The "stock" cord was probably swapped on me when I bought this amplifier used without first seeing it. It looked more appropriate for a preamp. In any case, I built one for about $20 in parts. |
I have to agree with Dunlavy. Beyond a reasonable limit, spending HUGE bucks on fat, fancy, and colorful cables is a waste of money.
If you want a real laugh, check out the thread here on Audiogon titled "Nice Warm AC cord for a PLC". |
Sean, while I respect what you are telling us and I cannot judge what you claim to be hearing, I still stand by my original point about cables in general. With regard to AC power cords, if your new equipment introduced hum into your system that varied in pitch and amplitude with different cords, I would suspect a more severe problem somewhere in the system that was only altered (and perhaps not even solved) by trying different cords. If a different cord did solve the problem perhaps the original cord was defective or something else in the system was not quite right. I have cheap cheap power cords on some of my gear with no weird hum or variations in amplitude or pitch when I change the cord.
My main point should be that, in my opinion, it is wrong to spend huge bucks on interconnects, speaker cables, and power cords that are essentailly being used as tone controls to make up for deficiencies elsewhere in the system. With regard to AC power cords I cannot understand the logic of spending hundreds of dollars on colorful fat cables to plug into a wall outlet that has cheap wiring behind it throughout the house. I would ask, would it possibly be more wise to improve the wiring behind the outlet before dumping mega-bucks on the cool looking power cord? I would agree that an inadequate power cord should be replaced but again, in my opinion, spending more than $50 or so is a waste of money (unless you get pleasure from looking at it like a piece of jewelry). |
Jay, I would agree that interconnects can present a noticeable difference in the sound of your system especially since the measurable and documented differences in the characteristics of these cables can have an affect on the output and input stages of components that might be sensitive to these effects - inductive reatance and capacitive reactance, both of which will alter the tone of an audio signal. On the other hand, I believe that these effects are less pronounced at the low impedance output of a power amplifier coupled to a speaker. A higher quality cable of lower resistance will provide a slight improvement in sound but my real gripe is with those very expensive cables that come packaged in very pretty cases with velvet lining and certificate of authenticity, etc. Snake Oil! Don't even get me started on AC power cords... there's another thread here on Audiogon where you can read in detail my strong opinion on this area of voodoo. :-) |
Sean, if you've purchased "high-end" AC cords for pennies on the dollar I should commend you for being reasonable where you spend your money on this crazy hobby. If we had limitless funds, we would all spend several thousand dollars on each component and every cable to get the false sense that we've spent enough money to have a "better" system than one that costs much less. Expensive interconnects are not always better than cheap ones, expensive speaker wires aren't always better than modest wires. In many cases they are just different or just sound different and not necessarily better.
I agree that a good power cord is essential but as I've stated before, I completely disagree that the AC power cord should even be considered as an area of experimentation for altering the overall "tone" of a system (as written about in the other thread). You mention that you prefer to think of the power cord as a "filter" instead of a tone control. Well, what is a filter? A filter passes certain frequencies and attenuates others - you're still essentially calling it a tone control! But I argue that the 60-cycle "tone" coming from your AC mains should hopefully be nearly eliminated through the filtering in the power supply section of your equipment. Why would one try to alter the supposedly audible characteristics of the AC power source when the goal is to eliminate it completely by turning it into pure DC current within the equipment? A good solid high-current capable power cord with decent low contact resistance to the AC outlet is sufficient in my book. I don't subscribe to the bogus claims from mega-buck power cord makers that their AC cords have some magical "sonic signature". So I reassert my opinion that spending more than $50 or so on an AC power cord is wasteful. |
"Anyway, ABE (cont'd): I am dying to know what power cord you regard as an essential upgrade from the stock power cord, but only costs $50."
J_thunders, no where in my previous posts did I say anything about essential upgrades from stock power cords so please do not misquote me. In most cases I do not believe that it is "essential" to replace the stock power cord at all.
If you must know what power cords I have used, I use mostly the stock cord. But I have built my own using relatively inexpensive parts and cable commonly available from most hardware stores or electrical supply warehouses.
It doesn't surprise me that there are so many outfits that make mega-buck magical high-end power cords. It takes very little (or ZERO) R&D investment, just pretty wires with big gold connectors, some advertising budget, and an audience willing to believe in the magic.
If I buy a fat garden hose of a certain color at 100 times the price of a standard garden hose, will the water coming from the hose magically make my lawn more green? Or will I need a gold plated nozzle to really notice the improvement? |
Plasmatronic, so you're the guy who started this intense debate! I wonder how many people here sell cable goods? Someone complained that this thread is hurting cable sales on Audiogon.
I'll have to agree that some high-end systems are deserving of a high-end power cord but mostly for the eye candy effect. At some point, the entire audio system becomes more than just a means of producing fine sound. It should look nice. Personally, I don't like brown zip cord. I prefer a slightly fatter black zip cord. And you? |
OK, you were joking but....
I don't see the problem with my simple statement, "I agree that a good power cord is essential..." Is there something in that simple statement that you do not understand? I didn't say "a good stock power cord is essential". I didn't say "a good mega-buck power cord is essential".
If you choose to read more into it be my guest but I fail to see your point except to confuse the topic of this thread. Read the rest of the sentence then the entire paragraph so you can understand the context in which I made my statement. |
A simple question to all....
Do you believe an AC power cord should be used as a tone control? |
Sean, you didn't answer the question.. Do you belive an AC power cord should be used as a tone control? |
I didn't think such a simple question would anger and frustrate so many people.
To the person who asked why I built a power cord using parts from the hardware store, it had nothing to do with improving the sound of my system. It had everything to do with the fact that this particular stock power cord wasn't up to par in terms of wire gauge to handle the AC current draw. Why else would I go through the trouble of building a better AC power cord?
Why is there no point in answering this simple question? I'm not looking for a right or wrong answer. In YOUR OPINION do you believe an AC power cord should be used as a tone control? I am truly interested in seeing the responses. |
Is this not a discussion forum and a hot topic worth debating? If it pleases people, I will again plainly state my view that I do not believe an AC power cord should be used as a tone control and asked if they do.
If this offends people so much that they have to make personal attacks against me, perhaps some of them are struggling with this themselves and can't arrive at a simple YES or NO answer. |
Well I'm through with this too after a few paragraphs..........
Some things to think about:
Fact: Interconnects are designed to carry low-level audio signals between various audio components by coupling their electronic circuitry together. It makes perfect sense then that interconnects will have an audible effect on the sound of a system. It also makes sense that one could experiment with interconnects to alter the "tone" or "sonic signature" of the system.
Fact: Speaker cables are designed to carry audio signals and should also have an effect on the over all sound of a system (but to a lesser extent than the interconnects which carry a low-level signal that by its very nature is more sensitive to variations in cable vs the high-level signal carried by the speaker cables).
Fact: The AC power cord is designed to carry AC power with sufficient current to the equipment. It is not designed or intented to carry audio signals at all. Additionally, the AC current being fed to the equipment will ultimately be turned into "clean" direct current within the power supply. The intent is to have NO AC signal, audio or otherwise, in the DC power being supplied to power the circuitry.
Fact: The AC wiring in your house behind the power outlet is common and cheap. Unless you rewire your house first, it makes no sense to me to use an outrageously exotic power cord to the equipment.
Back to my original question, "do you believe an AC power cord should be used as a tone control"? I do not. |
Chris, I agree with much of what you said and you put a lot of calm methodical reason behind your comments.
You talk about mating high quality speaker cable with speakers that do not necessarily have the highest quality wiring inside. While people may hear an improvement in the sound (I have), at least here, we are making the adjustment in the *audio* path where you get more "bang for the buck", if you will. Possibly more so with interconnects.
We both know that the AC power cord is not in the *audio* signal path at all so I still have an issue with making adjustments here. On top of that, most of us have several hundred feet of copper wiring at a few cents per foot behind our power outlets yet some people are willing to spend a hundred dollars or more per foot for say, a 6 or 8 foot run of AC power cord (that plugs into several hundred feet of cheap copper Romex). You upgraded your house wiring but I'm sure that most of us have not.
I can understand using a power conditioner or filters on the AC line and many components include a little filtering where the power cord enters the chassis. I think we both agree that this is filtering to reduce "grunge" on the AC line and not for altering the tone of the system. And beyond that, there's the stiff power supply regulators and filter caps.
Maybe its just me but I still think the AC power cord is the least effective place to make tonal adjustments to the sound of an hifi audio sytem. I believe that an AC power cord of sufficient wire gauge to handle the current draw is more than adequate and any adjustments in the sound of the system should be done either in the transducers, the electronics, or the audio signal path between components.
I guess I'm the only one but this is my opinion. I'll leave it at that and let it go. Cheers! |
