This is a tough one because it doesn't really have a sound. I would say for the VR-4jr everything is so neutral. The midrange is sweet but not artificially so. The highs are strong and smooth. And the bass is extended and tight. Something that is unique about the speakers is the 3D soundstage that you can get because of the design.
For the downside at least for the VR4jr, it would be the fact that the spikes that it comes with are useless (they bend way too easy) - you have to get your own lead shot and put it in. But this is all by design. That's how he meets a $4k price point for speakers that rival higher priced ones.
Rob |
It's funny how on the posts above: the people who have actually listened to these speakers for a significant amount of time have great things to say, and the ones that have heard a demo or a VR-1 has negative connotations to throw in there.
Lesson: You don't have to post something if you don't know what you are talking about. |
Uru975,
You're right. I must have been in a bad mood yesterday because I was harsh on a couple of posts. This is the second time I am going to apologize today. I apologize.
I have a modest system, and they sound nothing like what a lot of people have posted above - fatiguing, "hi-fi", below what you'd expect for $4k, highs sounding harsh and gritty.
Here are some reviews of what of how they sound properly set up.
The Stereo Times-03/05
Positive Feedback Online-Issue 17
The Absolute Sound, Dec/Jan 2004/5 issue
EnjoytheMusic.com, Dec 2004
Audio Asylum - Dec. 2004
Rob |
Uru97,
I've noticed a lot of that. I've seen a demo that was using a transmittion line, and the manual suggests clearly that the sound will be hampered unless you bi-wire. I think these speakers will not sound near their potential unless you bi-wire, put them on spikes, and add leadshot. I've heard significant improvements to the point where, I couldn't imagine listening to it stock. I haven't heard the 4sr, but VS is a terrific speaker designer. Not everyones taste, but works for me. |
What Nrchy - your sex life?
sorry to hear that. |
I can't say that I would argue with the integration criticism. I don't think any dynamic speakers can compare to the seemless integration of electrostats and planar speakers. These speakers have their own shortcomings which is why I went with the VS. They cannot compete with bass, which is very poor in most cases (not all). Also dynamics are very important to me and I just don't hear the that with the electrostats that I've listened to (at least near the same price range). That's where individual taste comes to play.
The only speakers that I'd consider in place of the VS right now is Analysis Audio (starting at twice the price of the VS).
http://www.audiblearts.com/aa-index3.htm
They are good at bass and smooth all around. But I'd still miss the VS.
Rob |
Well that's what you get in a public forum as apposed to professional reviews. The professional reviews are all positive among different camps, not just one or two magazines that are connected to VS. So, I would put more weight on that than a public forum where anyone can chime in.
The negatives that people have mentioned (aside from the typical "they suck" type comments which most people don't give credibility to) were very small compared to all of the positives about the speakers. It comes down to taste. These speakers are "giant killers", but not everyones taste. They are my taste, but some people such as Dracule1 who is very sensitive to high frequencies may not enjoy the solid high frequency extension on them and should look elsewhere. But all and all I enjoy the music when I listen, and thats why you should audition if at all possible along with other speakers in your price range before making a decision.
Rob |
It's not that I don't like Opalchip's reasoning. It's just that it is fundamentaly wrong. His logic is confused also. And it would help if he actually listened to the speakers that he has an opinion on. Everything he mentioned was from previous posts in this thread. He mentioned nothing from actual experience.
First of all, his assumptions about audiophiles and music lovers priorities was made up out of his head. Where is it written as fact that those are the priorities?
Secondly, there isn't a speaker out there that can reveal less on bad recordings and reveal more on good recordings. You need quality recordings to and quality equipment to get closer to the music. There is no cure for bad recordings. Some speakers reveal less detail and hide some bad recordings, but then they would have to do the same on good recordings.
he says "(Complicated 4th order crossovers, rear-firing "ambience" tweeters, and ported cabinets disqualify it as far as I'm concerned.)" --> an ignorant statement that would disqualify him as anyone with a lick of sense. These all enhance the sound quality, extension, and soudstage. These speakers wouldn't sound as great as they do without them.
Did you ever think that the reason there are so many VR4jr's for sale is because so many people bought them in the first place (you can't sell what you didn't get to begin with) and are upgrading just like a lot of people on Agon. The $4k price point tends to be a middle ground not where people stop and say they've arrived. In fact, I know a couple of people that are moving up to the VR4sr's and that's why they are selling their VR4jr's.
Rob |
Opalchip: Thank you for not posting again. You are an ignorant - bombastic fool. You contradict yourself and insult everyone on Audiogon by saying that "audiophiles" put equipment above music as a priority. What else is the equipment for but to listen to music?
You supposedly are an expert speaker designer who could teach VS how to better design speakers, you supposedly play several instruments, have had extensive musical training - I suppose your a Navy Seal, fighter pilot, and astronaut also.
Your post did nothing but put down VS's design, sound, finish, and you assumed that everyone who bought them is dumping them. Then, in your next post you say VS is a "very fine speaker designer".
I could go on and on about your inconsistencies, but I think it is transparent. By the way if this post was about any other piece of equipment that I was familiar with, I'd call you on your ignorant statements just the same. This has nothing to do with VS I have no special interest in him or these speakers other than my enjoyment.
I buy CDs that I listen to only in my car, because they sound so horrible, but I like the music. We are trying to get closer to the music and bad recordings hide and distort the original music that was recorded. If your a music lover than I would think that would be important to you.
There were several criticisms that were posted above, and although I may not have noticed the same sounds from these speakers in my system, you could tell that they were legitimate and from actual experience. You say youre a music lover, but all youve talked about is the design and other physical characteristics - everything but the sound.
If you would have said that it is a very revealing speaker that won't hide bad recordings or equipment - that would have been a contribution. But, when you say that it's for gear head audiophiles and not for music lovers, then go on to explain who fits in what box - then you just sound ignorant - and do a disservice to people seeking the truth.
Rob |
Newbee,
I meant the truth as opposed to making stuff up. But that's just my opinion - I could be wrong.
I wasn't getting into a philosophical discussion about truth; I thought that was obvious, but I guess I should have been more clear.
Yes, I reveal my true self. I see no reason to hide it or to be artificial. I apologize for the ugliness of that. I feel justified with my post. You obviously feel justified in personally attacking me, and I will take accept your criticism.
Rob |
Newbee,
I was not offended at all. You may have used tact, but you did personally attack me. Your post said "You define yourself far more than you define others - your choice - ;(". It may be a passive aggressive way to attack rather than the straight, harsh attacks that I dish out. I can accept it however. I expected that after my post. I still stand by it. I appreciate your candor and I have nothing against you or Opalchip, but when someone starts making claims, I have to call them on it - especially if he is going to make some crazy claims, contradicting himself, and then running off so he would not have to answer speculation. I should be more dignified instead of ugly about it (something for me to work on). I see my own shortcomings, and I'm sure if you turned that mirror around you would see some as well. That's neither here nor there.
I think the criticism about recordings that are less than optimal has more to do with the speakers not masking the flaws than the fact that these speakers don't sound good on less than optimal recordings. Most of what I listen to is less than optimal and these speakers sound great with that. If a recording is forward sounding in the treble however, these speakers will sound forward in the treble. Given some of the criticisms above make me wonder what in their system or recording is causing these sounds that I don't hear in my systems with average recordings, and I am a long way from having perfect gear. That's all.
Rob |
Kevziek,
Thank you for the support.
Opalchip,
Get some professional help soon. I'm worried about you. I do care.
Rob |
