Liquids, Alcohols, etc used in this quick 3 step process, and the reason why it is suggested to be done after every LP side, is that it doesn't take long for baked on crud to stick to a Stylus from heat, and once a substantial amount of deposit is stuck to the Cartridge, it becomes much harder to get off.
This method above pretty much insures you don't give those nasties much chance of accumilating. Many of these newer Cartridges, with thier ultra small Stylus' are said to play deeper-better in the groove-groovewall, extract more information with less groove surface noise, and the downside I understand, is they also get dirty faster as well.
As an aside, more, and more manufacturers it seems caution-warn against the use of wet cleaning, especially any which might contain alcohol, due to the possible use of hollow Boron Cantilevers, and the possibility of alcohols attacking the adhesive holding Stylus to Cantilever. To see how small these Stylus', and Cantilevers are, one can only imagine then what very tiny amount of adhesive bonds Stylus to Cantilever.
Lastly, the beauty of ME, and a Stylus brush is the cost. $2-$3 gives you a virtual lifetime supply of the ME. Hope this helps. Mark |
Sjungdahl, So what information of value was provided? Please go into detail, as I'd like hearing a logical explanation from you why this info provided seems to make total sense to you, and that you're sold on RW's thoeogy, that everybody else here is wrong, and he is right?
One thing that is very evident, neither of you have ever used a Magic Eraser, have you?
When you have, when you have conclusive results-findings, then do please come back, and give us the low down, cause I would be definitely interested to hear about them.
There's only one true way to learn, as others here have, experience. No, many didn't work at some Stereo Shop, cleaning, and examining Cartridges for others, they invested thier hard earned money, in some cases literal tens of thousands of dollars, and found out for themselves.
I suggest you find out for yourself as well, I did.
Nothing but ME, and a Stylus Brush will ever touch my Cartridges again.
There are good people here who are trying to educate-teach, but of course these people are all wrong, correct?
One has to come to thier own conclusions, and decide "What is Diamonds, and what is BS". |
Hello RW, Definitely no argument with what you've said, all makes sense, and I totally agree with the statement of "the more you toy with these delicate things, the more chance for disaster.
One has to get a mindset, that this is how it MUST be done, and to never deviate, ot to have to many glasses of your favorite elixer while doing so.
As I mentioned in my last post though, wet methods may be suitable for some newer Cartridges, but other manufactures caution, and refrain as I say.
A newer ZYX UNIverse, or Lyra Titan Cartridge is not a Shure V-15 of old. Believe when I say this, in that if a new Stylus-Cartridge is ruined due to incorrect cleaning methods-products, send it back to the manufacturer for repair-replacement, they they will more than likely recognize what caused the failue, and void said warrantee. They built em, and they know what messes them up, and how. Manufacturers get Cartridges back every day of the week for mistakes the end user has caused.
Linn used to suggest a matchbook striker to clean a Stylus. This might not in any way hurt a Diamond, the hardest substance known to man, but what might this material do to a Cantilever, or Stylus Adhesive?
To the other poster in regards with the Onzow Zerodust, and raising the product to the Stylus. Here is where one can make an easy mistake. The actual pressure you may be applying may be many times higher than your VTF weight. By dunking you might be applying 2g, by manually raising the product to Stylus, you may be applying 10-15 grams and overflex the Cantilever, and suspension? Hard to say, when a person doesn't actually have a VTF scale built in to thier fingertips?
One could make a little base out of a piece of wood?, that the Zerodust can be set on to be a Platter height. Set on base of turntable, and dunk to your heart's content?
I do hope you folks see my posts as trying to be helpful, not snobbish, as heck, I don't profess to be any expert, but have taken good common sense advice from others here in this forum. Mark |
RW, That's fine, do use what you like, but you came in in as a self proclaimed expert, that your way was law, and other's methods hold no merit. This is your loss, nobody else's.
Why, or how can you assume what another person does?
What you sold, or looked at may have very well been 25-30 years ago? Hell, 30 years ago, I was cleaning my Shure V-15 with Denatured Alcohol, and thought I was doing the right thing. You tell me?
Don't assume that the "leg work" hasn't been done with the Magic Eraser, it has. While it hasn't been made for the specific purpose as you state, perhaps only because Proctor & Gamble marketed it first, would infringement, and also that some very savvy end users found it here first, doesn't mean it is in any way unacceptable to use. Other's can provide links to electron Microscope scans if you wish to talk microscopes?
I think you're assuming that you're partaking in a forum with mid fi end users. Quite the contrary.
Many of these folks buy, and use multi-$1,000 Cartridges like I change socks. Think they would take a chance ruining, or compromising the sound they have to offer?
I know the answer.
The ME does work, and works admirably. Take a $2 chance, and try it before making any more assumptions these users are willy nilly. Perhaps your pride is too hard to swallow? Keep an open mind, I try to. I always try to remember there's always somebody smarter than I out there as well. Mark |
Sjungdahl, I'm trying to be as civil as possible, and asked you some sensible questions. There were no answers, meaning you refuse to answer. Who's then uncivil?
This is not unlike the Cleaning Fluid Posts, in that everybody seems to have the right answer, the right formula, and of course thiers exceeds all others, and those who shell out respectable money for good trusted cleaners are stupid gullible fools, who let themselves be suckered by snake oil salesmen, correct?
Yet, there are some who would believe that we are trying to "snake oil sucker" people here to buy a $2 Box of Mr Clean? And that these many users "dream" this product works most effectively? Then you must then believe everybody here, and other too numerous to count believers of the ME must then have brass ears, or are just plain stupid?
I fully understand this camp's train of thought/mindset, that many in this camp are unswerving in thier beliefs, and regardless if folks like J, Carr of Lyra and the many other "true-real" experts came in here, told you "no, don't use any liquids, then what would one do"? Again disbelieve this person, and say, "oh, what the heck does he know"? Of course! lol That's how some people really do think, don't doubt it for a second.
Within the last 10-20 years, Cartridges have made considerable advances. As well, they have also become considerably more delicate, and easy to damage.
One wouldn't take a Lyra Skala, a ZYX UNIverse, Dyna XV-1. Koetsu, Miyabi, throw it on a Technics 1200, and start doing the Herbie Hancock "Rock-It" tune. They wouldn't last 30 seconds.
As I close, the best "civil" advice I can give to you, RW, and all others wishing to further investigate, is to invest some time here, and there, read some of the archive posts on liquid cleaners, in the various forums, read about Mr Clean ME, Stylus Damage, etc, read what manufacturers of modern Cartridges suggest.
I am sorry if it has appeared that I'm somehow talking down to you, or any other poster in this thread. I don't profess to be a rocket scientist, or any smarter than the regular average guy. Yet I use the product, and will continue using the ME, as I personally feel this is the best choice I can make, regardless of cost.
After shelling out considerable money for two new Cartridges in the past four months, a Benz Ruby 3, and a ZYX Airy 3X SB, would you think I actually care about the relative "minute" cost of a bottle of Stylus Cleaner? Mark
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Perhaps we should ditch what has been written above, and wipe the slate clean, ok? If I've hurt anyone's feelings here, I truly do apologize.
Now let's start again, please.
This thread was about how to clean the Stylus, so I won't wander off on a different tangent. Some have asked, and I'll share what I know, and keep this info in layman's terms.
There are many good liquid Stylus Cleaners on the market, that usually do the required job, and are generally not thought to hurt most Stylus', Cantilevers, or Suspensions. LAST, Lyra, RRL, and perhaps the Discwasher as well. There's probably a couple I missed, sorry for this.
Those that do use the Mr Clean Eraser, I wouldn't exactly say have grimy records, and it is not just dirt-groove contaminants that cake up-contaminate a Stylus. RW is by no means dumb, and should know this quite well. The largest proponent-discoverer of the ME, is Doug Deacon. Doug uses a Loricraft RCM, uses state of the art analog front ends, and I assure you, as others will here, Doug is one of the most knowledgeable, and seasoned contributors in this group.
There are many others as well, and I thank them all for thier contibutions. It's one reason I visit this group on a daily basis, I'm always learning something new here. This group is da bomb!
Some Cartridge Manufacturers do strongly advise not to use liquid cleaners. On many Cartridges of today, gone are Metal Cantilevers of some sort, being replaced largely by Synthetic Materials. Also, many use Hollow Tube Cantilevers, and liquids can travel by capillary action, very possibly damaging components in the process.
Used properly, the ME is very good, regardless that it's use wasn't originally intended for Stylus Cleaning. In truth, somebody had thier thinking cap on when they discovered this wonderful, and cheap product.
Again, all I can say, is it boils down to a matter of personal choice. If there are those who choose not try try it for whatever reasons, that's fine, you haven't committed any crime. ;-) But as others have discovered, it works well, it is fast, it is easy to use, it is easily gotten, and does maintain a Stylus in pristine condition without worry of possibility of damage to Stylus Adhesive, or Suspension components.
I hope this post reflects better civility, and again, I only wished to help those here find an alternative choice. Mark
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