stringreen, Pity that you did not avail yourself of a good set up tech! That would have resulted in a much better sounding table and one that wouldn't have gone out of adjustment.
Like so many posters who have had a less than sterling result from their LP12, you want to blame the table, instead of your inability to maximize the table...
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stringreen, wrong....the fact that you had to constantly attend to the table tells me that you had it set up wrong...plain and simple! Sorry, but you clearly did not know what you were doing...which is ok, as I and most others don’t either when it comes to LP12 set up.
I have owned LP12’s for more than thirty years...none, none needed to be constantly set up--why, because I always had a pro LP12 tech set them up for me ( and I still do) and this results in the table being totally stable in this regard. The fact that LP12’s constantly float out of adjustment is a myth propagated by those who have never had a properly set up example. Too bad as they have no idea as to what they are missing, IMHO. |
rossb, you say you had a LP12 with a Radikal power supply and it had poor speed stability????? What the heck are you talking about! Poor speed stability with a Radikal power supply would lead me to say that something was drastically wrong with your set-up...so much so, that either you had a major fault with the power supply, or something else was very amiss! Too bad you couldn’t have figured out what the problem was, your investment in the table would have then made a lot of sense to you and you would NOT have posted what you did! |
whart, the price of a fully updated Linn LP12 is a little difficult to really nail down. The recently released 40th anniv issue with the whisky plinth came in at $40K! A limited edition model, this apparently sold out in days! Nonetheless, the Klimax model comes in at considerably less than that...appx. $20K with the Klimax case Radikal and Urika. ( Which IMO is not that much of an upgrade over the Akurate cased Radikal, but is priced considerably higher--and I would also skip the Urika phono stage).
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rossb, you think the platter is constantly trying to balance itself on top of three springs, while simultaneously resisting the sideways force of the belt???? Where does this come from???
How on earth do you think a suspended chassis turntable typically works...I guess you don’t believe in suspended chassis designs. To say that the speed stability with the Radikal is poor is just more ’bs’ IMHO.
Kuzma has great speed stability....due to what?? Frank Kuzma believes in a multi layer chassis hoping to do away with outside interference...question is does this really work better than a spring suspension..You tell me?
If you had a problem with speed stability with your LP12, it was simply because you either had it on a non-level surface, or you had no idea as to how to set it up, or both! Luckily with the Kuzma, it’s pretty much plonk it down anywhere and walk away, unfortunately with the LP12 you cannot get away wth that....as you found out! |
Rossb, you are discounting a lot of things...a) the set-up tech was competent,( remember a lot of the old school techs had never set up a Radikal before, this power supply and motor change is a very different animal to just swapping in a Lingo!) b) you were able to correctly place and level the table once the set up was completed, which is one of the issues that many Linn owners have after they take the table back from the set up tech, c) whoever installed the Radikal knew what they were doing...perhaps it was a different tech who installed the Radikal to the set up tech....or perhaps it was you!
I can absolutely tell you with complete certainty, IF you had a problem with speed stability with a Radikal, then you or someone else had set up the upgrade in a faulty manner. Period.
Blame the company or the table design or whatever, but be absolutely certain you never heard your Linn Radikal the way it was meant to be heard ( and does sound!!!) ... or for that matter what you paid for,i don’t blame you for being upset....but you really have no idea as to why you did not get what you paid for, imho.
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Audio video nirvana, sorry but your LP12 was anything but a decent "Linn rig". The Grace tonearm was nothing special at all, imo. (Never mind the Cotter cabling, lol)Perhaps it was ok back in the 80's, but even then Linn had the Ittok, which IMO was a far far better arm. Are you sure that you want to lump all LP12's with the " decent Linn rig" that you had back in the 80's!! |
How much does a "real VPI" cost these days?? Listen to an Akurate level LP12 and up, and then to a VPI that is in the same cost strata...and I think most will come away in the Linn camp.
OTOH, a VPI dealer may not agree, LOL |
Ok guys, you do realize that any table is only going to be as good as its weakest part....and if that part is the arm, then blaming the table for the weaknesses in the arm, is imho a little crazy!!!
The LP12 is a system, which is what makes it a great deal imo. One can start out at a low level, and as funds allow, improve the table to SOTA. How many other tables can you say that about?
audiovideonirvana, do you think it is ok to decry the LP12 based on your experience with an 80’s model,and even by your admittance, a sub par arm that you were listening to???
compare today a new Klimax level LP12 with a Radikal D against any VPI you care to mention....I know which one I would pick....!
which is why I own the LP12 and not the VPI.
YMMV.
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audiovideonirvana, I don’t doubt that your 80’s Linn didn’t sound that great....due to the weakness of the arm. Question is how much influence people have when they go on a public forum...and post opinions that the whole line of tables is just no good based on their highly "limited" experience. I see so many posters on this and other forums who jump to conclusion based on their " limited experience" with the LP12. None of these guys have ever heard a top level LP12, or have ever heard one that is correctly set-up and/or are comparing an old model ( many times from the 80’s--occasionally from the 90’s!--if they have heard the table at all!) to something that now floats their boat. Problem is that what now floats their boat is usually a table that cannot hold a candle to a top line Klimax LP12!
BTW, how many other tables can you say this about...after "thirty years" the option of "fixing up" ( whatever that means to you) is an option for the table. Try saying that with a thirty year old VPI!! You cannot even update most VPI’s to the current level after a few months, LOL. Oh, I forgot, they have a new version out now, leaving the old model to collect dust!
The one thing I do agree with you on is when you say..." If someone gave me a brand new Linn, with all the SOTA bells and whistles it could accommodate, I bet I’d be singing a different tune"!!!! You bet you would buster!!! |
