integrateds in the modern age: consensus?

I would say definitely not, and it totally depends on the system. It is all precieved value as well. If an integrated cost 5000, and that's all the consumer has room for on their shelf, they may feel it is of a higher value. As far as sound quality, there are intergrateds that cost 19K or more, that can run with almost the best separates out there.

There are many different systems with many different users, and many different manufacturers to accomodate everyone.

If all the source signals are at line level (which means that any TT has its own outboard phono preamp) a separate box called a "preamp" really makes no sense. It costs very little to build the selector switch and volume control into the power amp, and perhaps add a gain stage. As a bonus, this eliminates an interconnect. In theory it ought to be better than separate units.

The idea of a separate preamp derives from the days of hum-prone tube circuits. A high gain phono stage on the same chassis as a hefty power supply was asking for trouble.

I prefer Integrated amplifiers simply because you can get a better cost/performance ratio. You not only cut the cost of interconnects, but it also costs the manuf. less money to build the unit material wise. I beleive a $3000 integrated will outperform a $1500 amp and $1500 pre-amp.

If you would like an example I purchased a Simaudio Moon I-5 which cost me around $3000 canadian. The best seperates I heard around $3000 were Parasound Halo P3/A23. The A23 on paper has more power but the I-5 still outperformed the A23. On top of that the I-5 has better quality components (WBT compared to cheap plastic) and is built in Canada.

Of course I'm talking in 'used-prices' but I'll place my Passive Placette/Belles 150a hot rod against any combo/intergrated--in the 1600-for-both,range. It goes against the grain in performance for the price.---Sure you need good stuff ahead of the pre and good speakers to hear just how good cheap stuff is.

its always been about synergy within the system. many quality integrateds have always sounded competitve with expensive separates. the only 'tangible' thing you are certain to give up is the ability to change or experiment with pre and power components(pre outs etc solve that problem though).