Moving from integrated to separates


So far, I have mostly owned integrated amplifiers. The only time I owned separates was when I had Parasound A21 and Parasound P6. Since then I have bought many integrated amps, and they have all been excellent for the most part. My current amp is the Audio Hungary Qualiton a50i which is by far the best integrated tube amp I have owned. It is a pure class A amp that is surprisingly powerful even though it provides only 50 watts. However, I recently bought new speakers -- Joseph Audio Perspective2 Graphene (which are replacing Harbeth SHL5+). Given the low sensitivity, I was expecting the Qualiton won’t be able to handle the speakers, but I think the rather benign (relatively speaking) impedance of the speakers helps, and to my surprise the amp is driving the speakers quite well. Even the bass is quite tight and punchy a far as tube amps go. To be very honest, I can easily live with this amp for a long time. But what’s the fun in being an audiophile then :)

That being said, I realize that 50 watts are 50 watts. I have a feeling that the Perspective2’s will scale even better with more power. Instead of looking for another integrated, I think I’m ready to give another shot to separates. But what is not negotiable at this time is that I simply won’t move to solid state, not even hybrid. I have tried a few integrated SS amps (last one was Luxman 590AXII), and while most of them were amazing in their own right, I have realized that I am at heart a tube guy. I’m not naive and I certainly understand the negatives associated with tubes (less bass, some loss of dynamics, etc.), but for now I’m looking for an all-tube solution.

So fellow audiogoners, please provide suggestions as you see fit. A few key asks:

1. Both the amp and pre-amp must be tube-based. No hybrids at this time. If you suggest an amplifier please also suggest the accompanying pre-amp that mates well. I’m not very savvy when it comes to matching the components so feel free to educate me :)

2. I’m also open to mono-blocks, but my budget might be a limiting factor. Total budget is $12,000 (for both pieces). To get the most mileage I think I will have to buy used.

3. I’m not a fan of the ’modern’ tube sound. I owned Rogue Audio Cronus Magnum II and thought it sounded more like an SS amp at times. However, this does not mean I’m looking for the vintage ’romantic’ sound of the past. My Qualiton a50i is a good example of straddling the fine line between sounding too modern and overly lush or romantic. Something in between is highly desirable.

4. I love my Qualiton a50i and don’t plan on selling it. I’ll move it to my second system. The only reason I want to try out separates is to get more power. I’m thinking at least 100 watts if not more - preferably in class A but not carved in stone. However, more power should not come at the expense of losing the ’magic’ of tubes.

5. I don’t need any built-in phono, DAC, tone controls, etc. in the preamp. But a remote control is a must.

6. And lastly it has to look good. I know, I know ... looks should be secondary to SQ, but what can I say. Maybe I’m vain when it comes to audio.

I really appreciate any recommendations. I know I’m asking for a lot and maybe you guys will tell me that $12K is not enough given the desired attributes. Since I’m buying used I’m prepared to create a short list of maybe 4-5 suggested combinations and buy as and when the components become available in the market. Also, feel free to educate me as to what to look for to create the right synergy between the preamp and amp beyond just the technicalities.

Thank you in advance for your help.

128x128arafiq

Showing 5 responses by larryi

You will not necessarily gain much by going to tubed separates.  Many tube integrated amps are essentially a basic tube amp with just an added volume control, source selector and additional input jacks. 
 

You should not assume that you need more power or that more power is the best approach to improving sound.  You should explore all options.  More power can come at the cost of sound quality.  I personally prefer low-powered tube amps over high powered tube amps that parallel multiple tubes to achieve higher power or use tube types that I don’t particularly like.  
 

As for a specific suggestion, I would recommend the Synthesis Audio A100 integrated.  It has a surprisingly good built- in DAC.  Even though you don’t need a DAC, the amp is still quite the bargain at its price.  It uses a quad of KT 66 tubes for it’s 100 wpc rated output.  It’s baby brother, the A40 uses two KT 66 tubes per channel and it also be adequate power for your purposes.  The amps are dynamic, harmonically full and rich, and deliver a large-scale sound.  They don’t have the hard, brittle sound and upper mid-range glare I hear with some high-powered tube amps.  

The local dealer in my area, Deja Vu Audio, sells only tube amplification.  Their primary line of electronics are Audio Note, Synthesis and Conrad Johnson.  I really like the Audio Note line up, but, their amps are aimed at high efficiency speakers.  The Synthesis line spans both medium and higher wattage tube offerings.  As I mentioned above, I really like their A40 and A100 amps (both well within your price range).  For the various speakers I've heard in comparison, I liked the Synthesis amps more than I do the Conrad Johnson, and the Conrad Johnson 150 watt amp is much more expensive.  Of course it may be a matter of system matching, but, even with somewhat difficult to drive speakers, like some Harbeth models, the Synthesis amps were considerably better to me--more alive and having more "weight" to the sound. 

I know output transformerless amps are a bit harder to match to speakers (they prefer high impedance speakers), but, it would be worthwhile trying to audition Atmasphere amps.  These amps are very dynamic sounding and exciting.   

I don’t know your situation as to ability to actually hear different amps.  If you can, hear something that runs something other than KT 88, KT 120, or KT 150s.  Those tubes are almost ubiquitous where power is the big selling point, but, there are other tube types worth hearing that tend to be not as ‘hard” sounding or don’t have as much of what I would call “glare.”  Perhaps even a 211 single -ended amp from a reputable builder like Airtight (Japanese) or Wyetech (Canadian) will work.  

I have not heard any Qualiton amp so I cannot say how it compares to the Synthesis.  These days, certain types of tubes are overlooked by the market because, within a given basic design, transformer requirement, etc., these tube types do not deliver as much power, and power sells. 

But, many of these overlooked types deliver great sound.  I am particularly a fan of 6L6 tubes, but, the current market is not interested because, for the same manufacturing cost, one can make a KT 120 or KT 150 amp which will smoke the 6L6, in terms of output.  It may well be the case that you need the extra power of these tube types, but, it is still worth your effort to hear a really good 6L6 amp, or its cousin, the KT 66.  There is something quite special about some of the low-powered pentode/tetrode tubes.

I happen to own a pair of quite efficient speakers, so I have the opportunity to run some really low-powered tubes in pushpull that sound fantastic.  I run the Western Electric 349 output tube which is a relative of the 6L6, but it delivers much less power.  My amp supposedly puts out about 5.5 watts per channel.  I've been running the same tubes for well over ten years and the tubes were of who-knows-what-age when I got the amp (old stock tubes).  The amp pushes the tubes very gently.  This is a good thing because the 349s cost a fortune if you can even find them for sale.

I would be helpful to know how close you now come to running out of clean power.  With tube amps, you don't get the shrill, harsh output from the tweeter that you get when solid state is running out of gas--you tend to first experience compression (you turn up the volume but it doesn't get much louder), followed by a muddled sound lacking in clarity and imaging starts to break down.  If you hear that at very high volume levels, you have to decide how important reaching such levels really is to your overall listening enjoyment (I don't like to listen at high levels, so I don't give high volume capability much priority, but, you may differ in your needs).  You could also get a cheap meter that measures how many watts are being delivered to your speakers.  At a fairly high volume level, you generally want to stay below 1/4 of rated power of the amp, except for the very occasional peaks.

Most people grossly over estimate how much power they really need and end up chasing the wrong thing in their quest for better sound.  Nelson Pass created a company dedicated to making really good solid state amps optimized for delivering great sound at lower power levels--the company name "First Watt" reflects its philosophy.  As that company put it--"Who cares what an amp sounds like at 500 watts if it sounds like crap at one watt?"  I've heard a couple of these First Watt amps and they are among the best solid state amps I've heard.  I think the same can be said of tube amps.  Most of the very best I've heard were low powered.  Unfortunately, low-powered tube means REALLY low power.  I own three tube amps, and the one with the highest rated power is the Audio Note Kageki at, I believe 6.5 watts per channel.  My current favorite amp that I own is a 5.5 watt per channel pushpull 349 amp.  My all time favorite amp is a custom built OTL amp that I think is rated at something like 20 watts (maybe more) that a friend owns.