Integrated Amplifiers - Luxman vs Pass Labs

Interesting that you find Pass to be 'lean'.  From all my reading of Pass and their lower end heft, I would have thought it provides a bigger, fuller body to music; which is to my liking.

Yea, I don't personally get  the description or hear Pass to be 'lean', at all...; as someone who currently owns the XA30.8, have owned the X250.8, Bryston 4B3, Benchmark AHB2, and Modwright KWA 100SE, I would personally place the Pass on the slower rounded side compared to all of the others I mentioned.  To me the Pass adds depth and meat to the sound, and if that is what you like, like I seem to, it sounds so life-like and easy to listen to.   The most recent additions to my system to compare against the Pass amps were the AHB2 and 4B3 and I felt they both offer a more resolving and leaner presentation (still smooth though); you hear more of the recording, but I thought they also lost some of the 3d like humans are playing in your room quality I hear from the Pass.

The only recent Luxman I've heard was the C-900/M-900 combo driving the speakers I ended up purchasing and now own, at a local dealer.   I thought they sounded great, lots of detail and very smooth;  I wouldn't call either of the two Pass amps I've owned 'lean' compared to the Luxman separates.

Definitely try to listen for yourself...; worse case either a Luxman or Pass shouldn't be hard to re-sell if you grab one and end up not being happy with the purchase.

So the Bryston 4B3 was leaner than the Pass X250.8?

Is the bass more controlled in the 4B3 or is the X250.8

In my system driving Spendor D9s which are very easy to drive I found the 4B3 to offer a slightly tighter and faster bass.   I also found the Bryston to be just a tad more forward and resolving compared to the X250.8, and yes a slightly more leaner sound.  I also found the X250.8 to be slightly faster, more resolving, and a tad more lean than the XA30.8 with my speakers.   Compared to the pre NRB 4B I used to own many years ago, I was amazed how smooth and refined the 4B3 is.    I kept the Pass simply because to me it offered a better 3d front to back soundstage compared to the 4B3 or AHB2.   I think the XA30.8 beats the X250.8 by a tad in this category in my system.  I can certainly see other folks liking the sound of the these other two very fine amps more to their liking as well compared to the Pass amps.   

I never once noticed my XA250.8 leaving its 18w class A bias which is why I switched to the XA30.8 :)

I've been tempted to try the Luxman L-590AXII with my speakers but am happy with my separates and prefer the flexibility to match pre and amp.   I really wish Luxman offered the amplifier out of that integrated in a standalone power amp...

Cheers

Comparing Pass amplifiers to a couple AR tube amplifiers and then saying they sound lean doesn’t really prove the argument that Pass .8 amplifiers sound lean compared to most mainstream solid state amplifiers including Luxman, in my mind at least.

Yea, I’ve owned a PrimaLuna integrated amplifier for a while when I owned Cornwalls 3s, and an all tube Mystique preamp too to try with my solid state amps, and both had and added lots of warmth and a fuller sound than either my XA250.8 or XA30.8, but I don’t find that unexpected or that they also would not have a fuller sound than C900+M900 Luxman combo I listened to.

The class AB 150.8 is like 15 watts class A; if you want to hear the fuller sounding Pass listen to the XA.8 models.

My Classe CA300 was very smooth and powerful but I don’t remember it being as full sounding as my 30.8; I never got a chance to compare them directly. I’ve heard Sugden amps over the years that have had a nice full sound.

If my 30.8 is lean, then it would be interesting to hear how you describe the sound of say the Benchmark AHB2 :)

@ddafoe this was my result in my system comparing to other amps I’ve owned or heard. Was I shocked at the results yes I was. The 150.8 came highly recommended but my experience was not very good. The next owner felt the same. I’m not saying it’s a bad amp because it did some things very well but midrange in my system wasn’t one of them.

Hi; whether you like the sound of the Pass amp or not is certainly for you to decide :) My point was simply that blanket statements like Pass sounds lean and then mention amplifiers with tubes in them as a comparison, or that the comparison was made with their lower class A bias X.8 amps, isn’t really fair.

The X series isn't rich and full lol. I found it very clinical and it had no midrange magic.

@samzx12, so you are unequivocally saying all of the Pass X.8 series amps are not rich and full sounding?

e.g.

XA25, XA30.8, XA60.8, XA160.8, XS150, XS300

X150.8, X250.8, X260.8, X350.8, X600.8

You mentioned you had tried their cheapest class AB amp; I didn't know you have listened to the rest of the X.8 line...