My impressions of the much Hyped LAIV Harmony DAC (I ordered one and Listened to it.)

Agree with listening to Hans before buying.  He preferred the Holo Audio Cyan 2 DAC.  So do I.  It’s difficult to buy off of recommendations.  So many positive reviews and a few negative reviews with most equipment.  You paid a high price for an unsuccessful trial.  A few direct to consumer brands offer free returns but fewer and fewer especially at the high end of the price range.  

Thank you for the heads-up OP

I tend to agree that most of this new Chi-Fi newcomers have some agenda that turns the table to them for financial gains. I feel for you. $320 for returns is a lot of $$$ for a $2600 product. Currently i am using Denafrips which I got from Alvin Chee when he was still doing Denafrips. I guess lucked out then. Still, that is not a good process for a return policy. 

on the technical side, did you do a long enough break in process? I can tell you the Denafrips took me nearly a month before I heard a change. So, I am on the fence as to my opinion if you just needed more time for break in so you can hear the difference it would make, or you just simply did not care and just wanted to return it. nevertheless, Thank you for the heads up. I was also planning to give this DAC a try but after you wrote about your experience, then Laiv losses one potential customer.

I read your post with interest, and it sounds like you were very disappointed. I’m really sorry to hear that you had that experience.

I had a couple of random thoughts and comments based on what other people have been saying, and in response to your post.

I think of Chi-Fi as referring to Chinese-based companies that manufacture components that are sometimes much less expensive than those manufactured in Europe or North America (and sometimes of dubious quality). I do not think of companies that are based in other countries, but which manufacture components or the entire product in China, to high or exacting standards, as "Chi Fi". Examples of such companies could include Audioquest or Mark Levinson, but there are many more.

Laiv products are manufactured in China but the company is not a “Chinese company” – it is based in Singapore. I do think that their products are of a very high manufacturing quality.

Some folks have mentioned Alvin Chee, asking him to speak up, but it is worth pointing out that the OP did not appear to order through Vinshine Audio, Mr. Chee’s company, which is also located in Singapore. The OP bought the components directly from Laiv online, it appears.

Your own (OP) description of their return policy includes everything for which you were charged including, in bold font, the “additional deduction of 4.5% of the order amount”. That cost is not at all hidden, indeed, it was emphasized. Given your plan to audition the DAC, and to have an opportunity to return it, I would have thought that you would have paid even more attention to that particular detail. But it is in no way a “hidden” fee.

I bought my own Laiv DAC intending to keep it. However, if disappointed, I imagined that I would be able to resell it online, probably at 70% or more of the new cost, if I didn’t like it. I also knew that 70% would be of the retail price and not the real cost to me after shipping, card fees, import duties, etc. As a "hot" (or hyped) item, I figured it would sell easily if I wanted.

I think that your assumption about them creating a business model to profit off of disappointed people who return items for a “refund” (wherein they make money from doing that) is completely incorrect. First, they will lose money due to the lack of a market for used items (although their website refers to “industry discounts, B-stock products, or other special arrangements” for items that one is not permitted to return – so there must be some way to purchase returned stock items for a discount). I do not know their numbers of DACs sold globally, but I could only find 50+ used Laiv Harmony DACs sold through HiFiShark, in total (and they appear to sell very fast). Moreover, some of those are not sold, but are marked as “off”.

So, these DAC's are hardly being "dumped on the secondary market". The return that you got was over 88% of the new price and that is better than the few sales I could see documented online.

You said “So, it dawns on me that this company is really planning on a lot of returns. This is part of their Business Plan!” Now I really hate this company and vow to never do business with them again. Yup, they have made me an Enemy for Life by sneakingly hiding their total restock fee.” You then claim that posting your negative impressions serve to all of us as a “Public Service Announcement”.

I feel bad that you had this experience. Like other posters here, I think it might have been better for you if you had burned it in, as Laiv recommended to me in an email, for 1-200 hours (I turned mine on and left it going for a week straight before serious listening). It might have felt like less of a mediocre product if you had done that, but the characterization of this company as one that you now “really hate”, because they charged you fees that were not in the least hidden, stands at odds with the experiences of the very many folks here who have had unfailingly professional, polite, cordial and helpful interactions with the company. I hope that those who are thanking you for the heads-up also read the responses by those of us who have actually purchased from them, posted in response to you.
Tim

@cutthroat 

As it happens, I made a similar mistake recently. I ordered a very well reviewed DAC. In my system, I found it disappointing. When it came time to return it, I called the company and was informed that, as they have a minimum audition period, they would not yet discuss a return. I went back to their website and discovered this was plainly indicated. I gave the DAC more time but it failed to win me over and eventually, the return was approved. 

What did I conclude from this experience? 

1) The DAC did not synergize well with my gear and/or was simply not in line with my particular subjective perceptions/preferences. 

2) That I’d been very careless when scanning the website and needed to be more careful in future. 

The fact that a particular piece of gear does not wow you is not "evidence" that it has been misrepresented. 

If a company clearly states a policy and you fail to notice it, it is not the fault of the company.