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My impressions of the much Hyped LAIV Harmony DAC (I ordered one and Listened to it.)

My System:


Speakers: Oris Orphean Horns with Klipschorn Bass Bins

Amps: Bi-Amped Korneff SET 45 Monoblock Clones on the Oris Horns with Dual MiniDSP 500 watts on the Bass Bins

Pre-Amp – Don Sach Model 2 (4) 6SN7 Tubes

Dacs – SMSL D400EX Vs. LAIV Harmony each fed by USB Raspberry Pi running PiCorePlayer

Short Story – I returned it.

Long Story – It was the Process and details of the return that I learned the most about the company. The past year there has been a lot of hype regarding the LAIV Dacs. ‘Best DAC under $5 Grand’ etc. etc. etc. So, I went to the LAIV website and looked over their Products. And I see this too ! They have

30 Day Returns !! --- So, yes I want to ‘Shop safe and Smart’ also.

Shop safe and smart with LAIV.

I was interested enough that I went to their return policy page to find what a ‘home audition’ would cost me. After all the Harmony was going to cost me $2675 (I got a $25 discount by joining their ‘club’) , so it better be special and not something that I had to ‘strain’ to hear a difference between my existing SMSL D400ex (a measly $1 Grand Dac). The below is from their web page regarding refunds.

 

Refunds

 

Upon arrival at our approved destination, your product will undergo a thorough inspection to ensure it remains in pristine condition with all original materials intact. The process typically within 5 to 10 business days.

Upon completion of the inspection, and assuming all criteria are met, we will promptly notify you of the receipt of your product and initiate the refund process. Please allow 7 to 10 days for the refund to reflect in your account. Kindly note that a restocking fee listed below will be deducted from the refund amount.​

  1. Harmony DAC - $200/unit

  2. Harmony HP2A - $200/unit

  3. Harmony GaNM - $250/pair

  4. Harmony µDAC - $125/unit

  5. Harmony µDDC - $125/unit

  6. Harmony LExt - $100/unit 

Additionally, All orders will be subject to an additional deduction of 4.5% of the order amount from the refund due to non-refundable payment platform fees.In the event that the return items do not meet our standards of mint condition, we will provide notification and advice regarding any open box fees, in addition to restocking fees, incurred due to damages.​Furthermore, if you have incurred import taxes on your delivered products, the responsibility lies with you to claim a refund from the respective carrier (e.g., DHL, FedEx, UPS, etc.).We're committed to ensuring you're happy with your purchase. If you have any questions or concerns, please check out our terms and conditions or reach out to us. We're here to help!

 

So, I briefly scanned the page and saw that the Harmony Dac had a $200 restocking fee. So, that was

definitely at my upper limit of an audition. And $200 was on the high side, in my opinion. But I wanted the Dac and wanted to believe the hype, so I was hoping that I would think that the Dac was worth $2,675 to me, and I would not have to return it.

So, in listening to the LAIV for a few days, I could not discern a difference between my Cheapie $1 Grand SMSL D400ex and the LAIV Harmony. (So, yes, the Emperor has no clothes). I had both DACs plugged into my Preamp and had two Identical Streamers plugged into each Dac, playing in Sync the exact same Music. So, it was very easy to switch back and forth between Dacs and discern any differences. So I started the ‘return process’.

I contacted LAIV and receive the following response:

***********************************************************************************

“Please find the attached repacking and return guide and go through the guide to prepare the return units.

Just a friendly reminder to provide the following information as outlined in the guide!
1. A photo of the device showing the serial number clearly.
2. A photo of the device showing the top view and bottom view of the device.
3. A photo of the device box after packed.
4. A photo of the device box inside the shipping box.
5. A photo of the shipping box after seal up.
6. A photo of the complete package with the outer shipping box showing the serial number.

If all items are in mint condition, the expected total refund will be as follows:

$2,675 - $200 (Restocking fees) - $120 (4.5% Payment Platform fees) = $2,355

***********************************************************************************

So, oh F*ck, I missed the ‘extra’ $120 for god knows what reason! So, now the audition would cost me $320 – which I would have passed on if it was included in the restock fee next to the Harmony Dac. No way would I pay $320 for an audition. Maybe that’s why it wasn’t there (camouflaged, I’d say, - make up your own mind). Anyway they got me on that one. If this was shopping smart, why do I feel so stupid?

 

--- Not a bad profit, I’d say. They got $320 of pure profit, and they got their Dac back in ‘Mint’ condition. Maybe the return business is better than actually selling Dacs?

 

Then I notice the seven photos I’ll have to take (Never had to do this one before) and then I open the attached ‘repacking and return guide’. It’s 17 Fricken Pages! So, this Repacking and Return guide is written better and more complete than any user manual that I’ve ever seen. So, it dawns on me that this company is really planning on a lot of returns. This is part of their Business Plan! Now I really hate this company and vow to never do business with them again. Yup, they have made me an Enemy for Life by sneakingly hiding their total restock fee.

 

This is a Public Service announcement. If you are interested in LAIV products, and considering an audition, keep in mind their ‘return procedures’ and don’t forget to add another 4.5% to the restocking fee. *************** You’re Welcome! – You can’t download the repacking and return manual and I could not attach it to this post, as it was too large. But if you want a copy e-mail or message me and I’ll send you a copy.

cutthroat

Showing 4 responses by lanx0003

lanx0003
1,241 posts
 

There are so many excellent reviews out there, and I believe you pulled the trigger because of the hype. I’m not sure how many hours of burn-in you’ve gone through, but every DAC—including the Harmony—needs at least 250 hours before you can truly evaluate its sound quality.

I had the Micro DAC, and it really did take that long to fully break in. In the end, it became the best-sounding DAC I’ve owned and truly lived up to the hype. Before it was fully broken in, I wasn’t impressed at all and almost sent it back. But another audiophile advised me to be patient, as he had also struggled to appreciate his Denafrips Pontus 15th until it had fully broken in.

lanx0003
1,241 posts
 

Op and others, you need to put yourself in their shoes. First, credit card companies and PayPal don’t refund the processing fee to the seller when a refund is issued to the customer. Second, when you return merchandise to Harmony, they provide you with a prepaid shipping label, right? Part of that $200 ‘restocking’ fee goes toward covering shipping and insurance both ways. Also, even if you send your DAC back in mint condition, the company still has to resell it as used, at a discount.

So, where exactly does this supposed $320 ‘profit’ come from? Think about it.  Are you making sensible statement here?  BTW, please take back your F word, even if I assume it was not intended to insult anyone.

--- Not a bad profit, I’d say. They got $320 of pure profit, and they got their Dac back in ‘Mint’ condition. Maybe the return business is better than actually selling Dacs?

lanx0003
1,241 posts
 

@ghdprentice The ’additional deduction’ is clearly stated in the ’Refunds’ section, neither ’embedded’ nor hidden elsewhere.  See below.

"We as buyers have to take responsibility for the choices we make..when all the info is given up front." as @mattw73 said.

lanx0003
1,241 posts
 

I think Weng is the founder and owner of Laiv Audio.

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