|
Thank you Rayhall and Ozzy for your responses...
Ozzy...some questions...I see in your system you have the Master and Revelation series products....apart from better high end...were the two products "similar" in terms of bass extension, midrange and soundstage...
To get the "highs" you wanted...did you replace both the VD PC and SC at the same time?? Or did you replace one first and then the other....Basically, I trying to find out which one had the best effect first..
Lastly, is the Emotion series comparable to the Master or Revelation in terms of performance and cost?
Thanks again for your comments...and oh...Troy and David who sent me messages off line... |
Thanks Ozzy...
Sounds like you have gone through quite a bit to get synergy...from your set up..
To give you an inkling....I tested IC's Kimber KS 1030, AZ Siler Ref 2, AZ Matrix Ref 2, Cardas Golden Reference and a couple of others...
I ended up putting the Cardas Golden Reference between the Pre and Power amp...It gave a good tonal accuracy but is a little thick....I balanced this out by putting the AZ Silver Ref 2 between the Source and the Pre...
So this is kind of a benchmark for me...for IC's
For Power cords...I have a Hydra 8 linked to a 32 amp dedicated line...using a DIY Furutech cable (with their components)....I noticed that when I put all the equipment through the Hydra 8....The soundstage grew wider and the music became more controlled (blacker)....
However, I found that I had to bump up the volume anywhere from 3 db to 8 db to get the same effect if not using the Hydra 8...In short, it sounded a little veiled...
I did try the Hydra 8 with the Taipan Helix and Python Helix....Again...the smoothness of the sound is definitely there but this drop in db kind of bothered me...can't explain but did not like the sound....
Now I run my amps direct and the source and the pre through the Hydra 8...Sounds a little better...meanwhile I have ordered a Running Springs Audio Duke to test which will come next week...
So my point now is that with the investment to be made for power cords....well I would like to be sure and not take a leap of faith...in the case of these two brands, there are no dealers here....and so comments and sharing of experiences is important for me...
Thanks again
Teck |
HI Ozzy,
Thanks for the advice....time for me to go test with other cables that are available to me...
Teck |
Hello John,
Thank you for your contribution...this is interesting as there is a Stealth dealer here....
I have some questions for you:
- For PC's, your recommendation is for either the Dream or M5000...
- what IC's are you using? From Pre to Power (if you are in this configuration) and from Digital source to Pre (again if you run this config)...
- what speaker cables are you using...
So far, the Kimber BiFocal XL seems to do its job...the AZ Silver Ref 2 from Source to Pre is also okay...but the "if's" in my system are:
- Pre to Power IC (Cardas Golden Ref) sounds good and tonally correct but a little thick...
- my power cords probably since they are DIY...
- my source...
- room acoustics...
For the cables, I am interested to try the KS and VD cables but since they are not sold here....it is too great a risk to buy new....
The Stealth will be interesting and I intend to pay the dealer a visit this weekend to see if they have loaners...
Purist dealer is here too...so a visit to them as well...
Thanks |
Grr6001
How true...for testing...unfortunately, there is no quick fix to any of this testing unless you buy BOSE...
Boy...with all the reviews on VD cables, it sounds really like an end all cable....
I have to call these guys... |
Hi Clio09,
Thanks for the heads up....Boy the deals they are giving is great...Customer service is great and managed to get a pair of Revelations for my Source and Pre-amp...
Now I really have to make some choices on my CD source..
Hopefully this will work out in my system.... |
John, thanks for looking out after my interests in this "slippery slope" and sharing your experiences...I agree with you that one should always test, test and test...
Unfortunately for me, as mentioned above, there is no international representation of these 2 companies where I live...thus the only way to "try" or to "test" in my system at times is to make a "leap of faith" based on fellow members use and recommendations.....
Of course, these recommendations are sometimes taken with a pinch of salt as there are so many variables as you pointed out in testing...so the only way is to test, test and test...which hopefully leads to synergy (pleasure to your own ears)..
Apart from getting a proper CD Source, there are two other variables that I have to take care of which I suspect is not getting me to that 3D sound.....
Room treatment and Power cords....all three things are going on at the same time which will take me a few more months to complete....
I am no acoustician (so lots of reading posts and understanding the nuances in between the lines of recommendations) and trying to get past recognizing what is being said versus "understanding" what it means...a little tough for me due to my lack of technical knowledge of understanding the different freq aspects..
As for the power cords, I stopped by the Stealth dealer yesterday and they were readily agreed to do in home loans for their cables...in fact there were ready to throw a bunch of them at me to bring home...
I didn't take them as I told them I am still in the process of evaluating my Digital source...so once that is done, I will be back...
John, I am glad that there are many great members in Audiogon, who willing to come out and voice opinions and recommendations to fellow members...this is great for guys like us who are trying to learn more...Thanks |
Thanks guys...
VD cords are on the way and will post my impressions once they arrive....thanks |
Hi John / Fplanner2000
The power cords should be arriving hopefully this weekend or early next week....
VD had them in the cooker for 8 straight days before shipping them (per my request)...so this will reduce my burn in period a little...
I have also made contact with the Stealth dealer to test the Dream and M5000 cords....
Will post my observations after that... |
The Cables have arrived.....
Will put them in today and post some impressions next week.. |
Hi All,
Cable received and burned in 24/7 by VD for 8 days before shipping to me...(at least this is what I am told)....Below are reactions so far....AND PLEASE PLEASE DO NOT SLAM ME FOR PROVIDING THESE INITIAL REACTIONS....
Initial Reactions:
- extremely tough cable to work with, even with pre-forming or pre-bending into shape...
- keeps on popping out of inlets and do not grip very well compared to my Furutechs
- needs to constantly make sure there is no shift in weight for the cables to work loose..
- if I had to decide on this alone, these cables may not make it.
- it is so difficult the cable would not stay in the Naim CD player inlet (thus I have left one PC out).
I have a borrowed Naim CD2X (this unit is used, just traded in so I believe it is runned in) to test these cables(nice dealer who loaned it to me).
I bought 2 Revelation 1.0 cords and I have plugged 1 of them into the Pre-amp. 2nd power cord could not go into the CD player...so it stays out till I figure out how to manhandle this thing...
So far it has been running like this:
Wall --> Pre amp (VD Rev 1.0)
Wall --> Naim CD2X (Naim power cord)
Wall --> RSA Duke (Mongoose) --> Monoblocks (DIY Furutech cords)
See my system for other cable connections..
With the Hydra 8 in the equation, the reduction in dynamics is worse...sound seems to have dropped back by a few rows (rather than forward)...Have to really crank up the volume to get the same sound as before...
Now with the Hydra 8 out, the dynamics have returned but still detect that the sound is further away...vocals (male and female are good) but instruments not as prominent as before...
Now to be fair, since the Naim CD2X is new to this equation, I am recognizing that this player could be contributing to what I am hearing....since I have gotten used to my other Oppo 981 player...
I intend to run this configuration for at least 1 week before I switch back to the Oppo....I know I know, it is not the best player on the planet, but this is what I have to work with now....so please take these comments with a pinch of salt....
By then the Rev 1.0 should have added another 100 hrs (total close to 300 hrs) to it to get to the magic 400 hrs...
Will post again then..... |
Hi all,
Thanks for the feedback...
Tonight, I will go wrestle with the cables and rearrange my cd player closer to the floor....
Boy this is real hard work...but fun..will be back to post again. |
Ok....I'm baack..have been on a road trip
Thanks to all the suggestions and comments so far and I will try and keep this short and pointed...not going to try and explain every track on what I heard or did not hear,...
Some background info:
- cables have gone through easily about 300 hours since install.
- the 2 cords were installed on the Pre-Amp and Digital Source (Naim CD2X and Oppo 981)
- cables went straight into wall outlets and not through any Power conditioners. (I have 2 dedicated 32 amp lines).
- these VD cables are kinda of difficult to wrestle with in installing them and keeping them in place, slightest move and they dislodge...Learnt the art of keeping them in..however once your figured out how to bend them into shape, they stay...
- i limited my test to 3 CD's that I am familiar with, Vocals on one, Drums on another, and cymbals on another.
- speaker position had to be adjusted to re-focus the sound.
Impressions/Effects on the Music
Pros
- sound stage widen
- sound became front row, music came up front by about 2 to 3 rows...
- Highs and Bass immediately boosted
Not so Pros
- Boosted bass got to the point of sounding a little fat and loose. On poorly recorded RB CD's, this is really pronounced.
- had to crank up the volume (depending on recordings anywhere from 3 to 10 db) a little as the sound level kinda of dropped.
- the music sounded kinda of aggressive to me..
Overall a very good cable but I am not too convinced of it in my set up. Just to make sure that I am not making a mistake...I did a quick A/B/C test.
- put by DIY Furutech cords back in (now I know how bad they are)...
- Brought the cords to the Stealth dealer and tested in their system with my VD cables, against the Stealth Dream and M5000...boy there are differences...mainly in the presentation of the music in favor of the Stealth Dream (extremely neutral and nice and at least I have a benchmark).
- borrowed a JPS Lab Digital AC cord (put this on the Oppo) and my other Furutech went back in to the Pre-amp...
this cable seems to be less aggressive but seems more balanced in my system...the JPS lab cord is still in my system.
- I will be testing the Audience Power Chord and Harmonix Studio Master later this week..
So in summary and I have nothing against these cables, but unfortunately these cables are not working out so well in my set-up....
I would like to thank everyone for their input and hope that fans of these cords are not upset by my post. |
Thanks for the support...
One thing to note and put on record...this thread started out to find opinions between the two brands but I ended up testing the VD cables only....
Unfortunately, I was not able to test any KS cables in my system....so sometime down the road when this is available, will do so.
JaFox - thanks for the comments...I like the Stealth Dream and my comments "as a reference" is for myself listening to what a top notch cable can do...do not wish to let the others reading the thread think that I am so bold as to proclaim as "the new reference"...
Cenline - thanks for the comments as well and you PM's...
The interesting thing about this testing of Power chords is the ability to make sure that it works with the whole set up....no other way to do it except Patience, Patience and more Patience...
Thanks again |
Thanks guys....I have been trying out the Jorma Design Power cords and their Interconnect....wow....they are good and provide a very balanced sound...
I tested the Super Power cord on my pre-amp and it is very good there, better than at my cd player...
I tried the Jorma Design No2 IC and it beat my AZ Silver Ref 2 hands down in terms of fleshing out the sound..I am waiting to test the No1 and the Prime...not cheap but wow..
still unable to test the KS as there is no agent here...so cannot compare. |
Hi Marcuz,
Nice system....and thank you for sharing.
Well...I will be getting both the JD No1 and KS Emotion in about 10 days....this is what I have been hearing so far in terms of performance....
I guess this will be put to rest when they arrive...who knows, these two cables make work well together if i put either one pair from Pre to Power amp and the other from source to pre...this will be interesting to see the result.
Also coming in will be the Emotion Power cord...and JD Super power....
Will update you guys...thanks |
