I've been gifted a pair of Thiel CS2s


So, I'm starting with the speakers first. :D

They'll more than likely be sitting in an 10' x 8' x 9' (height) room, which hopefully is big enough for them.

Since, as I understand Thiels crave a lot of power,
I'm looking at amps that will double down to 4ohms.

My budget is probably about $1000 for both the amp (or integrated amp and a pre-amp.

I'm currently looking at Aragon 4004.
I'm wondering if this will be "too much" power,
as I live in a condo and it seems a number of sellers are selling the high power amps because they are downsizing.

Anyhow, what would be a good matching pre-amp for the Aragon 4004, in the $500 range?

I've also considered:
< $500 amps: Acurus, Anthem MCA2.

$500-$750:
Rotel RB-1080, PS Audio HCA2, McCormack DNA 0.5, Anthem MCA2 (here as well)

$750-$1000:
Bryston 4B (but it sounds like the ST or SST would be better, but more costly), Conrad Johnson MF-2200, McCormack DNA-125.

I've been reading a lot and learning some.

All opinions welcome.

Thanks,
Mike
mrfarnham

Showing 4 responses by newbee

I guarantee you'll hate this response. Getting those, or any for that matter, speakers set up in a room that is 10x8x9 is a major undertaking if you expect to obtain high(er) quality sound, especially a full range speaker not intended for such small space. Room acoustic's and speaker set up will be a bitch. I would think that your choice of an amp will be the least of your problems, and considering the room's size even a small amp will allow you to overdrive the room easily.

Assuming that you do not have an amp yet why not just buy a smaller integrated amp (tube or SS) which has high resale potential and play with set up and room acoustical treatments to see if the room can be used at all with these speakers. The are fine speakers but I don't think they were really intended to be used as nearfield monitors and that is what would work best in a room that size.

FWIW.
With the budget you are working I think your money would be far better spend if you focused on getting a good integrated amp. Probably a SS one.

The problem is with Thiel speakers in general, and certainly the ones I drove (not your), SS amps can make a bright sound which can be unbearable to some listeners. Class A amps can sound excellent but you can't buy good Class A amps withing you budget. I found Threshold's SA3, a 50Wt amp, outstanding with my stuff, but that was $3000 new 15 years ago and they still sell used if you can find them for $1000+.

I would try to find an integrated amp which doubles down from say 100wts per channel in 8 ohms to 200 wts per channel in 4ohms (indicates high(er) current delivery, and which has a reputation for having a tone on the warm side of neutral. If I had to compromise on that I would give up a little on the current demand but not much. With any luck you might find one within your bugdet and then be able to find a good CDP.

You are, in a way sadly, coming up against making some serious compromises with speakers that don't like compromises. Good luck............
Funny thing, Doggiehowser, I think most here do recognize that he was gifted speakers, but some of us here deal with the unvarnished truth as opposed to peddling unsupported allusions to what is possible. It would be more helpful to tell the OP what he can actually do to get him there than just to say you heard it done once by an audiophile and felt he was successful.

Here is something that is possible, not necessarily an answer. But it is what I would do if I had the problem. It is without regard to any possible intruding problems, doors, windows, necessary furniture, etc.

Place the speakers on the short wall. Place them within a foot of the side wall and a couple of feet from the back wall.

Place the listening chair so your head is about 7 feet back from the plane of the speakers.

Toe the speakers in so the axis crosses well in front of the listening chair (probably at about a 20 to 25 degree angle from the wall).

Place sound deadening materiels on the side walls that will seriously reduce FR above 1000hz (I'm arbitrary about that). Place some diffusing materiels on both the rear and front walls.

Be prepared to stuff the ports on the speakers to reduce the bass output to compensate for speaker placement (too close to walls/corners). Consider purchasing a sub woofer to place in the center of the speakers plane and cross over over killing the main speakers bass response at 200 hz +/-.

Because you are going to be sitting too close to the speakers make sure you have electronics on the warm side of neutral, especially in the mid's and highs, which will be fatiguing if not compensentated for.

A good starting point? Perhaps. Cheap? No. Easy? Definitely not! Worthwhile? Unlikely.

Now if I had to live in that room, music wise, what would I do? I'd get some monitor speakers desdigned to be used in small spaces (like the old Rogers LS3/5a) and set them up in the nearfield (4 to 6ft) treat room surfaces appropriately and enjoy. That would be, probably as good as it is going to ever get (in that room that is).

You shouldn't be so critical of those who recommended other stuff. Consider that they might just feel that the cost of using different speakers might just be less, and with better response, than using the gifted ones, especially after the money from the sale of the gifted speakers is subtracted.

Now Doggiehowser it is time to put your 'money' where your mouth is! What would you actually reccomend? :-(
Mrfarnham, a few questions:

1) What do you need in a pre-amp. Just a line stage? Remote? etc
2) What are your sources? How many do you have?
3) Sonically speaking do you have any expectations? Warm - neutral - cool?
4) Will you house all your stuff in the same location?
5) How much of your budget will be left after the amp purchase?
6) Have you ever heard your Thiels? Some folks find them a bit on the cool/analytical side of neutral.

That info should help folks make some meaningful recommendations.