Montreal Audio Show - anyone hear the FR30’s?

Someone needs to send one to Amir.😉👍🎼🎶🎵

on DSP analysis of the room to control the dispersion pattern of its drivers. It, by the way, costs way more than $30k.

The bottom line is performance as compared to peers

Exactly! Let’s be open minded here..

Some say that up to 50% of what you hear at sweet spot is the room.

 

If that is true.

Or if it is only 30%.. I guess it is dependent on if it is near field or more further away from the speakers to your sweet spot as a factor.

Let say if it is only 30% is from the room. Like reflections bass peak/nulls and so on..

When DSP correct most of the room interaction (talking from experience and doing it right now) . Not only can you correct the room You can adopt curves that compensate our hearing sensitivity that is different and varying over the whole frequency range (research since 1933 and incorporated in ISO 226:2003. But the cool thing you can tailor made it for your own personal preferences!)

(Of course you should fix the room in the physical domain first but that is far from the goal.)

Then you all understand that when it is the biggest component physical and has one of the biggest influence in your whole system.

Then naturaly with that big advantage that few speakers has we would get best in class performance and easily outperform it peers:

The bottom line is performance as compared to peers

Why?

Of course there is several reasons. 

 

One big reason is looks and with that WAF.

As a designer it starts here:

Hoffman’s Iron Laws of Speaker Building

1) Bass Extension

2) Efficiency

3) Small Enclosure

So you can choose two and the third is given to you.

 

If you want more extended Bass Extension and high efficiency (sensitivity) then you will have that but you will not get that in a small enclosure!

So you need a big ugly speaker enclosure and the market is not going for that. Sorry.

 

If you go for high efficiency (sensitivity) and a small enclosure then the bass extension is gone. That is not HiFi if you don't can hear full range.

But there is manufacturers that makes higher sensitivity and higher ohm speakers. So it is just to look elsewhere.

 

 

 

Here is two that heard FR30

Yes, PS audio have outsourced the design work.

No that is right it is not rocket science and very slow technology.

But you could incorporate room calibration into the speakers and take the lead in DSP high end Path. But it is a missed opportunity.

 

Yeh and many do not like active and DSP in the high end market. But if they lead the way and bring the DSP into the fine room. And it is not so that they don’t know how to build amps and electronic.. they do.. maybe then they would sacrifice some amplifier sales.. but they could make a modular plate amp and made it possible to upgrade and so on.

Yes missed opertunities, anyway.

@smodtactical Yes, I can understand that some like it to be 100% objective and 0% subjective.

 

​​​​​​But there is also some that criticize him to be to much objective. And criticize him by "You didn't listen to the product!" As a way to say that his objective data is not valid and don't matter in the practice. 

 

I think it is little bit to objective to take a product and measure it, pack it up send it back.. Without hooking it up to a stereo system at all (without listening to it) but that is maybe only me. ☺️

 

So in the end to make those that criticize him for that, then he listens on the test object. To satisfy them.. 

 

The data is there and it is up to you if you want to listen to his objective conclusion that he can draw from the measurements and listening tests.

 

Either way he is acting there is always someone that is unhappy and not content.🤔

 

Personally PS audio has lost most of my trust when for example Paul call Amir names. And are unable to produce a valid response video with proper messurment hardware. (More or less ANY hobbyist can bring out a hand held volt meter as a cheap croudamentary device. As a big company they should have much better measurement devices to be able to measure if the HW they make have any benefits at all for cleaning up noise.)

 

I would be ashamed to act like Paul and make that response video and response postings. It just shows how far behind they're in technology understanding and maturity in my opinion.

​​​​

To the subject at hand. FR30.. yes they are not expensive IF you consider PS audio has been "working" on something to get to the market for at least 3 years. They have employed speakers expert Chris and moved to newer and more expensive facilities during that time. They have Paul, CEO and all the other employees. All that piles up in huge expenses and it is expected by me that the price for the HW needs to be high. That is just the way things work with massive overhead costs.

 

It is not a couple of guys that work their as of in a garage 16h a day.. that is trying to start some business, those days are gone long time ago.

 

What is the technical advancement in FR30.

In my opinion none.. what do we have for technology:

• Passive radiators
• Backfiring tweeter
• Unusual midrange driver

Nothing new here in high end audio.

I were expecting something technology advancement in high end audio like possible to calibrate adjust the speakers in the specific environment they end up in (it is possible others have done it).

 

Especially when they were at it for many years.. and not much came out of advancement in the other end.

 

Yeh passive radiators.. yes it is in a big box. And maybe one of the bigger ones out there. But nothing new.

Backfiring tweeter. With a adjustment for level output. I don't see anything new with that. It is a nice thing to have of course.

The midrange driver and how THAT sounds is what I see as selling point if it to the listeners/customers liking or not.

 

So my opinion in the end it is a speaker that is larger than average and nothing particular special about them from a technical standpoint. I am always on the hunt for new and better technology solutions that solve problems like bass boom/bloom and so on. At a affordable price. I hoped that PS audio maybe come out with something new that maybe could trickle down later at some point. But that is something that the FR30 are not, they are just another box with drivers in my opinion (same same but just different form factor as any speakers are).

No that is not the way to do it:

"home theater amp with the mic and software."

The way to do it that will get more SQ that any speaker manufacturer can offer no matter how much money you throw at them.

 

When some manufacturers go to the customer and set up the speaker for them as good they can. That is good but there is only so much you can gain by moving (fine tune) it 5 cm here and there and I could not make a blind test and hear 5 cm.. if not in very specific situation)

If someone high end manufacturer instead sell a speaker without any wastfull passive crossover components.

And instead sell a speaker package with a DSP (and maybe amplifiers no problem for example PS audio that makes amplifiers) and when they come home to you they will make the placement make the sweet spot as wide/narrow as the customer wants or give him presets to be able to alter it.

Setting the time alignment between the drivers, fixing the crossovers, using dedicated amplifiers for each speaker driver/s when there is amplifies that is sounding best in the midrange then use the best sounding amp for bass, midrange and tweeter.

Also set and adjust presets for different types of music and what the specific customer like! Hard to beat the ability to tailor the sound after one specific costumer preferences.

 

Adjust with the DSP for the biggest physical component as the room is and it has also one of the biggest impact on the SQ <- just there.. there is no speaker manufacturer that can like a camelia adapt to each room and the placement in that specific room. 

Now we are talking about taking the SQ a step further that is nothing that is done by any manufacturer and only some hobbyist like me for example so I am talking from experience.

But please go on and move speakers in and out of your room that just have different woofer and box sizes and materials. That is trial and error and will not yield any different results. 

 This is a free idea that someone can adopt and incoperate in their offering. Like i wrote it is a missed opertunity from PS audio and a safer way to go.. to make it the way speaker manufacturers has always done it but what have we gained since IRS V then.. nothing when looking at a higher level perspective.