Luxman Integrated - What do they sound like


Hi Everyone,

I'm considering getting myself a late 2018 Christma present or early 2019 birthday present.

Modern Luxman reviews are really hard to come by, and are generally just superlative without being very qualitative. I mean, it's all "rah rah rah!! " and no actual details.
For anyone who has listened to them lately, can you tell me what they actually sound like in comparison to other nice amps I might have heard?

Thank you,
Erik


erik_squires

Showing 7 responses by joshfilm

I agree with many comments so far. I can add my own experience.

I fell back in love with high end audio when I heard the combination of a pair of Vivid K-1s and a Luxman 600a. For some reason, after several years of various lukewarm equipment demos, these made the music (and my senses) come alive and woke up the part of my brain that lusted after that feeling. I bought the speakers immediately because they were offered to me at a good price. To try to make it work within my already blown budget, I sought out a cheaper amplifier. I tried Unison research, Naim and a few others, but to no avail. All seemed to have a polite “hi fi” sound with the K-1s that felt relatively 2 dimensional (only partly talking soundstage here) compared to the way music was spilling (and occasionally erupting) out of the K-1s tethered to the 600a. (The source was an MSB analog DAC, used as pre-amp, btw) Eventually I asked my dealer to bring in a luxman integrated. I’m 99% sure it was the 550ax if memory serves. I would say that the integrated fell exactly half way between the two experiences. It was right at the entryway of Luxman’s magic, but not all the way through the door. I liked it, but it didn’t compel me the way the 600a did. It felt extremely competent with a taste of the liquidity, robustness, organic flow and slight warmth that Luxman class A accomplishes so well, but not the full meal. At this time I also brought in the Hegel integrated and I found it very dark in comparison with the Luxman integrated. I liked it, kinda, but not nearly as much as the Luxman sound. (Incidentally, the Hegel did such a better job driving my father’s difficult-to-drive ancient doenfors than the Luxman integrated that he bought the Hegel.)

The bank-breaking 600a purchase was starting to feel inevitable. But before I committed, I decided to look at a bunch of other options near its price range. These comparisons were extremely instructive. I tried the equivalent mid-level Ayre amp and found it very dry and thin, brittle almost. Really made me appreciate the flesh-on-the-bones meatiness that the Luxman class A gear brings. I then listened to some tube gear (Leben 1000 most notably) and realized that that 600a’s meatiness and slight is definitely why people refer to Luxman as being tube-like. That said, I’ve heard some tube gear completely outclass Luxman in this domain, but always at a cost of either some coloration or a thickness to the “air” that makes the meatiness almost claustrophobic to my ears. That’s when I appreciated how neutral and airy the Luxman sound was and the value that brought to the table. I then auditioned some Devialet monoblocks and again saw the Luxman outclassed in the parameters of neutrality and detail retrieval. But over time, I found the Devialet sound boring and I eventually stopped feeling compelled to listen to my system (kinda like trying to maintain a good convo with the buffest guy at the gym... doesn’t always work out, pardon the pun.) That experience made me really appreciate how “alive” (not necessarily “live”) the music felt through the K-1 and 600a and how fundamental that was to hitting the endorphin buttons in my brain. At the price point, nothing brought together the meatiness, airiness, neutrality and aliveness of the Luxman amp. I ended up buying it, then adding the c-600 preamp, then went monoblocked 600a’s, then graduated to c-900 and m-900 combo. You could say I fully drank the Luxman coolaid. I will say that the 900 series are a step down from the 600/800 full class A designs in terms of the meatiness of the mid range. But they bring something completely else to the table. 
So my only recommendation to you before you pull the trigger on the integrated is to try and compare it to an older generation 600a (which can be had quite cheap on audiogon)... it might just get you all the way through the door of the Luxman experience for similar or fewer dollars.

those are as many comparisons as I have. Hope it’s helpful. Good luck on your journey.

josh

Erik,
Have you ever tried using your Brooklyn DAC as a preamp? Or is that just the “+” model that has that feature?
i generally have preferred to have a preamp in the mix but have also had very successful results going direct from DAC/preamp to Amplifier (and specifically to the 600a, though I don’t want to beat a dead horse).
That said, I also downsized to an integrated, so I know where you are coming from.
Just worth exploring all options to maximize musical preeentation/enjoyment.
j
@tomcy6 

The link that @yyzsantabarbara shared goes some way to describing it. 
It's a tough one to pin down. Let me try. Let me also say that your mileage may vary with different speakers and other system components. Thanks for also giving us a focus: i.e: vocals.

The 600a is full and rich and warm, and delivers vocals with tremendous presence and texture. It is neutral by pretty much any standard, but favours midrange detail over high end detail. It is also occasionally a very little bit rough around the edges and needs to be well matched with speakers that don't have any tendency to be bright/harsh. Its mid range focus also means that in the high end, it is not the last word in refinement and in delivering the detail that contributes the sense of air air/atmosphere. So I would say that the vocals will be richly rendered and present, but you will not get every last aspect of the air surrounding the vocalist. The degree to which this is important is very much a matter of taste. In terms of bass, I found the 600a very capable with the right set up.

The 900u is truly possibly the last word in SS refinement, beautifully addressing the high end detail that contributes to air and atmosphere without the slightest hint of harshness. In fact, the 900u is the most velvet smooth amp from top to bottom that I have ever heard, with an addictive tonal neutrality across the entire spectrum. It's perfect in a way. There is no doubt when you hear it that it's a much more expensive amplifier than the 600a. It is not unlike the difference between fine wool and cashmere. The presentation of vocals in the 900u is tonally spot on and surrounded by an angelic amount of air, but slightly less present and rich. I spent a lot of time trying to dial in that midrange presence (as well bass tautness) with the right choice of cables, and got 95% of the way there (I just described these cables in someone's recent post on the M900/c900, btw, if you are curious), but I have to admit there was always something I missed from the m600a, even though its almost impossible to go back after you've heard the m900's refinement. 

I never found a synergistic tube preamp that did the trick either (I tried Thoress & Shindo), but maybe that does exist.

So let me put it this way... its going to depend on what your priority is between presence of the vocals and the air/space/atmosphere that surrounds them, between direct engagement and refinement. They are kinda two different was of getting the voice in the room with you. It's far from an "either / or," as they both do all things very well and the 900u does something special almost no other SS piece of gear does, but there is a clear difference in their approach. Where they are similar is in the way that they make sound feel like its pouring out of your speakers and filling your room. Luxman is really good at that.

Sorry to fill the space in this thread with a slightly off topic (and way too long) description, but I actually don't know how to do back channel communication. Happy to learn.

All the best,
J
@erik_squires 

Wow, did I ever spend a lot of time trying to figure out how to make a direct DAC to amp connection work with a 5.1 receiver. The only good solution I found is from a gear manufacturer who posts a lot on these forums (Steve at Empirical Audio) who makes a beautiful passive switcher. But before I ever got to try it, I ended up being so impressed by how my stereo setup was delivering movies that I dropped the project of restoring my 5.1 setup altogether.................... for now... maybe one day... me too... I hear ya.

@erik_squires 
That 5.1 build sounds pretty epic! 
The only advice/experience that I can lend is that it is well worth putting the 5.1 away for a bit to aim for big gains in a stereo setup. I ended up listening to much more music and replaced much of my tv and film watching with long listening sessions. Secondly, its amazing how far a well setup stereo can go to delivering an immersive soundtrack experience. I too will likely get back to 5.1 (or more) one day, but the satisfaction of a few years spent in pure stereo have been life-(habit-)changing.  There are workarounds to having a preamp, so explore until the music sounds great and makes you rush home every day a little faster to get back in the listening seat. That was the real result of getting it right. Fun times ahead.
J