LAIV Harmony

Back to the Harmony, the LAiV scales a lot with a high quality source in my case an LHY UIP USB regenerator. By way of reference, a guy over at Headfi compared it to the Iris and found it outperformed it in his setup, preferred UIP USB direct to DAC to even UIP USB > IRIS > I2S > DAC. This corresponds to my experience vs the Gustard U18 and SU6 where I found the same. Lots of different paths to a great sound.

@audiostick Scales a lot.. upwards in performance… = improves or benefits prorportionately from, is quite sensitive to… a high quality source - is all I meant. Experimentation with the quality of power and signal cables for and between the UIP and another USB isolator upstream of the UIP, along with vibrafion damping and better chassis grounding of the UIP, is all very audible in improvements to the Harmony’s sound. So it is far from being source agnostic/indifferent for USB at least, feed it the highest quality USB source you can and it’ll reward you. My use of I2S has been more limited as the DDCs I tried to date didn’t sound as good as USB from the UIP, but same seems to be true from what experimentation I’ve done there.

@campo007 cheers for sharing your impressions. Suspect a few more more hours would have narrowed the gap a bit but how much, fair enough acting swiftly. What source were/are you feeding em both with? Btw not surprised to hear re the macro dynamics delta especially, more expensive DAC with separately housed multiple linear PS, this came across a little in the Virtualhifi comparison vid.

@campo007 Thanks - the Aries S1 with ext PS looks pretty sweet indeed - probably the streamer to beat at that price level and above methinks, had been aware of the highly rated G2.2 and G1.1 but hadn’t caught up on the newer S1.. just watched Hans’ review. The ability to act as a DDC for other digital inputs is further - and rare - value add. 

@sns Thanks for your nice write up of your impressions of the Harmony incl vs the Musetecs.

A few comments from my experience that may be of interest to you or others:

I’ve found high quality USB sounds terrific, better than I2S I’ve tried, and scales further with changes to USB cables and even vibration damping. I’m using a chain of USB regens incl an externally clocked LHY UIP which I’ve previously compared to the Innuous PhoenixUSB (which is awesome BTW a different class, the UIP wasn’t embarrassed as it is very good for its price & the ext clock closed the gap a fair bit) - and and a much cheaper AliX unit both employing the latest gen ADuM USB isolator chips. With all due respect to Weng-fai who has suggested the Harmony’s internal USB isolation should limit the effect of USB regens etc I’ve found it to be very sensitive to improved USB quality which is consistent with what the YouTuber you refer recently found - the Harmony DAC sounded better via USB from a Hifi Rose 130 than I2S from same and Aurender USB better again. Handily beats my Gustard U18 via I2S even when the U18 has the benefit of the LHY feeding it. I’ve also messed with various clock options using I2S, LAiV internal, U18 internal, U18 external and even though the latter was a bit of an improvement over LAiV internal (U18 internal last) USB trumped both by a good margin. A more expansive and timbrally rich sound.

Secondly, and I appreciate this may not be your or everyone’s cup of tea, nor a requirement to get the Harmony sounding great, but using the LAiV in NOS mode and oversampling externally in HQplayer (SincMx my preferred oversampling filter for the time being) produced the best sound in my system. Rich, natural but with more detail, micro-dynamics.

And lastly I’ve managed to eke a good bit more dynamic and soundstage scale and decay length, as well as reducing residual glare and increasing midrange palpability a touch, from tweaks like vibration damping with good footers and an fo.q sheet on top (the aesthetics, I know!) along with chassis grounding. I’ve a bit of experience damping components with milled aluminum enclosures and have found they respond enthusiastically to this.. may be a function of their high rigidity.

@sns Cheers and interesting re your fish line suspension, pretty novel, cool to hear it works well for you. What is your 'optimised USB implementation' BTW, sorry if I missed it?

On the subject of USB implementation in the LAiV this just dropped review is rather positive, indeed the whole review is very positive. The class of his review system is top notch. 

https://www.hifi-advice.com/blog/review/digital-reviews/spdif-dac-reviews/laiv-harmony-dac/

Conclusion

The beautifully sculpted Harmony DAC has a hugely revealing nature, but it is timbrally realistic, natural, and much like a chameleon. Combine it with a super-accurate and neutral source, and the DAC’s analytical quality will relay this in all its precision. Conversely, when combined with an organic and liquid-sounding source, the DAC will also relay the music in all its lushness and sweetness without overlaying any character of its own.

This is what I think a high-performance DAC should be like: not a component to EQ your system with but an open window onto your source. Such excellent performance usually comes with a much heftier price tag, and it is a miracle that the Harmony DAC achieves this at such a reasonable price point.

And re USB in particular

The Oladra/Harmony DAC combo takes a huge leap in solidity and control when switching from coaxial to USB. The Vermouth Reference USB cable is still a favorite for its even-handedness and ability to work well with virtually any source and DAC, but it is not the most robust or expressive cable I have. Nevertheless, with this cable, the DAC provides excellent clarity and transparency, combined with good articulation and toe-tapping PRaT, topped off with beguiling fluidity, refinement, and air. This result speaks clearly to the quality of the USB interfaces on both ends.

@sns your USB implementation looks pretty sweet, some nice gear there, I wouldn't be in any hurry either. By contrast I need to up my cable and PS game a little and agree the U18 whilst solid is far from the last word in I2S, the Audio-Gd DDCs with regenerated power on the order hand, they're pretty special. 

@sns Belated thanks for taking the time to share your detailed impressions of how the Harmony performs with the Gaia over I2S. Sounds pretty great. Look forward to hearing how you get on with the Tubulus I2S (Concentus I’m guessing?).

I also look forward to trying some even higher quality I2S and USB gear in the near future. I have a Ustars C19 (ext 10Mhz version) en route, a different price category to the Gaia that’s for sure but the French hifi forum loves this thing, will be interesting. Plan is to use it as an HQPlayer NAA. And a pair of optical USB isolators with SFP cages.

Cheers

@sns interesting re the new Ximius, first I’d heard of this.

Re optical fibre I should clarify these are a matched pair of optically isolated USB converters: USB in > SFP socket > SFPs or AOC or DAC cables > SFP socket > USB out. Will use to feed my LHY UIP. Agree re improvements of optical in the normal Ethernet use case, I have an Afterdark pair with Finisar and Cisco AOCs etc.

@sns Optically isolated USB regenerators are rare beasts so not surprised you’ve not heard of em. Here’s an expensive example from Afterdark, I got a much cheaper AliX equivalent that comes highly rated from that French hifi tweakers forum. Most USB isolators/regenerators deliver a level of isolation, some superb, some not quite so good, but technically at least, as for networks, they can’t quite match the 100% galvanic isolation of optical. As to the sonic effect it has on my Harmony-based system, I’ll keep you posted.

Re I2S vs USB, your vote in favour of the Gaia’s I2S vs your system’s already sorted USB comes through loud and clear. Sounds most excellent.

I’ll keep this forum posted as to where I get to with my own comparisons in my system, which have already included an externally clocked U18 via I2S (incl with the LHY USB regen feeding it) and when I can find its AWOL DC cable, my SU6 as well. Though from experience the former beats the latter (noting the SU6 beats the U18 using its internal oscillator), whilst the externally clocked UIP over USB was comfortably better than the former with both the LaiV and R26. Also hope to try an Audio-Gd DDC with the Harmony, it was very good indeed with my R26, if not quite in the class of a loaned PhoenixUSB I compared it to.

@sns Gee that was a superb review/article over at AS on that Taiko, thanks for sharing. I was already a convert to much of his three principles, but boy it was filled with interesting observations on an array of factors relevant to good sound in a highly sorted system. I should visit AS more, I mean when you have folk like John Swenson contributing in the comments.

A few points that particularly resonated with me, areas to potentially explore on a more modest budget:

- DAC (Direct attached cables) network cables are lower power draw than either Ethernet or optical SFPs, and he seemed to note a correlation between low power draw and sound quality

- the level of processing required to playback more demanding high bit rate music was inversely proportional to the sound quality (at least over that new XDMI interface)

- high capacity, high current delivery Lithium iron phosphate batteries can sound good but are sensitive to any electronics /cabling in the chain (I’ve observed this first hand in my system with one I use to power a router and modem)

- even with super pure battery power, the system was still sensitive to AC quality, power conditioning and potentially grounding helps (again first hand: ground quality is so important, I can highly recommend a low impedance path to ground, or better yet, paths plural)

 Sorry all, getting a little OT once more - but hey, all just areas of interest in endeavoring to optimize my Harmony-based system 

Anyone pre order the Laiv DDC?

@sim_audio_nerd I did, last week after my willpower to resist the temptation weakened after a few festive beverages. As I posted upthread there’s DDCs and there’s DDCs, they vary a lot in performance. I seem to be collecting DDCs having a U18 and SU6 in storage (need to sell some!) as to my ear my LHY UIP USB regen comfortably bests both, the UIP bettered only by the AudioGd DI-20HE I was loaned for a month, in turn bested by the much pricier Innuos Phoenix USB regen, also on loan.

With the LAiV uDDC, the appeal is a number of things… LAiV’s form to date with the DAC and HP2A both individually and their synergy, its matching aesthetics (a factor if I’m honest if lower weighted), and it’s external power and external clock upgradeability. Noting the latter hasn’t been a silver bullet for the U18 in my system. How well LAiV implemented their clock synthesiser and internal DC regulation circuits in the uDDC, not to mention USB isolation and the circuitry that converts asynchronous USB to synchronous I2S will be key to how it measures up to the competition. Audio-Gd and Denafrips (especially the Gaia and Hermes) are established high performers here, so one is taking a bit of a punt pre-ordering the uDDC.

@Audiostick I paused my uDDC pre-order for financial reasons so I do not have the uDDC yet sorry.