George, what is your point ? I do not feel, reading the measurements, that they are harder to drive than many others, just not as easy for a 2a3 flea watt tube amp. An 8wpc tube amp seemed to sound good, to Art. It would not, to me, that is for sure. For my listening tastes, I would need MORE. As far as drive ability, a simple example would be, an Adcom 535 series II ( a Pass design ), as it would get them going pretty nicely, without a problem driving them ( although, some might not like the overall sound of this pairing ). How many other 15 K speakers ( other than horns, could be driven the same. Using a 15 inch driver would require a bit more power to get them moving. I find the same with my Lascala’s. If you are indicating, in your special way, they are not a good speaker, Art Dudley stated they are a steal at their 15 K price. I think so, also. As every speaker designer has to make certain compromises with each design ( nothing is perfect ), I would easily rather live with these, over other 15K speakers, because what I want, and expect, out of a speaker, these would do it. There is no slowing down at the Klipsch factory, as the Khorn, after 70 years of manufacture, are still going strong, many of them selling to overseas listeners. I believe the review, and the measurements, are both beneficial, to potential customers. YMMV. Enjoy ! MrD. |
I could remind folks, that JA also indicated that the cabinet resonances he measured, would likely not be audible with music playing, although, I believe, they can still be improved. Most wood bodied musical instruments vibrate, just to be clear. d2girls, I have heard your speakers, and, imo, they are not better than " my " Lascalas, I can assure you. Specifically, coherence wise, in the region where the woofers and horns, intersect. And again, you heard a pair of the new Khorns, to make this comment ? YMMV. Enjoy ! MrD. |
If I am not mistaken, in the 1st paragraph of JA's measurements, he states that he took the measurements, while the Khorn was on a dolly, in AD's driveway. Not that it matters. JA owns a pair of Altec 19s, and feels they are wonderful, if you read many of his columns. They are not even a full range horn, as an early example of a horn hybrid. An excellent speaker, but does have many flaws as well. As I write here, I cannot help but think, the tremendous influence PWK has had, not just at the Klipsch company, but with so many other horn manufacturers who are using folded horn designs. Those of you who know me from my posts, know I go way back with Klipsch, as a fanboy, and modifier. They are easy to modify, and with these modifications, the inherent flaws can be eliminated. I have not seen, nor heard, a speaker product, at all price ranges, that could not benefit from a modification or two, to bring it's sq performance to a higher level ( and not just speakers ). My 1st introduction to Khorns, was at the home of a music teacher / choral director of mine, and I was blown away. I wasn't quite 10 at this time, and it was during the time my dad had AR3as, which were wonderful to me. That experience captured my ears, my brain, my heart, and my soul. There was no turning back for me. It was during this time that I realized my dad's Fisher 500C, was not adequately driving his ARs. He purchased, with my recommendation, a Sansui 881 Deluxe, which brought the ARs to life, and I, acquired his 500c, to drive my Klipsch Cornwalls ( I bought them from my teacher ). Over the years, I owned so many other designs, plus, being in the audio business from my late teens, and on, I appreciated all the other speakers ( equipment in general ) I had available to me. Being around, and involved, with live music, I realized, there was a lot of " hifi " stuff, but listening through my CWs, it was now music. And, to shorten this up, moved into my own place at 19, got married at 25, bought my 1st house, with Khorns in perfect corners, had a son six years later, moved to a different house, sold the Khorns, got me Lascalas, with a pair of Janis woofers, and was happy again. I still own Lascalas, which I believe is my 7th pair ( sold the others ). Did I mention modifications ? Damping horns, bracing cabinets, upgrading crossovers.....yada yada yada. Sorry for my rant....last thing. I do not remember everything from my past, and do not want to get into why, but, anything, audio related, I remember. Enjoy ! MrD. |
I have heard many products that measure horribly, but sound excellent, and many products that measure extremely well, but did not sound favorable, to me. I just turned 65, and every birthday, I treat myself to a visit with my audiologist, as well as conducting my own testing. I am not the emotional one, but do defend my positions often. I have never accused someone as being 1/2 deaf, as you have, nor, made the claim that my hearing is better than others, as you have, on these pages. This tells me, and others, quite a bit about you. The fact that you do not hear a coherence issue with your speakers, does not mean they do not exist. I do not believe, you know what to listen for, when it comes to coherence, and audio products, in general. It takes years of experience, trial and error, and an educated ear, to develop these skills. More importantly, it takes a lot of time, to figure out what goes with what, to achieve the system that makes someone happy. You are not there yet, as you posts indicate. Time to grow up, and, relax. You are a very angry, hostile, uptight gal, which you once admitted to, and you even stated you were working on it. Enjoy ! MrD. |
Roy Delgado, the fellow who worked along side PWK, and the guy now running things engineering wise over at Klipsch, has stated many times in articles, that he would keep the original Heritage designs intact, as they are wonderful designs, and still, as jsautter has stated above, successful sellers after all of this time. Also, to keep the legacy of PWK going. I never found any 2-3 wpc amp, to drive any of these models, properly. Definitely got volume out of them, but nothing to write home about. I know George is not a fan of Klipsch, nor horns for that matter, but I think that is fine, because variety, and individuality, is what this hobby is all about. Have a great day, everyone, and, Enjoy ! MrD. |
Although retired from the industry, I still visit, now and then, audiophiles in their homes, as the word has spread of my background. A comment made above, that the new Khorns are not for serious music listeners, is hogwash. Some of the " happiest " people I meet ( happy with their systems ), are people with Heritage speakers. When I visit folks with Vandys, Thiels, Maggies, ML, ( and others ), they never seem to be happy with their systems, and they do not know why. Many of these folks have been to my place, and truly loved what they heard. An I to assume, the folks in the Asian markets, are not serious listeners. Go on line, and do some research. Horns, horns and more horns, many of them Heritage. As I have said many times, horns ( Klipsch ) are not for everyone. Same with tubes, ss, and it goes on, and on. Discovering what you like in a reproduction system, is foremost, number one, and building upon that, is second. I made my choice. I am a happy listener, as serious as anyone else, and I never question my speaker choice, as many others, in fact, do. Let us all be a " music family ", get along, and learn from one another, rather than bash each other for what we feel sounds good. I recently purchased the live, double cd set by Steve Winwood, who I am a fan ( it was used by a reviewer recently ), and I cannot imagine my system sounding more satisfying, or engaging, as it currently does. I am not suggesting it cannot be improved upon, as I have been around the block hundreds of times, but, I listen, and listen, and listen some more, never once feeling, what can I do, to make it better, unlike the many folks whose homes I visit, never happy, never content, with what they have. I feel my loudspeakers are a primary reason I an enthralled, daily. 50 years, and still, enthralled. Hope you all have a great day, and, Enjoy ! MrD. |
It is all about trade offs and compromise, which I hear in EVERY design, at EVERY price......If I am not mistaken, George owns a version of ML Monoliths ( likely modified to the tilt, knowing George ), which I have much familiarity with. Just as I do not like many horn hybrids, because of that " discontinuity " between the horns and the woofer boxes, I also hear this in the Monolith, this lack of coherence, if you will. I would never come on here, and bad mouth the design, as it makes trade offs, and I know it can be enjoyed by many. I respect many listeners here, and elsewhere, because if they find a system they are happy with, that, is all that matters. I might not agree, that the system this other person finds so enjoyable, fits my specific criteria as a listener ( as I say all of the time, it is personal and individualistic ). It is childish and meaningless, to make snarl comments as Georgie seems to do, and he does it often, and everywhere. But, it is humorous, the majority of the time, this back and forth, with nothing ever changing. Enjoy ! MrD. |
jsautter, I can, w/o question, improve upon some of the flaws, inherent in the new Khorns, as I have, and many other Klipsch devotees, have learned to do. Nothing, cannot be improved upon, be realistic..... |
