I actually listened to the Linn on an all Linn system at a Linn dealer. It sounded good, but not worth 20K. Thats just the way I hear it. Others like yourself may think the Linn is better. I for one do not especially for 20K or even 4 or 5 for a Majik or whatever it is. |
oh, and may I add that this Linn dealer is very good at what he does and is probably one of the nicest dealers I have ever met. |
I agree with nkonor. The Linn sound is outdated to my ears. I would say if you are a tinkerer, buy one used. I recently heard an old Kenwood DD turntable at a friends house with an old SME 3009 and a shure cartridge that would give the Linn a battle. I think he is going to sell it for like 500.00. They are good tables used if you like the Linn sound and can get it at a good price.
Personally, I would say the Technics table trounces the Linn all day long.
I heard a fully Radicalized Linn and came home and listened to my VPI scout and felt it had more presence than the Linn. Now thats a 1600.00 table vs. at the time a 20K table. Thats just not good enough and Linn should be ashamed to sell a table for that much considering a scout betters it in some ways. At 20K it should not in any way. Not good. My scout is the old acrylic platter version. RU kidding me...
What happens when you go from a 120 gram record to a 200 gram record? Does it go out of TUNE? What happens when a cold front goes through, the humidity changes, etc. I have friends who have gone from one record to another and encountered massive differences in sound. One record sounds great, the next record sounds completely wrong? Not good in this day and age. One thing I will say is the Linn is a very nice table to look at. |
Well, that could be true. I thought that the Linn system was pretty decent.
I still think there are things that after years of listening you can hear that are qualities inherent to each piece. |
18K for a Linn Radical or say a used Basis debut. Hmmmmm, tough decision. |
he said he wondered why. I think this thread has given him an idea. |
actually a used Debut or even a 2200 would be much better. I think a used Debut costs much less that a Linn Klimax Radical and their is no comparison Tonto. |
I have heard the Linn, actually the best Linn and I have a friend that has an old Linn. I have heard the older Linn some time ago as he does not use the Linn anymore. My recent listen was to a top of the line setup and when I came home, my VPI Scout sounded pretty close and actually better in some ways.
I will admit that you guys have me intrigued now. I may have to go listen to one again. The dealer I went to listen to one at is not longer in business. The North American distributor is 5 minutes from my house. They will not let me listen to one and say I have to drive 200 miles to go to a Linn dealer. omg |
ahhhh no. people come on this site and proclaim that a 50 year old design beats the best designs of today. "read the thread" I have heard LP12's and I can tell you that although they sound good when tuned, to make statements that confuse people into thinking the LP12 is as good as most tables today is a farce at best. way too much effort and money has to be put into these tables to get them to sound decent. Its not worth it and a Basis 2001 is not what I would call a table that competes in the price range of a Linn although it probably sounds as good in many respects for a lot less money. Tinkering for decent sound is just not worth it. for the money of a radical, i do not want to ever have to tinker my friend. Rega rp6 is very strident as most of the regas especially with strings but I would say that a rp8 for example strident and all, competes with the Linn radical. In fact, I bet a lower end linn sounds almost as good as the top linn
What I would say is if you already have a linn, there are ways to make it sound better at a cost. If you can find one on EBAY for less than a 1000.00 and want a project, the Linn can fill your needs.
It is true that if you like the sound of the LInn, by all means enjoy it. |
actually, I went to their website and the phone number is the one here locally for all Linn. I tried to contact somebody at Linn, they just directed me to this local guy who tells me i have to travel 200 miles to hear one or go 500 miles to NYC. Thats just crazy since they are truly less than 15 minutes away driving slowly. Maybe somebody at Linn will see this and realize how crazy that is. |
it must be which is silly. so how does one get a table updated to the current status. I looked on their website and found no such information. what happened to their forum? it was a great place to share info on Linns especially. what a loss for Linn owners. thats ridiculous. |
I myself would not mind a Linn as a 2nd table. The do have their virtues. Just because I said the scout bettered the Linn Radical in some ways does not mean that the scout was better. The Linn was better but it cost between 18 and 20K.
Their is a six part video on Youtube describing how to set up a Linn. Thats way too many videos for a setup of a table, especially when they cost upwards of 6K new at the low end. Time is money and I would rather be listening than fiddling with the Linn. However, if I could find one for a reasonable price, I like to tinker once in a while. |
costing more does not always equate in a better table. For example, the technics 1200G sounds better than the Linn Radical from what I remember to my ears.
Like I said, the scout was close in some ways to the linn, but the linn was better. 18K vs 1600 bucks is a big difference.
However, from your and other comments, I wanted to reverify my conclusion and listen to a newer updated Linn but I have to drive 200 miles to hear one which is a massive inconvenience considering the service and North American distributor of Linn is a couple miles away from me.
I mentioned the 6 videos on youtube because if there are six parts to a video on how to set up a Linn, that is too many steps and way out of line in this day and age, especially when they cost over 6k for a basic new Linn. with that being said, the linn has been around for fifty years so it obviously makes a lot of people happy with its sound and its good looks. So if I was able to acquire one that was reasonably priced, I could tinker with it while I listened to my 1200g. |
if the table is that complex that it needs a high priest to get it right, thats a problem. Actually, I am not looking for a new table. the 1200G really does a lot right for the money I could always upgrade the arm if I wanted to which I don't. If I could get a linn for say between 500 and 1000 bucks, it would neat to tinker with it but I probably will not. the whole thing with the North American distributor being 2 miles away and will not let me listen leaves a bad taste in my mouth. bad business. IMO. |
there is a six part do it yourself video on youtube. lmao. what other table needs that kind of attention? its not a 100K table that the designer comes to your house to set up. I think the linn needs that. Like a doctor making house calls. |
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I am not sure how often any of the posters go to the orchestra. I go often. In all honesty and this is with my ears, a good direct drive sounds more like the real thing than most belt drives. The Linn LP 12 to my ears, does not sound as much like the real thing. Its sounds more like a recording of the real thing I guess is a way to put it. However, the sound a Linn makes although somewhat colored, is very nice to listen to. The Linn as well as many belt drives do not have the drive and the dynamics of a real orchestra. That being said, I still like the way the Linn sounds. Its very pleasing to the ear. Many times by isolating power supply you can get blacker backgrounds and some direct drives allow for the power supply to be in a separate chassis. The Linn offers a separate power supply which does allow for pretty black backgrounds, no doubt about it. If I had one, I would probably keep it and upgrade it. It is a worthy table for sure. |
the analysis of the Strat and the Gretsch is a perfect analogy. |
the American Sound is one of the best turntables in the world |
okay let me clarify, the American Sound turntable according to audiophile reviews is one of the best turntables. Why are you laughing.... you don't think so..... |
I do think the Sondek is a great table when it is set up correctly. I have come to find out that the dealer I went to passed away and believe me, he knew what he was doing. He was a great guy, probably one of the most thoughtful and engaging of all the dealers I have met. I liked to table. the table setup was probably around 18K. It was a deep stage but it did sound somewhat colored but very pleasing to the ear. I was actually going to buy an LP 12 and he was even thinking of selling me his ekos 2 with it. However when I came home and listened to the scout. i was a little shocked. I attribute it to the unipivot arm on the VPI but certain things did sound better on the VPI to my ears and my ears may not be as good as yours but I could not understand the large price tag. Also the bass was definitely not as good as on the 1200G. I still would get a LP12 if I could find one at a decent fair price for what you are getting. I might have been more interested if that dealer was still here. 4 hours for a tune up is a long drive both ways. |
the arm was an Ekos 2 and the system was top of the line Linn. The scout had a unipivot arm on it and that may attribute to the difference as it has a more wide open sound, not as accurate as the ekos but different. |
the cartridge was an old Linn cart, I think it was made by Lyra for Linn |
It easily betters the VPI, no doubt about. It definitely does not better the technics, its a different sound, the technics has a very accurate sound, and the linn is quieter much warmer in the mids and the base is not as solid as direct drives. Actually, the only table I have heard that really is great for a belt drive in the price range of the G is the Well tempered Amadeus. Its great table that I believe performs at a Linn radical level but its very touchy on setup. with the 1200G setup is easier and the one thing that does affect its sound is the 3 screws on the platter that have to be tightened to taste. I did like the Linn, and I would not mind one as a second table if I could be certain that it did not go out of tune as often as some say. |
I think a unipivot arm on a Linn would sound pretty fantastic I am sure. Audio Origami makes a unipivot for a Linn? |
I guess I was just disappointed from what I heard when I heard the Linn. It was a pretty expensive setup at around 18K for a turntable. The rest of the Linn setup was well over 100K. My VPI scout was an eyeopener when it came to the Linn. At my local dealer they had a VPI Aries and McIntosh monoblocks powering Magico speakers and I felt it was just much better than the Linn setup. Like Davey said, it could have been the all Linn setup contributing to the overall conclusion. Its possible. The Technics and other direct drives have a much different presentation than either. IMHO, more honest and accurate. Some may not want that honesty and some may like the lush sound of the Linn. Each to their own I guess. I personally would like to have a little of both. Maybe someday. |
so Linn equipment is that bad? |
All that matters is that one is happy whatever they purchase. as for the assanine statement, when you have been listening as long as I have, you start to hear things and you remember what ya hear, trust me.
Linn does not have the support in the states they should have and thats a problem, however, I might not mind tinkering with a used one someday. |
I guess that goes for Davey too. He comments a lot on equipment he does not own as well.
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Daveyf, the Linn is not the end all be all table. No table is. if he likes the Kuzma better, to him its better, there is no reason try to figure out why the Linn did not sound better. To him it did not anymore. Just like others who had Linns and maybe want to try something else. The Linn is a very good table, no doubt, but its got plenty of challengers and thats just the way it is. |
davey, you take things personal. I have nothing against the LP12. I guess I should have never said that the 1200G smokes the LP12 just because I think its better to my ears. Its all personal preference and system dependent and their are many tables that are very good. I have spoken to Linn experts that actually travel the country and come from other countries to tune in the Linns so they are still very relevant so if that tells you how I feel about Linns that I actually looked into what is involved with their upkeep and have tried to audition a Linn recently and I am forced to travel 100’s of miles to do so. Then you need somebody to come from another state or country to tune it up because nobody locally can do it correctly. If you have figure out how to get the most out of it, thats great. |
I think you will love it. They have an addicting sound when they are set up by an expert. |
